Heavy Metal! Part Deux - The Carbon Copy

[KRLocke]

Outstanding talent and dedication to doing things right! I wonder if you could do a Cabriolet to Coupe conversion top.

[Jonny042]

Originally Posted by Brookieslayer

Hey Patrick,

Good to see you are tracking the pelicans north of the 49th still! Hope all is well.

Hey Mr. Brookieslayer! Nice to see you're checking in from points afar!

I left your roof is in better shape than I found it, thanks for that I owe you, big time!

[Jonny042]

Originally Posted by KRLocke

Outstanding talent and dedication to doing things right! I wonder if you could do a Cabriolet to Coupe conversion top.

Anything is possible, but not always practical... the sheer size, weight, and cost of the mold would be overwhelming. Not to mention converting the door frames, etc. If you were to find a suitable donor with a sunroof a roof skin could help lighten and simplify it, though!

[mike sampsel]

Originally Posted by KRLocke

Outstanding talent and dedication to doing things right! I wonder if you could do a Cabriolet to Coupe conversion top.

Legend has it that Jonny_rotten_911, converted a VW into a 959, but the crank isn’t carbon! .

[Jonny042]

Originally Posted by mike sampsel

Legend has it that Jonny_rotten_911, converted a VW into a 959, but the crank isn’t carbon! .

Perhaps because it's titanium?

All I know is I'm expecting to get recruited by the *** any day now, since I have completely sanded off all my fingerprints as part of this carbon learning process!

[KRLocke]

^^^ did you forge it in Mount Doom?

[Jonny042]

This is something of a test... been monkeying around on IG a bit.

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[CBA]

Awesome stuff Johnny as I followed your first build and now this one. Interesting the observation on the sunroof car vs. non- sunroof car appearing to be the same. The profile should be different as the cars do have a different "bow" in them. A sunroof car has a little more "bow" in it to accommodate the sunroof to be able to open up. Always amazing the little nuisances these cars can have.

Keep up the wonderful work and thank you for bringing some new products and innovation to all of us.

[Jonny042]

Originally Posted by CBA

Awesome stuff Johnny as I followed your first build and now this one. Interesting the observation on the sunroof car vs. non- sunroof car appearing to be the same. The profile should be different as the cars do have a different "bow" in them. A sunroof car has a little more "bow" in it to accommodate the sunroof to be able to open up. Always amazing the little nuisances these cars can have.

Keep up the wonderful work and thank you for bringing some new products and innovation to all of us.

You know what? You're absolutely right! I just took another look and what you've described is true.

My (incorrect) pre-concieved notion was that if anything a sunroof car would be flatter, so I didn't look for it. I see it now, thanks for pointing it out!

That's what I love about this forum! When we share, we sll learn something...

[Brookieslayer]

Originally Posted by Jonny042

Hey Mr. Brookieslayer! Nice to see you're checking in from points afar!

I left your roof is in better shape than I found it, thanks for that I owe you, big time!

Jonny... you always leave things better than found!

BTW you owe me nothing, the time you have saved me on all knowledge you have on these cars for my restomod is invaluable!

[MST0118]

I just read this thread for second time and learned a lot. Can’t wait to see how things on the car develop. Great workmanship!! Would be cool to see some of the old classic race cars in carbon like RSRs and 935.

[Jonny042]

Originally Posted by MST0118

I just read this thread for second time and learned a lot. Can’t wait to see how things on the car develop. Great workmanship!! Would be cool to see some of the old classic race cars in carbon like RSRs and 935.

There's been a modern 935 done in bare carbon, but I'd like to see a carbon 904/6! Or even better, an S1 Lotus Elite, which is one of the few composite unibody classic cars that I know of. I can't even imagine how light one of those could be.

Thanks for the compliment on the progress so far! Things are, indeed, developing... I've been able to reinvest proceeds from the parts made so far, to continue to development (like the roof!).

Not very photogenic (yet!), but one development lately is the application of a clear "in mold" gelcoat to the outer sunroof shell. The overwhelming majority of people who want a sunroof seem to want a visible carbon part, and I'm OK with that, but it has its challenges. I don't really want to deal with spraying clearcoat on finished parts, mostly due to overspray, cleanup, sanding, polishing etc. So an in-mold coating (which can be sprayed with much less atomization and overspray) is a great solution. It also has benefits when it comes to the construction of the part, and will have an even better surface finish than the plain carbon part, and of course miles ahead of sprayed clearcoat unless it's sanded and polished.

I had a bias against gelcoat, I guess from what I know of typical fiberglass parts and some of the more "blingy" carbon bits out there that look like cloth under 1/4" of plastic. I did have the impression that it's overly heavy but the one I'm planning to use will add less than 100g to the sunroof so it's a winner.

I have a piece of tempered glass for making test samples of layups, and I started by spraying samples of gelcoat to ensure I've got the thickness to specification:





This test infusion is curing in the oven as we speak. It's not only a test of the gelcoat, but I'm also trying to reduce "ghosting" of the honeycomb core through to the surface of the part by using a slightly different layup.



Even though I did plenty of testing of cured samples in the oven, since summer is here (nicest day of the year up here!) I've been torture testing the prototype on the Rot Rod. In the sun, this gets hot enough that you can't hold your hand on it! To no ill effect, I'll add. Keep in mind this sunroof is a test prototype - I'll have pics of a vastly improved one next week!

[Jonny042]

Success!

The clear gelcoat has created by far the most impressive surface finish for a visible carbon part that I've seen. Very happy with this.



I do have one adjustment to make to the curing cycle that will improve the surface finish even more, so I'm excited to get at that!

[Jonny042]

I have great friends.

Out of the blue one of them (Thanks! You know who...) presented me with the orange car - As close as you could get to my vision for the Carbon Copy in 1:64th scale!!!

The white car I have had longer, another pal of mine (again, Thanks!!!) actually created it from a Magnus Walker #277 model to mimic Project Heavy Metal...

The projects will come and go but I'll be keeping these forever!!!

[AG81]

Nice !!!!!

[Jonny042]

Well, they say if you aren't falling, you aren't learning... or wait, that's skiing!

I'm just as committed to documenting the failures as I am the successes, but I try to keep the win/loss ratio as favorable as possible! Unfortunately this is not going to be one for the success column.

It's a bit discouraging and demoralizing, but I discovered not one, but two, (possibly 3!) failures on the latest sunroof that I pulled from the mold. All came as a bit of a shock.

I've had to temporarily pause orders for sunroofs and returned deposits to those who ordered them, while I regroup and figure this out. At minimum I to re-make the molds from my master pattern, and further sort out some process issues.

I have to say that although I know this is a disappointment and I apologize for the delay, all the people whose deposit I returned were both understanding and encouraging. Thanks, guys. Your support means a lot to me.

I'll save the longer explanation for a time in the near future, but for now I'll post a pic of the offending part. At first glance it looks "OK", maybe even "good enough". But to me, good enough, isn't.



I'm taking a bit of a break to regroup and order supplies, but I'll check back in a few days with some interesting information. Those interested in the carbon parts making process will want to stay tuned!

[RDM]

Thank you Jonny for all you put into your parts and into this forum. You've certainly earned a break.

For those needing a hit of Canadian Carbon, there is this....



Ridiculous. In the absolute best possible way.

[Jonny042]

Originally Posted by RDM

Thank you Jonny for all you put into your parts and into this forum. You've certainly earned a break.

For those needing a hit of Canadian Carbon, there is this....



Ridiculous. In the absolute best possible way.

Thanks for that! I missed it. That's a lot of carbon! Too bad there are no pics of the process, would love to see this exoskeleton they're referring to.

As for bringatrailer and the gems that pop up from time to time, this 1970 with a 3.2SS is a not only a near twin (mechanically) to Project Heavy Metal, but as close as one might get to my vision for the Carbon Copy, too. Beautiful Signal Yellow Paint, perfect stance, etc. Of course 90% of the signal yellow paint on the carbon copy will be hiding the carbon body. Sometimes it's what you know, and not show...

It's things like this that keep me going when things aren't working out (yet!).

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1970-porsche-911t-coupe-52/

[AG81]

^
Yup. Nice car. I am hoping to see my case and heads soon. Can't wait to rip along in a light weight long hood.

[Jonny042]

Originally Posted by AG81

^
Yup. Nice car. I am hoping to see my case and heads soon. Can't wait to rip along in a light weight long hood.

You're going to love it. Amazing how losing several hundred pounds changes these cars!