'72 911T running rich/ failing emissions

Chrystine Hanle · 01-04-2006, 03:51 PM

My 911 just failed inspection for emissions approaching 5000 vs. the standard 1200. Cause and solution? I've heard everything from it's burning oil to carb problems to that's just the way the old cars are. It seems to be getting worse and it's guzzling the gas! I'm in NYC if you have a referral! thx.

FrayAdjacent911 · 01-04-2006, 04:11 PM

Trying to pass emissions in a 72T? Isn't that like jumping without a parachute?

Chrystine Hanle · 01-04-2006, 04:21 PM

Thanks for the uplifting thoughts!

I'm getting a major run-around-either the girl treatment (which I freakin' don't appreciate) or no one is competent with this year of car.

If anyone can suggest cause and solution or give me a referral I'd much appreciate it.

TimT · 01-04-2006, 04:29 PM

Im not sure what you mean by

Quote:

approaching 5000 vs. the standard 1200

in any event I dont believe a 72 has to pass emissions in NY, just a safety inspection.

We are a NYS inspection station among other things. Bill can answer your questions 516.378.8769

TimT · 01-04-2006, 04:31 PM

BTW, the shop is just off the Meadowbrook Parkway in Nassau county.. and close to LIRR, and is open most saturdays

Chrystine Hanle · 01-04-2006, 04:37 PM

The HC is at 4939 PPm vs. the (Washington D.C.) standard of 1200.
The CO is at 4.71 and the CO2 is at 4.62.

I know NY doesn't have same requirements and may switch license, registration, inspection and insurance (which I imagine to be considerably more in NYC. even garaged.)

Even so, it is sucking down the gas and seems that it needs some attention.
I'm new to the intricacies of the P-car and all of it's special needs.

I will call the shop.
thx,
ch

FrayAdjacent911 · 01-04-2006, 04:56 PM

I think a decent shop that has experience with older Porsches should be able to give it a good tune up... get the carbs dialed in and work their mojo on 'em.

However, you should check, most older cars like your 72 did not have any emmissions equipment, and are grandfathered/exempted from emissions standards.

Chrystine Hanle · 01-04-2006, 05:02 PM

I had a tune up during three days of a Porsche specialists lovin' however this problem persists.
DC inspection requires emissions be checked as the car is idling. Sad, but true.

FrayAdjacent911 · 01-04-2006, 05:08 PM

Well, it can only get so good... again... because the 72 had no emissions equipment. There's no catalytic converter, no nothing.

pjv911 · pjv911's Garage

Your car should have fuel injection . Was it converted to carbs ?

Kurt Williams

Chrystine Hanle · 01-04-2006, 05:23 PM

Okay, maybe this is the girl answer, I have only had the car for 45 days...
In an effort to minimize my time/ money losses and not travel between states I took it to two Euro shops in DC after in failed for the second time and had been tuned. One said fuel injection and find a geezer that knows those old cars (initially said that one of the cylinders seemed to be down) and the next said it was burning oil and there were carb problems. His Porsche guy was booked solid and couldn't see it. I took the car and ran (fortunately no mechanic costs involved.) in short, I don't know.

Dan J · 01-04-2006, 06:16 PM

Chrystine,
Try Dorkiphus.com. They are a bunch of NoVa/DC Porsche owners that might be able to direct you to someone that's competent with your car. I guess since I could fix it (If you were in Ct) That makes me a Geezer!
Dan J

Chrystine Hanle · 01-04-2006, 07:06 PM

Dan,

Thanks for the referral.
I am now back in NYC with dead tags, failed inspection and more than just a little frustration. I'm a little concerned about an 80 mile drive w/ dead tags so I'm afraid I can't see you. Any closer ideas?
Also, what is wrong with my baby?

thx,
ch

Grady Clay · 01-04-2006, 09:23 PM

ch,

By the way, welcome to the Forum.

You will find here an incredible resource. Your first mission is to open the deck lid and post an image of your engine. What we need to see is either the original Mechanical Fuel Injection (MFI), possibly replacement carburetors or something other.

With either you will benefit greatly knowing the system and how to diagnose and resolve problems. Even if you don’t Do It Yourself (DIY) this is critical to communicating with a skilled mechanic.

A ‘72T is a wonderful 911. You are now its current caretaker. You are now responsible for its proper care and possible recovery from prior abuse or mal-treatment. This Forum can help. Your immediate goal is to know what you have and get it to pass emissions.

Best,
Grady

Jim Richards · 01-05-2006, 03:41 AM

ch, it's a bummer that DC requires an emissions inspection on your car. If you need a good DC-area shop to check out your car, I'd recommend ASG in Merrifield, VA, near the Dunn Loring Metro station (Orange line). Taylor Chapman is a great mechanic who I use when I don't have time to do it myself. ASG's phone # is 703.876.2811. If you want someone to just take a quick look at your car to see if anything is really wrong, beyond just tweaking it, I'll be glad to help. email me at jimr20165@yahoo.com . If you want to get if sorted out up in the NYC area, maybe one of the Pelican's up there can recommend a shop that's great with these early 911's. I hope it all turns out well for you. - Jim

BTW, here are some relevant FAQ's from the Wash DC DMV web site:

7. Are any vehicles exempt from the emissions test?

The only vehicles which are exempt from the emissions test process are the new vehicles purchased from a dealer located in the DC Metropolitan area.

14. What happens if I spend a lot of money on getting my emissions system repaired and my vehicle still fails?

If you spent over $450, DMV will waive your vehicle inspection as long as you spent $450 on getting your emissions repaired and nothing else. The repairs must also have been done by an emissions certified mechanic. Original receipt for repairs must be provided in order to receive a waiver.

15. Do I need my historic car inspected?

Yes, in order to get historic tags you need to have a single safety and emissions inspection. After a successful completion of the initial inspection, the vehicle does not need to be inspected again.

gtu935 · gtu935's Garage

We are in Freefort which is about 25 minutes east of Manhattan. (with light traffic) We know the older MFI cars intimately as well as weber carb'd cars. We have been in business servicing Porsche cars since 1984. I'm sure Dan J would recommend us as well.

RallyJon · 01-05-2006, 05:17 AM

Can someone explain how you can set standards for a car's emissions when that car has no emissions controls?

Is it that the standards are so basic that ANY well running car will pass? Perhaps they just check that the A/F ratio isn't too far out of whack?

gtu935 · gtu935's Garage

NY state has three different emmision tests for vehicles and each test is dependant on the year of manufacture. I think they grandfather that back 25 years. They used to check the older cars (newer than 1977) with a standing idle test 1976 cars and older did not require an emmisions test.

Sorry for the typo in my last post. We are located in Freeport not Freefort.

Chrystine Hanle · 01-05-2006, 02:44 PM

Thanks for all the 411 on the 911.
I am excited and sometimes overwhelmed by the car! (and it's potential.) And yes, Grady, you are correct about my need to builld my knowledge base (give me 6 months to learn something-I don't even know what I don' know!)

As I understand it this car has had regular servicing but not by Porsche mechanics. More service station stuff on an annual basis. I imagine everything prior to me is intact... less tires, shocks that are low level replacements. I would think that it is fuel injected if that is original.
Nice tune up mechanic made it a point to tell me as we walked the car but I was a little overwhelmed.

Once I solve this dilema I will have a new potential challenge-windows out, down to the metal repaint.
And I will definitely pool these resources.
thx again,
ch