Headlight relay question?

Stan Gillis · 08:00 AM

73.5 911T:

After installing a double headlight relay last year, along with new H4 headlights. bulb sockets and new wiring they have function perfectly. This year upon state inspection I was informed that I do have headlights. I been checking for voltage. Pin #56 on headlight switch with ignition switch on and headlight switch pulled to the second position read 12 volts. Headlight panel fuse 1-4 reads 0. Pulled relays partially out to check voltage and showed 12V. Jumpered from relays to fuse panel and headlights went on. Do you think that the relays are not functioning properly and this could be my problem? The relays do turn on the headlight, right?

Stan

86 911 Targa · 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stan Gillis

73.5 911T:

After installing a double headlight relay last year, along with new H4 headlights. bulb sockets and new wiring they have function perfectly. This year upon state inspection I was informed that I do have headlights. I been checking for voltage. Pin #56 on headlight switch with ignition switch on and headlight switch pulled to the second position read 12 volts. Headlight panel fuse 1-4 reads 0. Pulled relays partially out to check voltage and showed 12V. Jumpered from relays to fuse panel and headlights went on. Do you think that the relays are not functioning properly and this could be my problem? The relays do turn on the headlight, right?

Stan

Do you have/don't have headlights?

Gerry

ossiblue · 06:22 PM

I'd suspect the relays as they "switch on" the direct connection from the battery to the headlights.

However, because both left and right are not functioning at the same time, the problem may be at the connection from the battery to the relay block (terminal 30). Is there an inline fuse on the direct power wire to the relays? If so, check it. When you jumped a wire from the relays to the fuse block, from what terminal on the relay did you get the power? If you tapped into terminal 86, you could be getting the voltage from the headlight switch, not the direct power from the battery. If you tapped into terminal 30 (power from battery) and the lights went on, then your relays were at fault.

Stan Gillis · 10:21 AM

86 911 Targa:
No, I do not have headlights. Jumpering from battery to relay prongs I do.

Stan Gillis · 07:14 AM

Ossiblue was right on. It was both headlight relays. Thank you.

I have been working with 86 911 Targa, Gerry on this issue and with his methodical thinking, we were able to isolate all wiring and switches to be both relays. Working with Gerry has been a pleasure and and a very smart engineer. Don't know how I could have solve it myself. Gerry also advise me to install an in-line fuse from my headlight relay #58A dash lights.

I called J West Engineering to inform him that his relay I installed last year was defective. He asked was it the relay, contacts and other parts inside the relay. I told him that I was not an Electrical engineer and could not answer his question other then his relay was defective. He told me that he has sold thousands of these relays and never had an issue with both relay being defective. I told him that he can now record his first complaint and reject. He advised me to buy new relay locally. I will never buy another product from him. Here I am stranded and needed his expertise and virtually no help.

Thank God Gerry chime in and said that he would help. He is to be commended.

Thank you, Gerry and Ossiblue.

Stan

lupin..the..3rd · 09-29-2011, 02:33 PM

The J West Engineering kit includes the absolute cheapest Made in China relays he could find. They really are crap. The reason he says he's sold thousands without a problem is that likely no one bothered to contact him when they failed.

FWIW the first thing I did after buying the same kit, was to toss the two Chinese relays into the trash and replace them both with Genuine Hella.

86 911 Targa · 09-29-2011, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lupin..the..3rd

The J West Engineering kit includes the absolute cheapest Made in China relays he could find. They really are crap. The reason he says he's sold thousands without a problem is that likely no one bothered to contact him when they failed.

FWIW the first thing I did after buying the same kit, was to toss the two Chinese relays into the trash and replace them both with Genuine Hella.

Would you have the P/N for the Hella relay(s)?

Thanks,

Gerry

Stan Gillis · 09-29-2011, 02:40 PM

Sorry Gerry, but I threw them out. Thank you for asking.

Stan

lupin..the..3rd · 09-29-2011, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 86 911 Targa

Would you have the P/N for the Hella relay(s)?

Thanks,

Gerry

HL87483 - 12V, 40A, (4RA 003 510-13)

I bought mine here for $8 each: Susquehanna MotorSports - Auto Performance Product

Stan Gillis · 03:11 PM

My relays cost $17.00 each from AutoZone. They had to order them and shipped to there store. Next day delivery. It was not a stock item. Yes, the orignals were junk.

ossiblue · 09-29-2011, 06:30 PM

Stan,

Glad you got things worked out. Personally, I would never suspect failure of two relays at the same time but, apparantly, the quality is an issue. It's members like Gerry that make this such a great forum.

Stan Gillis · 09-30-2011, 04:37 AM

Yes, Gerry is the best, isolating my issue to both defective relays. They must be junk. I hope I never hear that name J West Engineering again. Still can't understand why he did not believe us and wasn't any help other then buy new ones locally. I have been in Sales and Marking management a good part of my working career and would have reprimanded someone drastically for not believing and putting the customer first.

Thanks everyone for your help.

Stan

Stan Gillis · 05:24 AM

I forgot to mention that my car has always been garaged, never driven in rain, and only driven 800 miles in the last year. But yet, the J West Engineering two relays failed.

JWest · 10-03-2011, 06:54 AM

I still have not been given enough information to confirm if both relays failed - I got that both left and right lights were off, but that just confirms one relay. I also got that some poking at the wires was done with jumpers withou understanding the circuit, which could have fried something prior to basic troubleshooting.

I am willing (and have) shipped out replacement relays free of charge with just a simple request, but if both relays that were already working failed at the same time (probability is in the range of winning the lotto twice) then I'd like to know that the relays are really the reason the headlights are not working and what part of the relay is not working (control or contacts). The original poster was not willing to divulge how he knew the relays were bad, what troubleshooting was performed, and there was "not enough time to justify" according to him - going down any troubleshooting procedures from me.

We get our relays from a trusted supplier who changes their sourced brands often. They come from all over. Hellas seem to be made anywhere now, too, so you can pay $5 for a China relay or $15 for a Hella relay made in India. If I raised the kit price to $50 to cover the price of branded relays you guys would scream, and I would have the same rate of failure.

Finally, the relay kit is sold for '74 to '89 911s, the original poster installed it on a '73.5 so I do not know if it was correctly installed as it was not designed and instructions not provided to fit the earlier cars.

Stan Gillis · 07:21 AM

J West,

I read your response and do not care to discuss this issue any further. The double relay were installed correctly and both components failed after a year. You never offered replacing the relays, what you said was for me to buy them locally. Don't try covering what was discussed. I just want other Pelican's to know how you do business and treated me as a customers. My advise is to have a better quality product and improved your customer service.