Pre Purchase Inspection 1971 911 T

Fixer · 12:05 PM

Hey race fans,

Trevor at Sportcar Digest contacted me [honored by this] to do a PPI on a 1971 911T targa. All went well with the usual pros and cons. They are mostly
concerned about the body.
I never owned a targa, I know flex is to be expected when on the lift but this seems excessive to me. The car is solid with original
floor pans, solid rocker section and the wheel houses were also solid. Panel gaps looked great but once on the lift the passenger side opened up to a full 10 mm and the door was really stuck. The driver's side panel gap at the quarter opened up to about 7.5 mm and the door opened a little easier.

They flex from new but what are some targa owner's thoughts on this amount of flex?? I have my concerns because it's been 'restored'..

Astrid now wants a targa, i'm not sold..

EDIT: pics removed

Fixer · 12:05 PM

pic of a full 1 CM panel gap while on lift..
Edit: pic removed

timmy2 · timmy2's Garage

If it goes back to normal when on the ground, it is likely ok.
My '78 flexed a lot when on the lift. Flexed back with engine and trans out.

zedsn · 06-03-2016, 03:02 PM

My old crappy TR4 convertible flexes a good amount when I just lift the front end off of the ground and it has a full frame but goes back to normal when back on level ground.

SCadaddle · 06-03-2016, 04:30 PM

The first panel gap I would inspect on any older 911 is the gap between the hood and the front fenders. If it is nice and uniform from the rear of the hood to the front then that's great. If it is nice and uniform at the rear and the front but narrower opposite the point where the upper struts mount then not so good.

Shaun @ Tru6 · 06-03-2016, 04:42 PM

they don't call them flexi-fliers for nothing.

HarryD · 06-03-2016, 05:21 PM

I have never measured the body flex in my Targa but I know that there is no issue in being able to open or close the doors. I think the flex issue is fairly minor and does not matter in ordinary use.

Fixer · 12:03 PM

Thanks for the replies. When i rode shotgun in a buddies 1970 T targa that i worked on i put my finger between the windshield frame and door frame and felt the flex as we went down the road. He has a very nice example that's solid.

This car i inspected is also solid but 6.5mm flex seems like a lot and something Porsche Engineers would not accept as OK. I'm not allowed to removed undercoating to look for body stress fractures but suspect. It's been completely repainted too which is a tell. I detected very thick body filler in the windshield frame, rear quarters and driver's door. Below the hoop on the driver's side as well. A very small bubble is forming there. But it does have potential..

The car does not have records to confirm the miles and there's no way to do a car fax, it shows a little more than 50K miles and is being advertised that way. Motor was rebuilt an the car repainted with thick filler detected in multiple areas where corrosion sets in with road use. This is not normally needed after 50K miles..

I would suspect 150K or even 250K based on this amount of body flex and other factors. Asking price is on the high side, I advised they continue their search.

RSTarga · 06-04-2016, 09:33 AM

They tend to close up as they age. There is always going to be some movement due to the type of construction. Most American convertibles exhibit cowl shake, I've never seen it on a Targa. Thats why stiff suspensions on Targas are not recommendable.

Shaun @ Tru6 · 06-04-2016, 11:04 AM

Look for plastic at the base of the A pillar. They crack there and a typical rust spot on early cars doesn't help the situation

Fixer · 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shaun @ Tru6

Look for plastic at the base of the A pillar. They crack there and a typical rust spot on early cars doesn't help the situation

Good point Shaun, I looked closely there but the car was recently 'restored' with no record of who or how it was done.

EDIT: 3/4 of the car looks decent with nice paint but the driver's side rear quarter was repaired by someone else after the fact [a real hack job] it probably was hit.

I'd sooner spend the same amount on one with dead original paint.

Shaun @ Tru6 · 06-04-2016, 12:59 PM

Then, to me, it's a "run Forest run" car. You would have no idea what's under that paint, or even what paint it is. My 73 was repainted black. When I did flares on it, I couldn't believe all the micro-specs of rust all over the rear quarters, under the paint. It now sits on a dolly.

If the car is cheap enough to budget in $15K for paint, that makes sense, but full price on an unknown restoration is a scary thing Matt.

Hey, side note, the 928 heads and block are STILL at the machine shops. unbelievable.

Fixer · 06-04-2016, 01:16 PM

Agree 100% Shaun.

928 motors are tough for machinists and there are few who will even bother with them
these days as they can make $ much easier on other engines.

Don't piss him off, wait patiently !

Shaun @ Tru6 · 06-04-2016, 01:17 PM

yeah, I'm being super nice, don't have time to build it anyway but just hired an assistant so would like to have the car on the road by the end of the summer. A boy can dream.

Fixer · 06-04-2016, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shaun @ Tru6

yeah, I'm being super nice, don't have time to build it anyway but just hired an assistant so would like to have the car on the road by the end of the summer. A boy can dream.

From what i've seen, you're doing a terrific job..It'll get there.