1977 911 won't start

[szyzygy]

Just drove it at lunchtime today, fine. Been driving it since mid-May here in New England. Fine.

Go to leave work today, won't start.

Can hear fuel pump running fine. Lights all work. Just when I turn the key all the way clockwise, no ignition sounds.

I have a voltmeter, a spare coil from a '75 that I *assume* works, my own garage/tools nearby and a professional garage nearby (where the a good chunk of employees own older Porsches and know their **** and are good guys in general)

Car is parked in a parking garage for tonight, getting a tow in there might be tough due to ceiling height.

Thoughts?

Thanks

[DRACO A5OG]

Why not jump start it, probably the starter.

Check voltage with a DVM you need 12.5 volts

[szyzygy]

Originally Posted by DRACO A5OG

Why not jump start it, probably the starter.

Check voltage with a DVM you need 12.5 volts

i did try the jump start with a co-worker, no luck. I should have mentioned that.

Hey man, long time no see.

[Bob Ashlock]

You need to determine a few things. Since I'm a 'sparky', the first thing I look for is spark. If no spark, your points gap could have closed up. Or, your CD Ignition box could have failed. Both of those are common issues.

[szyzygy]

Originally Posted by Bob Ashlock

You need to determine a few things. Since I'm a 'sparky', the first thing I look for is spark. If no spark, your points gap could have closed up. Or, your CD Ignition box could have failed. Both of those are common issues.

thanks

are those issues things that can suddenly spring up? was running fine up until it didn't
can I easily check those myself? I'm not very advanced with this stuff.
Please advise whether you think I should mess with those myself or pay a professional. I don't have a lot of spare time, and while I appreciate the DIY attitude and know-how around here, I need to balance that with being able to get to drive my car some before winter sets in here in another 2 months or so lol

[hdrockerroller]

If the starter doesn't crank at all, it could be the starter has gone bad.
These are replaceable yourself, but its a tight fit to get to the wires.

If the starter cranks, but it just doesn't start then you need to check for spark and fuel.
The suggestions already given are good ones. Search through the threads here on starting problems.

It doesn't cost anything to try to troubleshoot it yourself, you can always resort to a mechanic if you need to.

[Targalid]

A simple check is to verify whether the no start condition is fuel or spark. Your starter turns the engine? If so, with your helper to turn the key, check for spark by pulling a spark plug lead, insert a known good spark plug, ground the plug body against the engine block and crank the engine to test. Spark, yes or no? Then test fuel delivery by removing the air box cover, turn the ignition switch to run, reach inside to lift the air sensor plate and listen for the squeal of fuel injectors. No squeal, no fuel. These are simple, side of the road, tests to help you find the problem.

[szyzygy]

thanks for the replies

please keep in mind the car is parked in a parking garage at work, with security guards milling around. I let them know the car would be there overnight but I doubt they will let me work on it at all for very long before they ask me to move along, sir.

there does not appear to be any starter noise at all. I turn the key, fuel pump comes on, keep turning until ignition position, but no additional sounds.

[DRACO A5OG]

Originally Posted by szyzygy

Hey man, long time no see.

Hey Hey, Stranger, indeed long time :-)

How about push start? It appears starter froze up on you. Probably Solenoid died, it is a wear item.

[hdrockerroller]

If the starter won't crank, it could be the starter solenoid. Could be a bad ground strap. Or the starter itself.
The ground strap to the transmission has to make good contact or the starter can stop cranking.

First thing I'd do is clean the connection points on the ground strap, if that doesn't work, pull the starter and bench test it.

You may need to have it towed to your house so you can work on it.

[hdrockerroller]

Of course this all assumes your battery is up enough to crank over the car. Before pulling a starter, its much easier to have the battery tested first. Sometimes thin jumper cables won't pull enough amperage to turn the car over if the battery is super dead. See if your headlights look dim when you turn them on.

[szyzygy]

Originally Posted by DRACO A5OG

Hey Hey, Stranger, indeed long time :-)

How about push start? It appears starter froze up on you. Probably Solenoid died, it is a wear item.

can i let my car roll down the levels/ramps in the parking deck and try to start it as it's rolling?
I'll have to dust off my manuals to look into the solenoid thing. Can someone tell me if it's something a novice with a some moderately advanced tools might be able to do in a parking garage (or in his own garage)? thanks

[Walter_Middie]

What does this mean?

no ignition sounds

No starter motor? or the start motor is turning, I just can't hear the whine from the CDI?

If no starter motor, and the jump didn't work - did you leave the jumper cables hooked up for several minutes before trying to start so that the battery could re-energize? Might just be a dead battery.

[hdrockerroller]

You can let it roll down the hill in 2nd gear with clutch in, pop the clutch when it gets going and it will probably start. Then you can drive it home and work on it there. But if it doesn't start then make sure you have enough momentum left to pull it back into a parking space.

[szyzygy]

tested the battery this morning, it was over 13 so I think it's not the problem.
I will try the rolling start thing later on this evening

[DRACO A5OG]

As HDRR suggested, check the ground strap.

While you are under there, use a long screw driver or long socket extension and tap on the solenoid on the starter, that could loosen the starter up.

Yes, you can roll her forward or backward ( Like I did when my starter crapped out on me ) and pop the clutch, she should start right away then push in the clutch and place in neutral, get set and drive off, do not turn off until you are home again.

[szyzygy]

Originally Posted by DRACO A5OG

As HDRR suggested, check the ground strap.

While you are under there, use a long screw driver or long socket extension and tap on the solenoid on the starter, that could loosen the starter up.

Yes, you can roll her forward or backward ( Like I did when my starter crapped out on me ) and pop the clutch, she should start right away then push in the clutch and place in neutral, get set and drive off, do not turn off until you are home again.

I will try that trick - I assume I can get to this & see it all from getting on the ground next to my car when the other cars leave the garage?

My preferred shop is busy and can't get to my car until next week sometime. It would be left outside until they get to it. So I am tempted to try to replace the starter myself, assuming that's the issue.

I looked at a tek on here, looked pretty easy. Is this something you guys think I should just do myself in my own garage?

I guess another good thing about the shop route is that if it isn't the starter, they're pretty well equipped to identify whatever the real problem might be.

[Luccia at Pelican Parts]

If you decide to tackle the starter yourself, be sure to check out the 2 tech articles below. One for troubleshooting and one for replacing. Hope that is your issue, good luck!

Porsche 911 Starter System Troubleshooting | Pelican Parts DIY Maintenance Article
Porsche 911 Starter Installation | Pelican Parts DIY Maintenance Article

[Tarek307]

It could always be the CDI- also is the car trying to turn over? if so, try opening the lid, remove the air box cover & air filter let it get some more air- crank it while pushing the gas..worked for me before.

PS: Once you solve the issue don't forget to update the thread.

[szyzygy]

Originally Posted by Tarek307

It could always be the CDI- also is the car trying to turn over? if so, try opening the lid, remove the air box cover & air filter let it get some more air- crank it while pushing the gas..worked for me before.

PS: Once you solve the issue don't forget to update the thread.

no, it's not trying to turn over. The car does not do anything when I turn the key to the position that would normally make it start cranking. I turn the key past like 1 o'clock, hear the fuel pump start working, keep turning, no additional sounds occur.

I will update once it's fixed