Starter won't disengage

[tshih]

After the old starter stopped starting (last week) I replaced it with the smaller high torgue starter. After completing the installation I tried to start the car and it cranked (turned over several times but didn't start) upon trying again the engine appeared to fire up but the starter didn't disengage and there was a grinding noise and I switched the ignition to off. When I tried to start there was no sound as when the original starter had broken down. Several questions comes to mind and I've included 2 photos of the wiring before I switched to the new starter. The red and thick black wires were the only ones attached to the old starter and the yellow wire was not attached and the old starter worked normally until it stopped working.

Anyone has any suggestions to explain what is wrong with my installation and what is the cause of the failure?

[Nostril Cheese]

Where is the blue wire coming from?

The yellow wire should go to the spade terminal on the original solenoid (directly below red/black terminal).

A lot of times, people installed relays between the ignition switch and the solenoid. This was a band aid fix to overcome resistance due to heat and age. The real way to fix it is installing a new solenoid (or starter). That blue wire may be something like that. Follow it back and see where it goes.

[tshih]

The yellow wire was not connected and it worked fine disconnected. The blue wire was a temporary relay switch that was disconnected and the old starter was working until it also stopped disengaging after the last start. How do I check the old OEM starter to see if it is broken or the solenoid is broken but the main starter is OK?

[Nostril Cheese]

Originally Posted by tshih

The yellow wire was not connected and it worked fine disconnected. The blue wire was a temporary relay switch that was disconnected and the old starter was working until it also stopped disengaging after the last start. How do I check the old OEM starter to see if it is broken or the solenoid is broken but the main starter is OK?

Just to clarify,, Do you want to use the new gear reduction starter in the pic or the OEM one?

SO the OEM solenoid was triggered with the blue wire? Just a thought, but if that yellow wire touched the starter casing when cranking, it could keep the starter working,, Had the same problem once in a Chevy

Woulnt hurt to have it checked at an Autozone or eqiuv, Usually free

[John Rogers]

If I remember correctly there are two starters for the VW type four engine, one with a long shaft and one with a short shaft. When I put one of these high torque starters on my race car I bought it from ORW and the fellow sold me the wrong one. About 150 feet winding up in 1st gear the starter froze and the rear wheels locked and the car jumped about a foot into the air! Scared the hell out of me for sure. ORW exchanged the starter no problem.

You might have the wrong one?

[CaptRamius]

Do you have one of the Chilton type repair manuals? They have electrical wiring diagrams (albeit poor tiny and B&W print). I’m just now doing this project myself, it’s a race car so I’m not sure how much of mine is valid for a street setup, but I do remember a lead wire from my start switch goes on the same terminal as the battery as you have there, but I think the spade may be for a wire to the alternator? Someone check me on that?

[tshih]

Just a thought that occurred to me is if once the engine caught and I was slow to release the ignition key would that result in any damage or if the ignition switch was damaged and when released doesn't spring back to the "run" position (disengaged starter). The fact that the original starter was jammed in the same manner as the new starter seemed to suggest that the problem is there not due to any differences in the shaft length of the new starter. I will take the starter to an autozone to be checked.

[tshih]

Just tested the 2 starters with a remote starter and battery jumper as shown in my photos

both starters spin when triggered by remote starter. The smaller one spins counterclockwise only whereas the OEM starter can spin by hand either direction. When I installed the small unit I did plug the yellow wire ti the spade terminal next to where the thick black wire and smaller red wire was connected (terminal with 13 mm nut). The blue wire is not connected to anything (just a conduit into the engine compartment). Given this additional info any ideas come to mind?

[tshih]

What is the function of the yellow wire? is it positive 12V or negative ground?

[Dave at Pelican Parts]

In a stock system, the yellow wire gets +12V when the key is in the "start" position. That energizes the solenoid which powers the starter motor and pushes the pinion gear out to engage with the ring gear on the flywheel.

--DD

[CaptRamius]

Just a thought, did you read this tech article on how to replace your starter?

https://www.pelicanparts.com/techarticles/rice_ramblings/rice_ramblings-1.htm

[tshih]

What I don't understand is how I was able to start the car with the old starter which did not have the yellow wire connected to the spade terminal below the post that the red and black wires were attached to?

[tshih]

Well I took the OEM starter to Rudy's and Vitor in Rahway NJ to be fixed and for $165 it was refurbished and after struggling to remount the unit the connections are red and black thick wires to same post and yellow wire to the 3 lug spade connectors the car started with gusto. Now I have 2 other issues, one is a sticky throttle pedal and a vacuum leak in the intake as my cold idle is 3000 rpm with the idle adjustment screw fully closed at the base of the throttle body. I also don't feel much suction at the opening of the snorkel leading to the top of the air filter housing before passing trough the AFM (barndoor).

[tshih]

The use of superglue to glue the washer, lock washer, and 17 mm nut together before attempting to screw them onto the long upper bolt was helpful. I think the pedal cluster needs to be rebuilt with bronze bushings.