3.2 scary fast

[Buck toenges]

Finally drove the 3.2. It is scary fast. I have a 1988 911 front suspension, 3.2 hooked onto a 901 side shifter, 225 16 rears and 205 16 fronts. I spin the rears without even trying. If I could get it to lock up I know this thing would be quicker then my 993 or nsx. So how do I get the back to grip better? The front feels loose. I do have a swaybar up front. What can I do to get the front to feel more tied down?

[John Rogers]

One word: Limited-Slip

[1bad914]

Try a stickier tire.

[Dave at Pelican Parts]

You think that's scary, check out the following ad!

1970 914-6
3.6l engine, WEVO side shift 915 tranny w/LSD, twin turbo brakes, wide 17" fikse rims. Rollbar, 5 point harnesses. Many AX TTODs. Street legal. $25,000/BO. Contact Tobias Olney at toby@digitalinkwell.com or 808 640-6816. Photos and more information available here

All I could say when driving it was "Oh... My... God..."

BTW, limited-slip will help some on the traction, as will a grippier tire. Also try a wider tire--may require wider fenders...

--DD

[RustyWa]

A 914 with a 3.2....a 993 and a NSX. I'm green with envy!! I betch you don't have a '94 Jeep Cherokee Sport...ah crap, you probably do.

Sorry can't help with your original question.

[Buck toenges]

I don't have the nsx anymore but I do have:

95 993 carrera 4 cab
70 914-6 3.2
57 tbird
99 jeep wrangler
98 surburban
68 scout 800
67 jeep commando
67 cj6
53 cj3b
54 cj3b
64 fc 150
51 m37
78 scout 2
77 scout 2 plow truck
1960 fc 170
believe it or not 1918 repro fokker DVII under construction
AND ONE INCREDIBLELY TOLERENT WIFE!

[ss6]

First of all, how'd you get 225's tucked in the back? Do any fender mods? Fikse 17's all around? Got any pix??? Kinda fond of Jeeps, aren't ya ?

Couple of ideas on the traction thing, in addition to the limited slip suggestions. Since you have more rubber in back than in front, it should be small surprise you get loose up front or "push", first. Obvious suggestion is to put 225's up front. You can also adjust your traction "balance" by tweaking the front sway bar and rear spring rates. What springs are you running on the rear (I'm using 200lb)? Third suggestion is to go to a DOT legal track tire, ie the Michelin Sport Cup or the Kumho VictoRacer. You'll be street legal (and quite ready for a DE), but you'll want to avoid wet pavement, particularly standing water (duh). Not too many teener owners relish driving in the rain anyway...

I had the opposite problem, excessive oversteer, and was able to neutralize it by tightening up the front swaybar. Just gotta tweak and play. Do some searches here on "swaybar", oversteer, etc, there were a lot of discussions on this kind of thing last summer(?).

[Buck toenges]

I got factory fender flares. Running adjustable 180 lb rears. It was a bit damp last night when I got to take the beast out. I'll try your suggestions, thanks.

[sammyg2]

Yesterday I made a run to Porsche motorsports for Brad Roberts to pick up a freshly rebuilt 3.6 GT3RS motor (at least 450 hp N/A). 3 1/2 hours round trip, not bad time from the Ca. speedway to Costa Mesa/Santa Ana and back.

We stood around the back of the truck staring at the engine for a while, then Brad says " you know this thing would bolt right up in a 914".

Anyone have $50k I can borrow ?
Um, better make that $55k, I don't think a 901 would handle it very well.

[Bleyseng]

What are the front torsion bars size? I run atleast a 22mm tbar to go with the 180lb rear springs. A 21mm front bar set in the middle would also be about right. With LSD you can run a rear sway bar also. If the rear is still loose switch to 200 rear springs as the 180's are progressive the 200 are not. A good tire is nice but I can't see driving the Kumhos on the street just too sticky.
Geoff

[TGM]

Bleyseng,

I believe you have that wrong, increasing the roll stiffness either by sway bar or increased spring rates will create a worse oversteer condition ,"loose", provided no changes were made up front.

T.G.

[Bleyseng]

I was looking at his comment that the front felt "loose". He did say he was running 180's in the rear. If the front t bars are small the car is out of balance, that is why the spring combo should be 21mm up front/ 180's in the back. A 19mm or 21mm sway bar can be used.
In the back, to hook up all that hp, LSD is the way to go, just too much torque.
Also, I thought that if the front is "loose" tighten the back ie:200lb springs. If the back is "Loose" tighten the front, but everything must be balanced to begin with.

[Hawktel]

Hey Buck, the 914 is bloody cool, and I'm sorry I cannot help you on your traction problem, but You got a page on the Fokker?

Ed Hawktel

[fetus]

I'm running a 3.2 and had the same problem until I did the following.
Front
205-50-16
22 mm sway bar all the way in.
21 mm torsion bars.
Rear
245-45-16
140 lb springs
stock rear sway bar.
This is a street car and now I can jump on the gas in a corner without spinning out.
I am running a stock side shifter with no LSD.
The car was pretty scary til I did the above.
Best of luck!!!

[Buck toenges]

What do you mean all the way in on the front sway bars? And how do you do this? My front torsion bars are stock 1988 carrera 911. These would be 21 mm wouldn't they.

By the way here is a picture of the Fokker when it will be all done. Using a 6 cylinder air cooled motor. A deHaviland Gipsy queen. Not a horizontaly opposed motor though. 250 hp @ 2000 rpm. Will through an almost 8 foot prop.

[M. Hendrix]

Originally posted by Buck toenges
I don't have the nsx anymore but I do have:

believe it or not 1918 repro fokker DVII under construction

I should just stay home, and watch tv.


m

[Hawktel]

If I recall correctly didn't the fokker D V11 use a 6 cyc water cooled Benz motor. Seeing how it was 1918, I'd be suprized if it got more than 120-140 outa the plant. Yours should be a screamer!

I remember them cause of the old joke about the Texan WWI pilot that did a tour at the local High School as a History lesson. His speal was in a Texan accent and went something like "there was fookers on the left, and coming out the sune. Fookers everywhere" The teacher interupts and tried to explain that Fokkers where a type of plane in WWI. The old Texan says, "Naw, these boys was in meshershmits!" (sp?)


Ed Hawktel

[Buck toenges]

Yes the Fokker DVII had a benz engine 6 cylinder water cooled. The later ones used bmw engines that were better performing. They will cost you about 100 grand to buy one. Most guys in the U.S. will use air cooled 6 cylinder ranger engines inverted to get the engine profile similar to the original benz engines. I got ahold of a couple of DeHaviland air cooled units out of Austrailia that have larger displacements and producce higher torque and hp at lower rpm. This allows me to throw a bigger prop. A fellow named Udo Jorges in Germany is rebuilding them for me.
So if you just pick out the parts of this story as aircooled 6 cylinder and being rebuilt by a German enginemister this thread could actually apply to this forum.

[fetus]

My 22mm front sway bar is an adjustable weltmeister.
I moved the slider all the way in to produce as much understear as possible.
I'm a novice driver.
Until I get used to the car I don't want any oversteer.
The 3.2 loves throttle induced oversteer.
I was told the rear sway bar would induce over steer.
But before I put it on I still had throttle induced over steer.
With both sway bars its hard to spin it out.
It just slides side ways and its very predictable.