911/928/951-A day at Laguna Seca

[Blackfoot]

an '84 911 carrera, '87 928 s4 5-spd and '88 951 turbo s are raced at laguna seca racetrack on a nice warm & dry summer day. all cars are dead stock, use standard "non-sports package" suspension and use the same brand and model of tires. the race duration is 10 laps. the three drivers have the same skill level and equal amount of track experience.

which car comes out on top at the end of the race and why? is it a close race all around, do two run noticably faster or does one clearly come out ahead?

[Jack Olsen]

The 911 guy wins the race, and has the most fun. The 951 guy complains about his tires, and tries to convince the Carrera driver that his car's weight distribution is better. The 928 guy has the most comfortable drive home.

Eventually, the 951 guy sells his rattling bucket of bolts and buys a 1973 Carrera RS with the accumulated interest from the bank account he put the money he saved by buying a 951 in the first place. Weeks later, the 928 guy sell his car and puts a downpayment on a 1997 C4S.

The next time out at Laguna Seca, the three 911 variants have a great time driving some of the best sportscars ever made.

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Jack Olsen
1973 911 T (3.6) sunroof coupe

[1.2gees]

Haha.

That's pretty funny Jack...

I'd think that the 944 turbo S would come first, followed by the 911, and the 928.

However I'd think that after so much dough spent on maintenance, insurance, and purchase price, the other two owners would end up buying 944 turbos!

Jack, you know I like the early 911s, but a stock 73 RS wouldn't keep up with a stock turbo S, and THAT part of my post is serious, also for a hell of a lot less $$$!!!

BTW, nice topic blackfoot...
Ahmet

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It's all the driver...

[monteness]

It would be a shame to "wreck" those two Variant 911s around the track when they slide into a barrier from the OIL LEAK from the first 911.

Bret

[Obin Robinson]

of all those cars mentioned, the 951 has the best power to weight ratio and the best weight distribution.

the last time i went to the race track to watch some friends do a D.E... the 944 turbo guys could only be passed by a few of the 993s and 996s.

they may have similar power or acceleration in the straights, but the 951 has much better balance in the chicanes.

obin

[wolfrpi]

Actually guys...the 928 wins!. Take this with a grain of salt though...there's a program called "cartest" available over the internet. The program allows you to set up just about anycar the way you want it and race it against other cars in a variety of ways.

Using this program, I found a stock 86 Carrera, a stock 86 951 (bumped up horsepower though to "S" levels, and a stock 88 928 S4. With all cars, I optimized the lauch method before the start of the race.

I raced all three around the computer's simulated version of Laguna Seca...and guess what? The 911 is the dog of the three! No offense though as I love 911s to and it is just a matter of setting one up properly in order to get it to really fly. Anyway, the S4 beats the 951 S by about .3 seconds and the 911 by about 3.7 seconds. The results may change if I knew what the proper torque number for the 951 S was though. End of discussion...yeah right

BTW the Carrera RS might win if I knew the proper hp, tq, and weight numbers. With 220 hp (guess), 200 tq, and 2800 lb with driver, my rough calculations have it winning by .1 sec.

Erick

[This message has been edited by wolfrpi (edited 01-06-2001).]

[Blackfoot]

torque for the turbo s is identical to turbo: 240-243 ft lbs. only the hp is bumped up from 217-220 to 247-250.

[RealRideRacing]

Guys,
Here's a good way to settle your questions.

This is taken from the POC Time Trial at Laguna Seca August 1999. These are stock class cars driven by competent drivers, some are even Club Racers (Leonard for example was my very first POC driving instructor and is also a formidable Club Racer).

J-IMPROVED CLASS (stock engine, some minor suspension mods allowed):
Brent Harnish: Car #255 1:50.007 '87 944T
Leonard Schenkel: Car 226 1:52:361 '87 911

K-PRODUCTION CLASS (minor engine mods like header, chips, intake mods, suspension is allowed significant mods):
Mike Avitt: Car 452 1:54:658 '86 928

I couldn't get the exact years of cars you were referring to but that should give you a close enough approximation of the times.
If I were to race a stock class car at Laguna Seca, the 944 Turbo would be my first choice. The 911 would just be a blast to drive, and the 928 would surprise me with so much power and so much comfort.

Regards,
David
REALRIDE RACING www.RealRide.com/racing
(visit our Discussion Board for Racing Enthusiasts)