Early highbeam multifunction switch

[mikepellegrini]

My 83 NA, the highbeams only work when I hold the turn signal switch all the way back (towards you). You let go of the switch and the lights go off (as well as the blue light in the instrument cluster). Click the switch again and the low beams come on normally.

I was taking the instrument cluster apart to replace the speedometer cable and shorted out 2 contacts on the top left (long skinny) plug to the multifunction switch - which I think may go to the highbeam switch. Did shorting out the contacts fuse something in the switch, maybe?

All 4 headlight fuses (1-4) are good - I checked for continuity. Or is there some relay that may have been damaged? The spot for relay 8 (additional highbeams) is empty.

Anyone ever have this happen?

Edit: Looking at the switch now, it looks like the upper left plug goes to the windshield wipers, not the turn signal. Checked; fuse blown. Replaced, now wipers work again.

Anyone ever take one of these switches apart?

[v2rocket_aka944]

the high beams should "click" and lock on when you pull the stalk all the way - you should not have to hold the stalk the whole time. there's a lot of moving parts in there...the high beam stalk actually has a hook that actuates the light switch which is part of the wiper stalk assembly...

[mikepellegrini]

The early one? I know the late switch moves and stays in position when you put the highbeams on, but I thought the early switch, you just pull back and it clicks and you let go, and it returns to the forward position - and the highbeams stay on.

It's been so long since I've driven the car at night, I don't really remember.

I see what you mean about the actual switch being in the wiper switch assembly. I recall a post coming out of that fitting into a hole in the turn signal assembly. That actuates the highbeams?

I'll have to take it apart again.

[v2rocket_aka944]

On mine I have to pull/click to go from low to high, or high to low. There's a spring on the assembly that still makes you have to pull/click.

[mikepellegrini]

I took it apart. I see what you mean. Thanks.

Looking at pictures of new ones, I see there's a washer on a spring on the windshield wiper switch. Looks like the washer pushes against the contacts on the turnsignal switch. Mine, the washer is missing. Apparently only made contact when I pulled the switch all the way back.

Pelican and 944Online are out of stock, as are most other places, including eBay. Luckily, I found a new one at DR911. Never heard of them before but there're not far from where I live. Ordered it.

[Monkey Wrench]

not as familiar with some with this circuit but Im imagining this might be a problemwith the high beam relay.

if you just think how a pen works , you click the button it goes out, click it again it goes back in. It might be that the relay works similar to this and it failed, maybe the contacts welded. I don't know where it would be located but it would probably feed the high and low beam wires to the headlights. some cars use a foot switch so I guess one could convert to that if they couldn't source the signal switch or if it were really expensive. I like that better as on the highway my left foot isn't that busy usually so I can brace it ready for low beam when I'm suddenly pointed at some other car. that way I'm not interrupting my hands. some may prefer one or the other.

you might be able to sort of reverse engineer the event. you know what wires did the welding operation so following those may lead to the problem , in the switch or the high low beam relay.

your high beams take a lot of amps, thick wire , the switch that powers them on or off needs to be able to withstand that amount of amps. I think it' usually done in a way that the high amp circuit is from the battery to the high low relay then to the lights. the wire that goes to the signal light arm is likely a lower amp circuit so that the contacts and wiring dont need to be huge. it likely operates a relay. it may just supply 12V to click the relay into a high or low position.

a pen or a "push on push off" switch both use a similar mechanical arrangement, not such a far fetch to think maybe the high low beam relay has such a mechanical arrangement inside it. If the actual switching was done in the switch arm itself then it would need big thick wires to carry the amps for your high and low beams. I think that's unlikely so I think there is a relay you haven't found yet.

that arm switch could have two wires running it, then two relays one for high beam and the other for low beam and then maybe it would feed 12 V to the coil of one or the other relay. whichever receives the 12V turns on the lights.

above there was mention of a change so maybe they went from two relays to one that gets its first pulse, low beams, a second pulse , high beams, etc.. this can e done with only one wire by way of a special relay that has the mechanics similar to a pen that clicks to open.


there could be a bit more complexity as the headlights lift up and there is some switching in and around that. you probably can't turn the lights on without them being lifted, so maybe there is a contact there that's involved to prevent that situation. the operation of the headlights was described in another thread.

my guess is it's a bad rely and the column switch isn't the issue but its just a stab in the dark.

if you can get into a situation where you can hear the relay then that might help find it. hear any click when they turn on or off? follow the sound? look at the high amp wires feeding the headlights, can you physically follow them back to their source? if the system uses two simple relays maybe you can swap them to troubleshoot if they are the same part?

something is off here, If the origin of the issue was arcing, then the cause is a missing washer? , that doesn't add up in my mind but maybe the welding operation was unrelated?

i think in my 66 volvo it has a relay for high low that is operated by a foot switch but it also has a feature where pulling the signal light turns on the high beams. I think either feeds the relay coil which latches and turns on the lights. Im not sure if the foot switch uses the push on push of device or the relay itself. the floor switch may have such an arrangement ( like in a pen) but I dont think the column switch has that mechanical arrangement built in.



the power normally comes from the relay but the switch on the column activates the coil in the relay if you pull it. I think this is because this flashing ability is a safety feature similar to a horn, it needs to still work with the lights turned off.

I dont think that in normal operation they would run all the amps for your headlights through that column switch.

we never use parking lights here but in Europe its common that people leave parking lights on when parked. often with two wheels on the sidewalk. Here we have wide roads no one uses parking lights for parking. our cars were made to pass safety inspections and some requirements might be different country to country. my 66 Volvo doesn't even have emergency flashers. there was an option kit for adding that. 4 way flashers often share a similar relay to signal lights. In my old ford van I can swap them if the signals have issues. It's just a common 3 pin flasher relay.

I seem to remember when working on my old volvo I found out that it had the pull switch on the signal light lever but it was never used so I connected it and installed a relay for that. I think this wasn't required here so they never used that part of the switch originally. I dont think it was needed to pass inspection in this country. maybe it is now. some others with odd volvos use that switch to turn on the overdrive, mine has a switch on the other side of the column for that but that's a rare switch because most didn't have the overdrive. its kind of fun and different as the overdrive can be operated to change gearing on the highway without touching the shifter. it functions as a 5th gear but with its own electric clutch. some racers make it work in 3rd. so they have a gear between 3 and 4..
I got a busted overdrive from someone that made it work in any gear then bumped the switch and broke the overdrive casting right in half.

[Monkey Wrench]

Sorry for the long wordy replies
I might be off in some if it And haven’t looked at a schematic but here’s what I think ;

I thought about this riddle more ;

I think you have 3 circuits here
1 headlight switch That turns on supply power to the headlight relay, then your lights go on and they will go to either high or low beam whichever they were left in last.

The reason they go to where they were left is because that’s how the relay was left and until it gets a pulse from you pulling the switch it will remain like that it’s mechanically in that position

2 the switch on your column, you pull that and provided your lights are I on it will switch the Special relay to high beam low beam high beam low beam Etc it’s changing the set of contacts being fed power each time it gets a pulse the relay has two positions .

3 when you pull that switch it Also powers a relay used just for “flashing” another driver
This circuit is not running your headlights not really , it’s only function is to turn them on for a moment when you release they go out that will be run off it’s own relay and that relay will always be supplied power even when your headlights are turned off

Circuit 3 works and so does your column switch


Your relay isn’t switching to high beam and low beam I suspect that relay has an issue

I do not think that column switch is bad because you proved it works because it will turn on the flash function

I’d want to know what’s happening at the high low relay and I think I’d try to locate that see if it has power when the lights are on see if it gets a momentary pulse when you pull the column switch it should be clicking and powering either the low or high beam circuit alternately

I might be off in some if this but that’s how I see the issue

One thing that did not make sense how quickly can the headlights open ? Does pulling the flash function also open them ? It must

I think there are some contacts around the motor and the lights need to open to be seen

Maybe when the lights get power it causes the motor to move so then they would just open and close when you released that flash function

[944 Ecology]

Originally Posted by Monkey Wrench

Sorry for the long wordy replies
I might be off in some if it And haven’t looked at a schematic but here’s what I think ;

I thought about this riddle more ;

I think you have 3 circuits here
1 headlight switch That turns on supply power to the headlight relay, then your lights go on and they will go to either high or low beam whichever they were left in last.

The reason they go to where they were left is because that’s how the relay was left and until it gets a pulse from you pulling the switch it will remain like that it’s mechanically in that position

2 the switch on your column, you pull that and provided your lights are I on it will switch the Special relay to high beam low beam high beam low beam Etc it’s changing the set of contacts being fed power each time it gets a pulse the relay has two positions .

3 when you pull that switch it Also powers a relay used just for “flashing” another driver
This circuit is not running your headlights not really , it’s only function is to turn them on for a moment when you release they go out that will be run off it’s own relay and that relay will always be supplied power even when your headlights are turned off

Circuit 3 works and so does your column switch


Your relay isn’t switching to high beam and low beam I suspect that relay has an issue

I do not think that column switch is bad because you proved it works because it will turn on the flash function

I’d want to know what’s happening at the high low relay and I think I’d try to locate that see if it has power when the lights are on see if it gets a momentary pulse when you pull the column switch it should be clicking and powering either the low or high beam circuit alternately

I might be off in some if this but that’s how I see the issue

One thing that did not make sense how quickly can the headlights open ? Does pulling the flash function also open them ? It must

I think there are some contacts around the motor and the lights need to open to be seen

Maybe when the lights get power it causes the motor to move so then they would just open and close when you released that flash function

If you look at the wiring diagram, no relay involved in high beam/low beam switching. All handled inside the switch.

Pelican Parts has graciously provided wiring diagrams for the early and later 944s, so take some time to study them...

[Monkey Wrench]

surprised there wouldn't be a relay. I guess you could add them to take the load off the switch contacts if they tend to burn up. then just use the same power wire to run the coil of the relay instead of the actual lights. and then the high amp contacts could move there. If that's a common issue. the switch would function the same but the contacts would only run the coil of the contactor and very little load then, but some rewiring perhaps unnecessary unless this is an issue. no point making mods if its not an issue.

Its quite a load so there will be an arc when the contacts open. yes I need to work on navigating the site, i think I was in there before. I have the schematic on my drive at home but its a bit hard to view from where I am now. If the schematic shows no relay , my apologies for leading the thread a little off kilter. I figured he had the switch function so questioned if he needed to replace that. I was wrong before, once at least ;-)

[Project560]

Mike,

Do you have any pictures of the hi beam assembly and the other parts of the wiper stalk mechanism? I accidently disassembled the switch instead of unplugging it and I need to make sure I am putting it together properly. There is a plastic wishbone and a spring that I am not sure where they go. Any help would be great. It worked before I touched it so hopefully I can get it to work again. Thanks.