87 Porsche 944 help wanted

[devin3200]

Help... I just purchased a 87 944. This is a dream car for me but in that past few days I'm not getting any sleep :. Here is the story. When I went to purchase it. There was a horrible whining noise coming from the engine. Sounded to me like the water pump bearing. So I said ok.. I brought it home. Pulled the pump (replaced it) along with the belts. Funny I never moved the crank position only the balance shaft pulleys. after reassembling I tried to stat it. The same noise came back. So I readjusted the belts eased back the tensioner a hair. Now. Tried starting. one pop than nothing. Realigned the balance pulleys.. ok here we go. No the engine turns but no fire. feels like no compression. Usually you get a whoop whoap from the pistons. but not here. I hear a faint pop (explosion), but very faint. Could my timing just be off that bad. or something worse? HELPPPPPPP Thanks

[944 Ecology]

Start at the beginning...

1) Set crankshaft to TDC on #1 by hand

2) Remove all the belts except the timing belt.

3) Check that camshaft sprocket is at TDC mark. Correct if necessary.

4) Adjust the timing belt tension using the factory tool.

It should now start and run... If it doesn't, you may have bent valves. Do a leakdown test to verify.

p.s. Clarks-garage.com has a comprehensive set of diagnostics and procedures...

[devin3200]

Thanks 944 ecology, can you tell me if the TDC on #1 is that marked near the crankshaft pulley ( like a chevy). or will i have to check it from the site hole in the back?

[mazdaverx7]

There is no visible mark. You need to check that the letters OT are visible from the inspection hole in the top of the bellhousing. There will also be a line that will line up with a protrusion in the bellhousing when OT is displayed.

It sounds to me like you may have bent some valves. I hope not though, as I just went through this on an 86 that I bought with bent valves.

If you hear a whine, I would have first started by removing the power steering belt and then the alternator/a/c belt. One of those bearings may be the cause. The balance shaft belt can make some noise as well. Nothing can really be done about that.

Make sure you get a flywheel lock when doing the belts this time. It will ensure that the engine stays at top dead center once there.

[944 Ecology]

Locating and Setting Engine to Top Dead Center (TDC), Cylinder 1

[devin3200]

OK Sports Fans. I have gone back to the beginning of my timing belt change. Thanks to all of folk who helped. I was able to find TDC at flywheel. Set every roller to TDC, reset belts. The moment of truth still will not start .. No fire. so the next thing I quess will be doing a valve job. Now can anyone tell me if this is just a single valve that has gone rouge or will I have to replace all. I would just replace them all if im that far in. But what do you think. Help again. Thanks

[nynor]

when my timing belt let go, it was 7 out of 8 valves.

[mazdaverx7]

When I bought my 86, it had 8 bent valves...

Best of luck on your endeavor. Take the head to a reputable machine shop and replace the valves and valve guide seals and have them mill the head. The only down side to all of this is that its not a cheap job by any means. When it was all said and done, I had over $1500 into the top end and front of engine service on my 86.

[devin3200]

Thanks again for the input.. This will be a work in progress.

[devin3200]

Ok, i've got down to the valves, i havent pulled the head yet. but i was wondering . with this issue could there be any chance that the injectors are faulty and not a bent valve.
also does anyone know it the spring cap guides( if thats what they are called). Can those go back or become damaged causing the cam not to strike it fully?

[nynor]

if you have the cam tower off, sometimes you can see that some of the valves are lower than the others. the low ones are certainly bent.

[devin3200]

Thanks Nynor, That was what I was thinking. so it seems that at least one on my quest will need to be replaced. Ouch. I'm so tired.. But I mess push on to bring this beauty back to life. Thanks again.

[nynor]

once you get the head off, you can turn the head so that the combustion chambers are up and put isopropyl alcohol in the chambers and see which of the valves leak. i am betting it is more than one. probably most of them, sorry to say.

can you provide a picture?

good luck.

[devin3200]

Ok, with the engine back together for the time being. i'm getting a faint explosion coming from the engine like its lacking spark. Could this still mean a bad valve? I did the leak down test all of the valves seemed to have some leakage, but none more than the number 3 . So i would suspect that one to be bad. But would'nt it still fire and run ( but rough)? Just asking?

[nynor]

did you do a compression check? if so, what are the numbers?

without a lot more information, we are not going to be able to help you.

pictures of TDC at the flywheel and the camshaft. compression numbers. method of tensioning the timing belt. etc.

[devin3200]

Ok folks, I have pulled my head. I found 4 exhaust valves and one intake valve bent (OUCH). I've inspected the head for straightness. Measures fine. Question: would it or should it be right practice to reseal the valves that are not damaged or just leave them be? Plus if the head is good, should i still have it mill'd ?

[mytrplseven]

WYIT: While You're In There......Take the time to do it right. Do a total head rebuild while the head's off. Since the front's exposed, also check for oil seal leakage, belt rollers spinning too much (ready to replacement) and you'll have it all behind you.

[devin3200]

Ok Folks Thanks for all of your help with my previous issue in regards to my car not starting, Yes the Valves where bent. 5 out of 8.. Of Course the expensive ones. (exhaust valves). Car is all put back together but now I'm almost back to square one. Back to the water pump. Can anyone speak to the proper alignment for installing the water pump? Here is what I have. When tightening the pump, the pump pulley tightens and will not spin freely. You have to back off the bolts to get it to spin freely. but than you run the risk of the pump leaking (which is where I am now). It the specific specs or a trick to get the pump snug to not leak and so it will not loosen up while engine is on? and help or suggestions?
Problem two: I was out driving the car yesterday and I rode around for about 20 mins. When heading back. The car just stopped. I had to jump it, it ran a few more mins to get it home, than died again. Fun talking to my wife and she suggested that the alternator my be back. Could she be right? I never thought about it before, since back when I had the valve issue. I ran the battery down trying to get the thing to start. Any suggestions?

[nynor]

um.... can you be more specific about 'tightening the water pump'?

and how did you drive it with pump leaking or not snug?

[devin3200]

I drove the car for about 20 mins, when I finally got home I was checking why my coolant level was so low. I happened to look under the car and noticed the coolant streaming down. I remembered that when I replaced the pump that when I tightened the bolts the pulley would not turn freely by hand. so I loosened a bit. Spins freely, but I wasn't comfortable with if it was on securely and believing I would have to recheck. Also I noticed that when I pulled the coolant hose at the top of the head. It was dry. So that lead me to believe that the pump is not circulation the coolant.