New to 928 - soon to buy?

[gjmascoli]

Gents-
I'm warming to the idea of a 928 that I can put some miles on as a warm weather daily driver. I consider myself pretty strong technically and have been successful putting a 1990 BMW 525i back on the road (175k miles) as well as all maintenance on 1999 MB C280. Well in my wheelhouse of capability:
- anything suspension / brakes
- top end engine work, heads off, valve train rebuilds, etc.
- all other mechanicals and auxiliary systems - timing belts, water pumps, etc.
- basic electrical
- clutch replacement

Wrenchin' is my hobby, so I'm not looking for a hand's off pretty baby. I want the fun to drive but satisfaction of keeping her on the road.

Before I dive in:
- there's no Bentley for 928, any other manuals you guys work from?
- anything a DIY guy should be afraid of? My automotive motto is "Be fearless"
- availability of parts? How are prices?
- forum view regarding price range for a 4.6L or 5.0L 5-spd with good paint and interior in driving condition?

Any advise you want to offer??

[Maleficio]

How much can you afford to spend on a car purchase? And how much can you afford to spend after you've bought the car?

[gjmascoli]

Well-
I bought the '90BMW with 175k, and a hundred pesky problems plus a trashed suspension and a major oil leak. Body and interior clean. I overpaid at $1500 and I put $1500 in parts. Now she's my DD and all sorted out. The labor would have easily been another $6-8k.

To answer the question, I can pay for labor but that misses the whole point for me. Since the 928 would be my fun car, I'm willing to put reasonably priced parts (similar to BMW and MB OEM pricing?) and let her sit if I don't have the cash on hand. Three other cars in the house, not a problem. But I won't pay for labor. So one important question - is this a car for the DIYer?

I see an '83 928S 5-spd in my area listed for $4300, but looking through this forum, the general theme seems to be that if the exterior and interior were ratty, this is a $900-$1500 vehicle, if she's nice in and out, maybe $3000?

Also seems like some guys pick up really nice ones for less than $2000. A bunch of sold 928s on ebay, they seem to be going in the $3000 range for the '83-'86 years.

So, trying to see if that's reasonable pricewise, but also want the satisfaction of doing the maintenance.

[Maleficio]

Yes, the 928 is a DIYer. No one in here pays for labor. I've been lucky enough to find every part I've needed on eBay for dirt cheap.

$4500 may be high, but it is a five speed, and those always fetch higher prices.

[gjmascoli]

Yeah-
I figured this crowd was much more like the e34 (BMW) forums as compared to the w202 (MB). For e34, it is about 85% DIYers. For the w202, about 50% DIYers.

Any good manuals out there. I know I can buy the OEM Porsche set for $700!! How 'bout CD-ROMS or other?

[19psi]

There's nothing mysterious about maintaining and repairing these cars. Most of the guys that claim that "have a mechanic".
There are also many good sources for new parts and the cost for just about anything is reasonable. They won't be Chevy Cavalier cheap but they will be right on par with any modern car such a Camry.

As far as car prices...I live in the Chicagoland area and $3,000 is going to get you a high mileage project car. Less than $3,000 and the odds of you getting it home without a flatbed are next to zero. You can usually get them drivable for a reasonable amount but unless you invest in an interior, bodywork and new paint (big co$t), ya sorta look like a poser.

In my area a NICE low mileage (less than 60K) 78 to 86 is going to run from $6K to low teens.
Hard to touch an 86.5 on up for under $10K. Keep in mind I'm talking about cars that have been well maintained, garaged kept their entire life, stored winters, have perfect bodies and interiors void of cracked dashes and trashed seats.

[Larry Bud]

If you need the manual, how about a free down load at Cannell??? they have a scan of the entire set, just down load to the lap top or pick up a cheap memorey stick. I down loaded it then while impressing the Boss with a Saturday work day, printed all 2500+ pages out on the company's high speed printers, followed up with a free complentary binders, heavy duty three hole punch and even printed out covers for the binders-all good stuff-did the same for my xke

Cheap is good, FREE IS BETTER!!!!!

[dtool242]

I bought a manual on CDROM off ebay for about $30. Used that and the help of some people on the forum here to rebuild my transmission. Sure a hard copy version would be nice to have, but $700 is a lot to spend for something like that.

[Danglerb]

Don't buy the Ebay manuals, the seller steals the data from one of our guys who puts a LOT of time and effort into the CD sets. Download it free if you don't believe in paying for other people work, but don't pay anybody on ebay for it.

The good set of CD's, which I think you can get cheap enough from Home - 928's R Us Porsche Parts Store includes line drawings that most local copy/print places can print in large format.

Four levels of parts prices, buy a donor car, buy parts from somebody else with a donor car, buy used parts from one of the 928 dismantlers like 928 International |Porsche 928 Parts | New, Used and Rebuilt , new parts from one of the 928 vendors (oops fifth level parts from dealers). It is always a good idea to ask here before buying parts if you have any questions about the part or the best vendor.

$5k to $10k should buy a good 5 spd early 928, but don't get hung up on price, purchase price will soon fade compared to ownership (cost and pleasure). What you need to do is have some cash ready and jump on the first NICE 928 that suits you, pretty much regardless of how good or bad of a deal it is unless the deal totally sucks and won't negotiate, then just wait for it to drop.

[gjmascoli]

Awright, now we're talkin'! Great input from everyone. My ears (and eyes) are open so keep it coming if you want, I'm reading.

I have to laugh at "sorta look like a poser"! To me a poser is the guy who buys the garage queen, can't find the dipstick, and pays top dollar for everything at the dealer. I'd rather be the guy with the ratty car but a rebuilt engine that I did. But I know the comment was not made to offend and I appreciate all the input.

Thanks for the leads on the manual and the encouragement regarding parts availability.

Now....should I mention any this to wife?

[924CarreraGTP]

Go back a couple of pages on the Pelican 928 forum and look for a post called "repair manual". It's just what the doctor ordered.

[Larry Bud]

Never...ever... mention anything at all to the wife. Just bad form and can cost a signifiacnt amount of money. I rent a 4000 square foot warehouse to store and work on my cars and when my wife of 27 years found out, it cost me a 1.5 ct diamond pendant. She didn't care about the cars, the tools or even the shop, it was just i spent a lot of my money without spending a similar amount on her (but as long as she dosen't know what all the old cars are worth, I think I'm safe-I got off cheap)

Still like Cannells web site for manuals. It complied by people who bought the original factory manuals and scanned them. if you read the beginning they warn you about people who down load their content and resell.

[gjmascoli]

Mr. Melman, that is hilarious!

Also, just finished downloading all 7 volumes off Cannell. Thanks for that lead! Wife caught me downloading while I was supposed to be watching a movie with the kids.

Said she "you're not buying another car" I laughed. She doesn't have much of a sense of humor.......I'll buy the car when the right one comes along!

[Larry Bud]

Wait until she find 12 cars she had no idea you owned....

[lfausty]

we will all be waiting for those first pics of your purchase and much continued help while resurecting and not the wifes post of a head stone born on died on may he R.I.P

[Danglerb]

Originally Posted by Larry Bud

Still like Cannells web site for manuals. It complied by people who bought the original factory manuals and scanned them. if you read the beginning they warn you about people who down load their content and resell.

Cannells has manuals I think for many makes, but regarding the 928 they scanned a set of microfiche manuals originally, but last I heard they had copies of the CD set that Jim Morehouse spent a few years collecting and scanning. The way to tell the difference is that his set isn't just scanned, it has the text OCRed and indexed for searching, and his diagrams and line drawings are fuzzy microfiche, but cleaned up so they can be printed and read in larger formats.

I forget how many CDs are in Jim's set, thinking its two for the base set with either one or three more that contain all the manual suppliments and specialized manuals.

That said, unless your a Porsche line mechanic with a full set of Porsche tools, you are going to need help from the support forum here and on Rennlist for details on specific repairs.

[gjmascoli]

I hear ya regarding not being a Porsche line mechanic. Similar can be said for the BMW and MB work I do....I live and die by the help that comes from the technical forum. Much of the fun working on these vehicles is the feeling that you belong to a community; it really defines what it means to be an "enthusiast".

Looking forward to being part of this.

[harborman]

There were a couple nice 928's here lately. One on NW side of Chicago looked real clean and price was I think $9K and another was posted here for about the same. If you can get one like these two, you will be ahead of the game. You can't beat a well maintained low mileage, garage kept car. But if you want to be in the garage, than a lower priced one will do that for you in most cases. Also, what may seem cheap at first may be real expensive in the long run. I live across the big lake and there is one other 928 here owned by the local foreign mechanic shop. He charges $110/hr.

[gjmascoli]

Just finished reading gbgastowers story of resurrecting his 928. There's an '83 928S with a 5spd in the classified section here on pelican. Its in Greenwich, about 1 hour from me. PM's the guy a couple times but no response. May give him a call.....

[milkman383]

I just did kinda what you're looking at, and here's some things I went into this knowing, and so far I think I did well.

First off, decide what kinda stuff you want to fix, and what you can live without, what is your tolerance for getting a non-running car on day one and work out the mechanical bugs from there? If you're good at doing paint/body/interior revamp (or don't care) then look for a car that's weak in those areas and strong in others. Then you can find a cheap car and plop the cash into making it right. Any S3 that's "all there" mostly works and can be driven home could be $5k and worth every penny. That same car with a ratted out interior might be $2.5k, and that same car with ratted out interior, needs a timing belt, no AC, and the seat motors doesn't work might be $1.5k.

The 86.5 928S I just bought is my 9th car under licence and insurance (most are really cool beaters), and it's my new toy, I'm driving it everywhere right now. I've got a short list of stuff that's wrong, but none of that is keeping me from putting 600 miles on it this weekend.

Good luck, be patient!!! Enjoy!