Shifting with the market

[Unobtanium-inc]

Since we mainly deal in project cars that's the slice of the market I'm talking about here. The 9 cars have grown very cold, but 356's are picking up again. Anyone else notice anything like this?

We've seen these cycles before, you should shift with what the public wants.

---Adam

[techweenie]

What I've seen is a reluctance to tackle projects in general. But yes, 356 projects (running/driving needing minor work) seem to be in relatively higher demand.

[Unobtanium-inc]

Originally Posted by techweenie

What I've seen is a reluctance to tackle projects in general. But yes, 356 projects (running/driving needing minor work) seem to be in relatively higher demand.

I know a lot of my buyers have restoration fatigue after the last run-up of 911 prices. All the shop were over-booked so everything took twice as long and cost twice as much.

The fact that the Euro is flat isn't helping either. Hope they figure out Brexit soon.

---Adam

[techweenie]

Good point. If the restoration takes 18 months, will the market slump between now and then? Even if someone isn't restoring for a flip, nobody wants to end up far outside the value envelope.

[Unobtanium-inc]

Prices of cars might come down, but prices for parts and restoration will continue to rise, good parts and good restoration that is.

---Adam

[techweenie]

Originally Posted by Unobtanium-inc

Prices of cars might come down, but prices for parts and restoration will continue to rise, good parts and good restoration that is.

---Adam

And lead times grow... at the best shops.

[Unobtanium-inc]

Originally Posted by techweenie

And lead times grow... at the best shops.

That's why when people ask me about shops that have immediate openings and only charge $75 an hour, I tell them to proceed cautiously.

---Adam

[Bphawk1]

The part prices have gone up significantly for the 911's (new parts) for me.

[Macroni]

911 cost fatigue and 356 trendiness brought on by Emory design popularity....

I agree.

[mattC2993]

With the cost of shop restorations wouldn't you have to get the car for next to nothing to not be upside down? Perhaps that has always been the case except with very rare and desirable cars. When project cars were cheap the average guy could afford to own a car and work away at it as money became available. Today project cars are many times more expensive putting them into the hands of a different crowd who would rather shuttle them off to a shop for someone else to restore.

[Macroni]

I am looking at a SWB project currently. The cost of the car plus cost of project I estimated a budget of close to $175,000.

[Unobtanium-inc]

There are a variety of reasons why people choose to do a project over buying a finished car.
On the high end guys like to know everything was done right, so they will buy a car that needs to be restored so they can control every part of the process, you know Victor did the chrome, Vic did the motor, etc, etc.
On the lower end guys just don't have six digits to drop on a car, but they can afford a project and since they have decent income can feed the restoration pig over a 3-5 year period. Lots of shops like this customer because they aren't in a super hurry, but pays steady, so they can fit them in between other jobs.
Projects have always found a place in the market.
The final guy is the guy who does a lot of the work himself, but farms out some of it, but does a lot of the final assembly himself, a general contractor of sorts.
We prefer projects because if you honestly describe a project car there are no surprises but when you sell a six figure driver Porsche lots of guys have very different ideas on how a 50+ year old car is supposed to drive. So lots of surprises.

---Adam

[Alan A]

Well if that guy from downstates pretty white 930 on BAT doesn’t come to life in the next two days I’ll be agreeing that 911s are cold cold cold.

Projects otoh I’ve had enough of. Buying someone else’s sunk cost from now on.

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by Macroni

911 cost fatigue and 356 trendiness brought on by Emory design popularity....

I agree.

Just the other day I read a Hagerty blurb about cars they say are slowing. They named 3.2s and 930s because the new younger buyers have been priced out.

[techweenie]

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

Just the other day I read a Hagerty blurb about cars they say are slowing. They named 3.2s and 930s because the new younger buyers have been priced out.

Maybe, but all the houses in my neighborhood at $1.8 million and up are going to 'new younger buyers.'

[Alan A]

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

Just the other day I read a Hagerty blurb about cars they say are slowing. They named 3.2s and 930s because the new younger buyers have been priced out.

I do hope so.
I still have a dream that I can swap the 996TT for a 930 without adding $.
Of course for a green 505 coupe I might add a couple of k.

[pingpong]

quality still sells in all markets, special original, original.

[trader220]

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

Just the other day I read a Hagerty blurb about cars they say are slowing. They named 3.2s and 930s because the new younger buyers have been priced out.

I find Hagerty to be really out of touch with many segments of the market. I understand its hard to be an expert on every niche in the market but in many cases they're way behind the times. Car markets are not as liquid as the capital markets but in this day and age there is a lot more transparency in the car markets then even a decade ago. I think Hagerty needs to up their game to remain relevant.

[specialtyoneinc]

Originally Posted by techweenie

Maybe, but all the houses in my neighborhood at $1.8 million and up are going to 'new younger buyers.'

You can thank these guys

https://la.curbed.com/2019/3/19/18202187/google-facebook-los-angeles-offices

[techweenie]

Originally Posted by specialtyoneinc

You can thank these guys

https://la.curbed.com/2019/3/19/18202187/google-facebook-los-angeles-offices

Silicon Beach has been booming for years. Rents have gone up 250% in 2-1/2 years, and house prices have gone up 150%. It's pumping people out on the street when the rents go up like that. Boom times for some. Not for all.

In any case, the Silicon Beach crowd is enthralled with air cooled Porsches, and in some cases they are paying record amounts for 911s that seem like they need nothing...