Salvage Title - Pricing Discount

[War584]

Thoughts on the potential discount for a salvage title? General info on-line (non P Car specific) says 25-40% below market, which seems a bit aggressive for this model/make.

The car in question, 1986 911, was apparently stolen, driven and crashed into a curb. The insurance company rebuilt the suspension, fixed the issues and a repainted a couple panels that were damaged and in doing so branded the title. My mechanic confirmed the car is in good shape, repaired well and without any apparent issues - other than the title. Overall, the car looks really nice and mechanically checks out.

[1979-930]

I think 25% + is correct. A $40K car is going to sell for at least a $10K discount because of the branded title.

[Unobtanium-inc]

I would say 30% and also keep in mind if you ever go to sell it, even with the discount it can take longer to sell. You can't get a loan on a car with salvage history, at least not from most banks or credit unions and surprisingly, many guys do finance their Porsche.

As long as you go into it with eyes wide open you'll be fine, it's the guys who think they are the smartest guy in the world when they buy the car at such a discount but then when they go to sell get amnesia about the discount.

My 993 has salvage history from 2005, don't know for what, old Carfax, no real info, but it will follow the car, but I don't usually look at the title when I'm driving so it doesn't really bother me.

---Adam

[Rick Brooklyn]

Is that the one that had a tree coming out of the rear decklid?

[Unobtanium-inc]

Originally Posted by Rick Brooklyn

Is that the one that had a tree coming out of the rear decklid?

Indeed! And don't forget the fire.

---Adam

[juanbenae]

i don't think you can get full coverage insurance on a salvaged titled car either. salvage = the scarlet letter.

[pnut_lee]

Originally Posted by Unobtanium-inc

You can't get a loan on a car with salvage history, at least not from most banks or credit unions

Complete BS misinformation Adam. I’m shocked that you can speak to the policies of “most” banks or credit unions. That’s a lot of financial institutions........... I’ve been buying salvage title vehicles for over 20 years. Many members of my extended family have been buying salvage title vehicles for longer than that. Multiple banks (large and small), states, insurance companies, etc. and never been turned down. Some banks have a lower loan to value criteria, or may require proof of repair. I think the general public would be shocked how many ST cars are on the road and I would hazard a guess that most are financed. It’s too big of an industry for banks to walk away from. Some maybe....but certainly not most as you claim.

[B.W.Jones]

I was looking at a 993 with a salvage title. My insurance company would under no circumstances insure it for anything other than liability.

[Unobtanium-inc]

Originally Posted by pnut_lee

Complete BS misinformation Adam. I’m shocked that you can speak to the policies of “most” banks or credit unions. That’s a lot of financial institutions........... I’ve been buying salvage title vehicles for over 20 years. Many members of my extended family have been buying salvage title vehicles for longer than that. Multiple banks (large and small), states, insurance companies, etc. and never been turned down. Some banks have a lower loan to value criteria, or may require proof of repair. I think the general public would be shocked how many ST cars are on the road and I would hazard a guess that most are financed. It’s too big of an industry for banks to walk away from. Some maybe....but certainly not most as you claim.

Oh, there's always someone in finance who will take your business. But your average dude goes to his credit union or bank and most traditional ones will not extend credit on a car with salvage history. That's why you see so many cars on places like ebay with salvage history and the dealers say in big bold letters to have financing in place before you bid, because many many banks, credit unions and finance places will not do it. That's also why you see smaller dealerships who traffic in branded titled cars self finance the cars for people. So yes, if you hunt you can probably find someone to extend you the money, but going back to my point, it's a lot harder of a car to sell, than a car with a clean title, so if you're going to buy a car with salvage history, go in with your eyes wide open.

---Adam

[juanbenae]

Originally Posted by B.W.Jones

I was looking at a 993 with a salvage title. My insurance company would under no circumstances insure it for anything other than liability.

that too was what i heard as well. stands to reason that lenders are aware of this as well and may be why they won't finance such a car. no full coverage, no collateral, no loan.

i can understand the insurance companies position in regards risk of some patched back together car that should not even be on the road has some catastrophic failure that causes great bodily injury is a huge risk. like the personal injury attorney that advertises during the morning news cast while i drink my coffee says, "when something goes wrong, call ann fong"......

[nathanbs]

Originally Posted by War584

Thoughts on the potential discount for a salvage title? General info on-line (non P Car specific) says 25-40% below market, which seems a bit aggressive for this model/make.

The car in question, 1986 911, was apparently stolen, driven and crashed into a curb. The insurance company rebuilt the suspension, fixed the issues and a repainted a couple panels that were damaged and in doing so branded the title. My mechanic confirmed the car is in good shape, repaired well and without any apparent issues - other than the title. Overall, the car looks really nice and mechanically checks out.

It’s important to understand a couple of things. The insurer doesn’t fix cars. Secondly when a car is salvaged it is either retained by the owner or it goes to auction. One of these two scenarios happened and then that person very likely repaired the vehicle typically on a budget that doesn’t allow for a perfect repair. Simple logic is vehicle cost + proper repair = greater than value of vehicle so why not just buy an undamaged car for an equal or lesser amount. This is the scenario over 99% of the time so proceed with extreme caution.

[Matt Monson]

My 74 is a rebuilt from salvage title. Hagerty wouldn't touch it. Progressive had no problem with it. Ymmv

[911heaven]

Over here there isn't such a stigma or even a category i.e. salvaged title. Auctions sell cars grade 1 through 5 or used to. Anything damaged repaired was in the auction grade ZERO section. From there a dealer could sell the car, but no docs. referring to a quote unquote salvaged title. I need to check up on current events, but that is my experience thus far.

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by 911heaven

Over here there isn't such a stigma or even a category i.e. salvaged title. Auctions sell cars grade 1 through 5 or used to. Anything damaged repaired was in the auction grade ZERO section. From there a dealer could sell the car, but no docs. referring to a quote unquote salvaged title. I need to check up on current events, but that is my experience thus far.

I've started auction watching over there and it's a little different these days. There are grades 1-6, with a 6 being the same as a US condition 1. Then there is also an R rating. This is for cars that have an insurance claim in their history. I'm not really seeing "rebuilt" salvage type cars coming through, so much as general crash damage.

[emoore924]

In PA a salvage title is the first of two steps to get a car back on the road. It brands the car as a total loss which cannot be driven on the road again. Then, if you repair the vehicle (assuming that can be done) AND you have a "special" inspection of that vehicle to be sure all the damage/loss has been corrected, you can have a "reconstructed" or "R" title issued for the vehicle. With insurance, tagging, titling and inspections, you may drive that vehicle on the road again.

The inspection is stringent. And the devaluation (and repair) follows the vehicle because of the branded title.

As was mentioned, getting insurance for an R title car can be a challenge. Insurance companies don't like them because there can be compromised structural integrity and that can mean risk to passenger safety.

I have heard that some states don't continue the "brand" if the vehicle title passes through their state. I would be interested in hearing whether someone knows that indeed is the case.

This Salvage to Reconstructed title may not work the same way in all states.

[Unobtanium-inc]

Originally Posted by emoore924

In PA a salvage title is the first of two steps to get a car back on the road. It brands the car as a total loss which cannot be driven on the road again. Then, if you repair the vehicle (assuming that can be done) AND you have a "special" inspection of that vehicle to be sure all the damage/loss has been corrected, you can have a "reconstructed" or "R" title issued for the vehicle. With insurance, tagging, titling and inspections, you may drive that vehicle on the road again.

The inspection is stringent. And the devaluation (and repair) follows the vehicle because of the branded title.

As was mentioned, getting insurance for an R title car can be a challenge. Insurance companies don't like them because there can be compromised structural integrity and that can mean risk to passenger safety.

I have heard that some states don't continue the "brand" if the vehicle title passes through their state. I would be interested in hearing whether someone knows that indeed is the case.

This Salvage to Reconstructed title may not work the same way in all states.

There are states that are known as "wash" states, meaning you can clean up the title but I've only heard of people doing this when they have a car that had a "parts only" title. Many states have two tiers of salvage:
1. Salvage Rebuildable
2. Parts Only, FL even goes one step further and calls it a Certificate of Destruction

The trick I've heard people talk about is to sell the car to someone in a state like KY which only has one kind of salvage title, all are technically rebuildable. So you can start with a parts only title and end up with a rebuildable title, but it's still branded, even if you pass state inspection and get the car tagged again.

NY makes it really hard on cars with salvage history. My car was damaged in 2005, rebuilt, and retitled to be driven again. I had a branded title from FL, but a ready to go title. NY still made me go through their salvage inspection, as if the car was just fixed, rather then 15 years before. It passed, it's tagged and on the road, but still carries the Rebuilt brand and will forever. But it was a nerve wracking wait. Thinking I had put all this money into this car, which had a clean rebuilt title and NY could for whatever reason say they would not honor the other states rebuilt title and not let me drive it in NY.

---Adam

[juanbenae]

Originally Posted by Unobtanium-inc

There are states that are known as "wash" states, meaning you can clean up the title but I've only heard of people doing this when they have a car that had a "parts only" title. Many states have two tiers of salvage:
1. Salvage Rebuildable
2. Parts Only, FL even goes one step further and calls it a Certificate of Destruction

The trick I've heard people talk about is to sell the car to someone in a state like KY which only has one kind of salvage title, all are technically rebuildable. So you can start with a parts only title and end up with a rebuildable title, but it's still branded, even if you pass state inspection and get the car tagged again.

NY makes it really hard on cars with salvage history. My car was damaged in 2005, rebuilt, and retitled to be driven again. I had a branded title from FL, but a ready to go title. NY still made me go through their salvage inspection, as if the car was just fixed, rather then 15 years before. It passed, it's tagged and on the road, but still carries the Rebuilt brand and will forever. But it was a nerve wracking wait. Thinking I had put all this money into this car, which had a clean rebuilt title and NY could for whatever reason say they would not honor the other states rebuilt title and not let me drive it in NY.

---Adam

what you describe is pretty cool. i don't know what CA does other than branding a car as salvaged which could mean it was totaled and rebuilt by some shady outfit, or simply joy ridden for a day or two ending up marooned on a curb like the OP suggests the car he is looking at is the case. not knowing what end of the spectrum it is on is why ive always turned and ran from any salvaged car.

you'd think that high end cars carrying a salvaged title are likely on the major damage end of the spectrum. who knows, an 86 911 as the OP mentions could have been titled salvaged 20 years ago when it was a $15k car as opposed to now when it could be a better option for the insurer to have it fixed instead of paying out mid a five figure claim to total it.

[Unobtanium-inc]

Originally Posted by juanbenae

what you describe is pretty cool. i don't know what CA does other than branding a car as salvaged which could mean it was totaled and rebuilt by some shady outfit, or simply joy ridden for a day or two ending up marooned on a curb like the OP suggests the car he is looking at is the case. not knowing what end of the spectrum it is on is why ive always turned and ran from any salvaged car.

you'd think that high end cars carrying a salvaged title are likely on the major damage end of the spectrum. who knows, an 86 911 as the OP mentions could have been titled salvaged 20 years ago when it was a $15k car as opposed to now when it could be a better option for the insurer to have it fixed instead of paying out mid a five figure claim to total it.

It's a risk for sure, especially if your state is like NY. There are guys who sell on ebay, cars with rebuilt titles that say, "WILL NOT SELL TO NY", probably because they have people want their money back when they can't register the car.

---Adam

[996AE]

S titled cars make great track rats

[juanbenae]

here's one that could instigate a conversation.... https://sacramento.craigslist.org/ctd/d/sacramento-2016-porsche-cayman-gt4-6sp/7273329769.html