Sports Car Market Price Guide

[silverc4s]

Just got my 2008 Price Guide from Keith Martin's SCM magazine. It is very much focused on auction pricing, so may not reflect the entire market for cars such as ours.

Anyway, his pricing indicators for early 911's are all showing that prices for the 911S models have gone up by 20% to 23% over the last year. All models T, E & S, are in a price range above $20,ooo to a top of about $52,ooo.

His numbers are for a good #2 rated car. Concours, perfect, very low miles, celebrity, etc. would all add to the price. Anyone care to comment on these estimates? I can say from personal experience that it is now very difficult to find a well documented (no sad stories), rust-free, long hood 911 for sale anywhere.

[Sunroof]

Bill,
You can look at several sources and come to your own conclusions on what the price ranges have been for older longhoods. Excellence magazine is a good source and I believe the spring issue (April, May or June) will feature the market update by Bruce Anderson for early 911's. Every month Excellence has a section on what cars were sold for that was submitted by anyone who will provide the information. Great buys are mixed with high prices as well for the early models.

Their has been so much on the Pelican board written about what is a fare price for the longhoods. They have over the past several years appreciated in value based on supply and demand. Since the early 911's were prone to rust, excellent examples do go for a premium. The general feeling of most prospective buyers I have noted was that the prices are way too high and not realistic! But in todays market, you cannot get a decent longhood "driver" at any bargain price.

As an owner of a 1973.5T that was restored I have seen prices almost double for these cars. Needles to say I am tickled pink about the turn around in value since I bought the car almost eight years ago. If my car was an example of a decent 1973.5T on the market, I certianly would be in the asking range of 20k-25k, and some folks would say thats too low!!

If you deadset on buying a pre-1974 model, do your homework and take your time in your search. The pleasure of ownership of an older Porsche is well worth the cost of admission.

Bob
1973.5T Sepia of course

[silverc4s]

Bob,
Thanks for the input. I think I agree with you about the availability of driver quality early cars.
I am neither a buyer or a seller at this point, but I do like to keep track of what is going on in the market.

My Porsche purchase / sales history goes like this: 1985 purchased 1969 911 T Targa in good original condition for $7000, from a co-worker. I was promptly addicted.

Early in 1989 purchase a 1970 S Coupe in worn out but undamaged/unrusted condition for $11000. 100% complete, numbers matching one owner in need of everything mechanical reworked. Fully rehabilitated and in my garage today. less than 2000 miles on new everything. Kind of a garage queen, but on the road a couple times a year.

Summer of 2001 sold the 1969 targa for $12000 to a young fellow from Jax FL, purchased a 1973 T targa complete with 1987 3.2 motronic engine and a few other goodies, now my driver Porsche. I paid $13000 for this car in June of 2001.

Not sure why I am putting all this down here, except to say that the hobby has changed a LOT over the ensuing years. Of course I have lavished quite a considerable amount of time and $$ on these cars, but hobbyists do that with old cars all the time without increasing the value much if any at all. That is generally NOT what causes the price of old cars to go up - more like supply & demand, as has been well covered elsewhere.

In summary, I am in my early 60's now, and expect I will see the combined valuation of my two early cars get into 6 figure territory in my lifetime. Nice legacy for my kids, i guess...

[Sunroof]

Well Bill, I guess we are comrades in arms. I thought turning 60 next month I was the only senior citizen on Pelican!! I have been astonished as well on the prices of the early 911 models. Panorama magazine featured a great article this latest issue of the First 911's and compared them to the 356 series as appreciating assets. It was interesting to read how back in the 70's the 356 was a cheap buy and parts were cents on the dollar. Today, they talk of beat up rusted old 356 seat frames going for $900.00 at swap meets. They claim that the days of the early 911's has arrived and now is the time to buy one and take advantage of cheap parts and accessories. Makes you want to stock up on everything anyways.

I noted in the Panorama want add section that many were on the search for early 911's, some not concerned over general condition. It will be interesting to see what Bruce Anderson has placed on a value on these models in the Excellence Market Update issue. I certainly value his judgement.

For now I will hang onto my 1973.5T Sepia Brown beauty, enjoying it on weekends and sunny days knowing this has not only been the most fun Porsche I ever owned (4 over the past 30 years), but one the smartest buy I ever made. Sadly for my children, the sale of the 911 will help toward that liveaboard vessel my wife and I see in the near future.

Regards
Bob

[Vintage Racer]

Originally Posted by silverc4s

Just got my 2008 Price Guide from Keith Martin's SCM magazine.

I've read and received the SCM magazine and price guides for years. I think that they are always fair judgments of cars in very good condition (#2).

I also use the "Cars That Matter" price guide. They have a new guide out and the values correspond to the SCM guide.

I was recently looking a my 2003 issue of Martin's "Collecting Porsche". It had values going back to the earlier 2000-2001 era. I wonder why I didn't buy a 1973 Porsche RS for $45K in 2001?

a 1969 911 T Targa in good original condition for $7000,

Wow.

What are you buying now? I need to follow your lead.

[pu911]

I think all of the price guides tend to under value early 911's. We my think they are expensive based on what we paid for a car a few years ago but if you compare 911 prices to other collectable cars I think 911's look cheap by comparison. Good ones are getting tougher and tougher to find. So as long as you have a item that is in high demand with a constrained supply prices will continue to rise.
Phil

[deathpunk dan]

So you guys are saying the 71T I bought last summer (my first proper porsche, I'm only 29) is one I should hold onto:



It needs some attention, but I've been bringing it up to snuff bit-by-bit. Do you think values will continue to rise over the next 5 or so years? I'm not a speculator or a flipper, mind you, but I worry that the market might cool off and no one will want 'that old brown car'.

[Vintage Racer]

Originally Posted by deathpunk dan

So you guys are saying the 71T I bought last summer (my first proper porsche, I'm only 29) is one I should hold onto:

No, I think you should sell it to me.

I would never admit to what I was driving when I was 29, but I had a family and those orthodontist bills were driving me crazy.

Do you think values will continue to rise over the next 5 or so years?

I think that European sports cars will continue to increase in value. It may not appreciate as much as a particular stock, but you can't drive a stock certificate on a beautiful Sunday afternoon.

I honestly do not think that American muscle cars will see any significant increases going forward. It's a easy opinion for me: Muscle cars only have one buyer (a baby boomer American) while a nice European sports car have a global demand (a successful "Old Country", American, or Asian buyer would much prefer a Porsche to some sort of big-engine-whatever).

Nonetheless, I own and truck and trailer so I can deliver you a very nice profit, and you can use the funds to buy a 2-ton Chevelle with a big motor and no braking or handling ability. It's your call.

[silverc4s]

QUOTE from deathpunk dan;

So you guys are saying the 71T I bought last summer (my first proper porsche, I'm only 29) is one I should hold onto:

Yes, Dan, you have a keeper there. If I were you I would make a list of all the parts needed to put the car in perfect condition, and at a minimum, purchase & store those until you can do the work, or get it done. Every year, parts are getting more expensive and less authentic, IMHO...


Quote from Sunroof]:

It was interesting to read how back in the 70's the 356 was a cheap buy and parts were cents on the dollar. Today, they talk of beat up rusted old 356 seat frames going for $900.00 at swap meets.

Yes, in even the mid 80's 356's were fairly cheap in CA as I recall, and not really desired that much. Speedsters were still 30,000 to 50,000 in excellent condition and that was the very top of the market. A 356 coupe could be had for less than 10,000 easily.

This was also the era when everyone was trying to make their early 911 look like a new one, which at that time was the 3.2 Carrera, of course. That was a sorry trend that really screwed up a lot of nice early 911's...

[911Rips]

Deathpunk Dan
Your car looks great, I'm wondering what is keeping you from joining us on our Southeastern Ma. "Breakfast Club" runs!

[deathpunk dan]

Don't worry, I'll be tagging along come spring. She's not quite ready for prime time yet...