Busted Odometers

[jballz01]

I've been on the hunt for a 3.2 for a while now and have come across a few with busted odometers. How many of you have dealt with this and how much do you think it affects the value? Also, what are the issues to be on the lookout for regarding titling and registration?

Thanks!

[E Sully]

It is very common for the odometer gear to fail. They are plastic and at this age are very brittle and the teeth break off. With care you can repair it yourself, Pelican Parts sells the replacement. If you are not a do it yourself type there are places that I believe charge around $150-200 to fix them.
As far as titles go run a Carfax and make sure all the VIN plates in the car match. There are about 3 different locations on the body. If the seller is not the person listed on the tilte, be very cautious.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/196987-odometer-gear-replacement-electronic-speedometers-long.html

[cvlcporsche]

It all comes down to documentation... The bulk of these older cars have very little documentation, that is why fully documented cars bring the big $$$. So if the car you are looking at it has an unbroken chain of service records from Day 1 and the owner can show that in very recent history (as in 90 days or less, no conscientious owner would drive long on a bad odometer)the car had mileage other than what is on the odometer, no big deal. Send it off to N. Hollywood Speedometer and the mileage is very close to accurate.

If however there is no documentation to tell when the odometer broke, then it is a true "TMU" True Miles Unknown. A TMU car will then have to rest of the merits of the car itself. How does it look, how does it drive, what are compression/leakdown, etc. Based on that information you can figure its value. It will always be worth less than the example above.

I have always argued that MOST air-cooled cars are truly TMU because without any history how can you prove the mileage. Remember these cars are 25-50 years old, have generally been passed through many owners, have a known propensity to have odometer failure, and pre-date accurate Carfax records. I am not claiming that I think many people have rolled their cars back, but what I do see often is when you talk to an owner here is a typical response.

"Well I bought the car 5 years ago and it had 82k on it. It now had 95k miles on it. I have service records from my 5 years and a few records from the guy before me..."

Then when you look at the records they first start in 2004 at "67k" miles. So what happened from 1978 to 2004? The blank stare... Now you look at the car and it just doesn't look like a primo 95k mile example.

So the seller thinks he has a 95k mile car, he MIGHT... I would argue True Miles Unknown in these situations. To each their own!

[rw229]

I agree that records are important and really the only way to truly verify mileage. Many states are now branding titles as "mileage exempt" for cars over a certain age. FL has done this for a long time and for that reason (among others) I have always been leery of FL cars.

My state has recently started this practice and I freaked when my low mileage car's title said "exempt" for the mileage. I had the records to back it up, but they didn't care.

IMHO, this just enables dishonest people to represent these older cars as something they're not... rollbacks or fixing the odo to sell a car after driving with it broken for years.

Originally Posted by cvlcporsche

It all comes down to documentation... The bulk of these older cars have very little documentation, that is why fully documented cars bring the big $$$. So if the car you are looking at it has an unbroken chain of service records from Day 1 and the owner can show that in very recent history (as in 90 days or less, no conscientious owner would drive long on a bad odometer)the car had mileage other than what is on the odometer, no big deal. Send it off to N. Hollywood Speedometer and the mileage is very close to accurate.

If however there is no documentation to tell when the odometer broke, then it is a true "TMU" True Miles Unknown. A TMU car will then have to rest of the merits of the car itself. How does it look, how does it drive, what are compression/leakdown, etc. Based on that information you can figure its value. It will always be worth less than the example above.

I have always argued that MOST air-cooled cars are truly TMU because without any history how can you prove the mileage. Remember these cars are 25-50 years old, have generally been passed through many owners, have a known propensity to have odometer failure, and pre-date accurate Carfax records. I am not claiming that I think many people have rolled their cars back, but what I do see often is when you talk to an owner here is a typical response.

"Well I bought the car 5 years ago and it had 82k on it. It now had 95k miles on it. I have service records from my 5 years and a few records from the guy before me..."

Then when you look at the records they first start in 2004 at "67k" miles. So what happened from 1978 to 2004? The blank stare... Now you look at the car and it just doesn't look like a primo 95k mile example.

So the seller thinks he has a 95k mile car, he MIGHT... I would argue True Miles Unknown in these situations. To each their own!

[Matt Monson]

A car fax report is a good way to check up on mileage because the state checks mileage when they do an emissions test. I bought an '85 Carrera, thought it had around 125k mi on it because the seller was a friend and told me the odometer broke and was replaced with a good used one near the same mileage.

When I went to sell the buyer ran a car fax. The car had his 125k about a year before my "friend" bought it. I knew how often it was driven by my friend and guessed it was probably really a 135-140k mi car. The buyer also knew my friend and knows me, so he bought the car even with the ? mileage. If it hadn't been "all in the family" and hadn't been a trade where I took his '67 912 plus some other parts it might not have worked out.

That car would have sold for less on the open market even though it's condition was ok and had a brand new remanufactured gearbox in it with records for that service.

[jballz01]

Thanks Matt et al.,
I'm looking at an 88 that looks to be roughly 2x what the odo says, based on carfax and receipts. I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around what it's worth to me. I know that's all that matters. Compression test has everything between 152 and 160, but due to the lack of accurate mileage I'm having a really hard time pulling the trigger.

[Palum6o]

Nobody mentioned how easy it is to simply 'unplug' the speedometer. There's also another wiring trick where you can plug a wire on a different terminal and have the speedo turn off when the light switch is turned on - I discovered this once when I had my suspension done, the mechanic had done this to hide the miles he put on the car when testing (or so I'm speculating). Too many ways to fake the true mileage. Having a well documented history will tell the story. I've seen several cars that were sub 50k mile cars that had rough interiors, ie bolster wear and worn carpets etc...

[McLovin]

The weird thing about broken odometers is that everyone immediately sells the car after it breaks!

Ads always says "odometer doesn't work, but only stopped working recently so I'd estimate it only has 500 additional miles on it."