1986 m491/m470 Value

[87930]

I'm trying to establish a realistic value for "agreed value" collector car insurance. It's a Euro car properly imported and certified, 49K miles, some paintwork in the front, no accident damage. I would say 8 of 10 in and out.

[JJK78-951]

Very nice car! Not often you see the 491 with the spoiler delete~ Looks good! I'd say it would bring close to what a decent turbo car is bringing these days, I'd say $50k~ish.

[COLB]

I'd say it would bring close to what a decent turbo car is bringing these days, I'd say $50k~ish.

It still has Euro headlights (they look like H4s), Euro bumperettes, side markers, and a rear parking light -- looks like it avoided most of the mods normally done to "federalized" cars. What was done? Replace the gauges only?

Previous threads have indicated that M491s and Turbos are trading in the same neighborhood.

But for this car -- a nice color, un-molested Euro with 49k miles, I'd say 50k~ish is probably low.

For insurance value I would go closer to $60-70k replacement cost. Not saying you would make that if you sold it, but where are you going to find another one?

And maybe you would sell it for that much if advertised in Europe. Yours looks like a prime example of cars German buyers are paying silly money for.

[speeder]

Originally Posted by COLB

It still has Euro headlights (they look like H4s), Euro bumperettes, side markers, and a rear parking light -- looks like it avoided most of the mods normally done to "federalized" cars. What was done? Replace the gauges only?

The bumperettes and side markers are never changed on euro grey markets cars, at least not on any of the hundreds I've seen. And that rear hanging light is a fog light, not a parking light.

If the headlights are H4s, those are USA legal as opposed to H1s which were OEM in Europe at the time. This is one seriously awesome 911, head and shoulders above the neutered USA version of the same car. Well done, sir!

[COLB]

Originally Posted by speeder

The bumperettes and side markers are never changed on euro grey markets cars, at least not on any of the hundreds I've seen. And that rear hanging light is a fog light, not a parking light.

I misspoke when I said "parking light" -- I was thinking about the parking feature on the blinkers when the car is off. Most of the Euro cars seems to have the foglight removed -- I guess that is just to clean up the look rather than a DOT issue. I had a 1980 BMW 520 that had that same rear foglight when I was in Germany.

I thought the bumperettes were supposed to be replaced -- and stand corrected. Why did they bother with wider US versions if the Euro ones were acceptable? Perhaps it helped with bumper height or impact test requirements?

If the headlights are H4s, those are USA legal as opposed to H1s which were OEM in Europe at the time. .

I admittedly can't tell the difference between H1 and H4 without looking it up -- I just recognize they just aren't the sugar scoops that most cars got when imported.

Which made me wonder what exactly was done to this car, and what was technically "required" by DOT/EPA?

I assume a swap of the premuffler with a cat and an emissions test.

Amber lenses for the blinkers, DOT headlights, MPH gauges, raised ride-height?

I've heard mention of bumper and structural door modifications to meet crash standards, but don't know what specifically was done, or how to recognize it (other than presumably looking at the DOT/EPA importation paperwork, if such exists.

[87930]

The car was shipped to Wallace Enviormental in Houston for DOT/EPA. EPA was minimal, $575 because it already had a CAT installed in Germany. I believe they had a tax incentive to retrofit it. The DOT was $3050 which included headlights, tail light lenses, bumper shocks, side mirrors, internal door supports, speedo converted with actual mileage converted from KM to miles, seat belt buzzer, badging and labels. I'm sure there is more but that's what comes to mind.

US sugar scoop lights were installed but the original H4's and tail light lenses were retained. It has H5's now. Ride height has not been tampered with.

It is definitely quicker than the US spec 3.2's I've owned.

[Helios59]

Nice car! I've been trying to determine insurance value for my own M491.

It's a German market car w/spoilers front and rear. 87 K miles. Imported into Miami in 1986 with North American engine and factory cat. I have the EPA and DOT docs. New tranny 7,000 miles ago. Brand new engine rebuild.

Glass out repaint with Glasurit in 2008. I've been thinking 40,000 bucks. Conservative?

[WPOZZZ]

Originally Posted by 87930

The car was shipped to Wallace Enviormental in Houston for DOT/EPA. EPA was minimal, $575 because it already had a CAT installed in Germany. I believe they had a tax incentive to retrofit it. The DOT was $3050 which included headlights, tail light lenses, bumper shocks, side mirrors, internal door supports, speedo converted with actual mileage converted from KM to miles, seat belt buzzer, badging and labels. I'm sure there is more but that's what comes to mind.

US sugar scoop lights were installed but the original H4's and tail light lenses were retained. It has H5's now. Ride height has not been tampered with.

It is definitely quicker than the US spec 3.2's I've owned.

Did they let you keep all the stuff they changed out?

[911TurboLook]

Originally Posted by COLB

For insurance value I would go closer to $60-70k replacement cost.

+1

Low mileage, pristine M491's are going for a premium these days.

[87930]

Thanks guys. I'm pleasantly surprised.