flippers, pissed me off.

[GT3DE]

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-cars-sale/856927-1967-porsche-911-outlaw.html

This car was just "bought" at Hollywood Wheels scam auction at Amelia Island last weekend. Sold price was $102,500. Buyers premium is 8%.
I was in the room.
The guy that won the bid said he bought it for a client.
Total bull****. The car never was for sale at 102,500. He was a shill.

[porschophile]

I think I remember this car. Wasn't it sold on eBay last year for $60somethin K?

[MrBonus]

Clearly he hasn't found the client yet.

[mattC2993]

I don't get it. Are you saying he bought it for Dick Barbour or it was put up for auction by Dick Barbour and bought back by the shill because the price was too low? An auction would be the last place I would buy a car in this market.

[MattKellett]

I also can't see what the issue is here, am I missing something?

Classic car dealers are buying most of their stock at auctions. You only have to see a Gooding, Bonhams auction etc to see this.

Great looking car, that none the less could have been bought by anyone at the auction if they'd been the final bidder.

What's the deal with the auction being a "scam"?

I don't know this particular auction, or auction house, but it sure seems like they auctioned some nice cars, especially the '67 mentioned in this thread.

[ClassyCarrera]

The car sold last year for 82k. The builder was mark James from SD, Cal Not (Outlaw Builders) or who ever. The current seller bought it at HW Auction. Anyone can ask what they want for a car. But it would be smart to not do it to a car that has been all over the net for sell.

[Macroni]

I agree... anyone could have bought this car at the auction. This gent is a dealer and the creed is buy low sell high. If he did indeed buy the car (that previously sold for $84 thus no bargain) for $102.5 prior to premium and had to haul it home, hotel room, food, time, overhead...... well any final profit does seem earned to me.

My issue with this seller is his "creative" writing, it lacks voracity.....

[gt3racerich]

Just say no to these absurd prices.
Rich

[Tspringer]

Cars are moving from dealer to dealer with ever more dealers getting into the frenzy. Mainstream articles remarking on huge, rapid price gains. Not rare models getting pumped into the dealer inflated investment game with prices soaring as speculators play. The net changes the view but its starting to smell like 1990 to me.

[ficke]

Originally Posted by gt3racerich

Just say no to these absurd prices.
Rich

Sounds easy enough. So what is the problem here? besides it being illegal?Do not play.
Guy spends $8,000 to shill bid against his own car, plus hotels and travel.
Novice flipper having expensive lessons, possibly facing legal consequences? What is there not to like? If true. Or he really bought car for client, either way if you did not have to part with money, where is the problem? Other than you had a reality check on human behavior.

[brisboats]

I sure wish the seller would chime in. Car is advertised on Pelican, no?
B

[Matt Monson]

I don't follow. Dick Barbour bought the car, but had someone else stand in the room and bid on it?

[GT3DE]

DBP did not buy the car at the auction. Jerry Trone, a supposed dealer from NY, said he bough car for a client. Jerry Trone handed me a business card that says his name and HOLLYWOOD WHEELS - he is part of the auction!!!

[Nachtfalter]

It doesn't matter if there is a shill bidder, or if your friends bump the price on eBay, no one pays more than they want for any item at any auction. Its really that simple.

The only time an auction house can screw you is if they have a planted bidder in the crowd and short hammer an active bidding war to allow their guy to win it cheap.

Let the dealers pass this poor car around all they want, who cares? So the fake buyer lied to you, did you really expect anything else from a dealer?

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by GT3DE

DBP did not buy the car at the auction. Jerry Trone, a supposed dealer from NY, said he bough car for a client. Jerry Trone handed me a business card that says his name and HOLLYWOOD WHEELS - he is part of the auction!!!

Ok. So how is that different than if one of HW's employees is on the phone with a phone bidder. So Jerry Trone, a dealer by day, also is part of putting on the auction? He has a client in NY who sees the car on the lot listings and gives him a max bid for the car and asks him to buy. Jerry goes and works the weekend doing whatever he does for HW AND buys this client's car. Isn't that a possible scenario?

[sidney67]

I get what he might be saying; the auction was used to create the $102k baseline price that now supports it being sold at it's new inflated price.

The real issue here, contrary to a couple of the posts, is that the some people (amateur speculators?) don't just pay what they're comfortable with; everything's been so crazy that they have no idea what the price should be. Maybe this guy is working off that theory and by showing an ever increasing valuation is looking for someone who doesn't know any better and assumes this must be one of those "special" cars....

Just my theory....

Rob

[johnvan8]

I hear/read a lot of comments nowadays about "crazy market", "absurd prices", "feeding frenzy", "kill the flippers", "greedy sellers", etc...
Have forgotten about the elephant in the room? The ONLY people to blame in this "crazy market", imho, is the BUYER. In an overheated market (whether it be stocks, real estate, or cars), it is the BUYER who sets the price because he/she is dumb enough to buy it at that price.
It doesn't matter what a seller is asking, the sale only happens when a buyer steps up and writes a check, and sets a precedent for future pricing.
10k for seats? 5k for tool kits? Don't blame the sellers, look at the buyers.

[Matt Monson]

I agree with Johnvan. I've got no interest in buying the car this thread is about. I don't care what happens with the dealers and the top of the market insanity. I would even argue that this doesn't count as a flip. This is arbitrate among dealers and millionaires.

[SilberUrS6]

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

I agree with Johnvan. I've got no interest in buying the car this thread is about. I don't care what happens with the dealers and the top of the market insanity. I would even argue that this doesn't count as a flip. This is arbitrate among dealers and millionaires.

Agreed. And anyone who wanted this car could have had it at the previously-absurd price. Yes, I liked it back then, but not at $80k. But the seller has a right to ask whatever, and the seller got more than I was willing to pay, so everyone wins!

People keeping an eye on the market are going to see these unusual cars come around again and again until the music stops.

[MrBonus]

As an aside, I really love that car.