Interesting E-bay auction for a 74 Carrera

[1979-930]

I find this interesting.

74 Carrera sells last week for a little over $60k here.
Porsche 911 Carrera | eBay

I see the same car listed today and figure it was a fake buyer and relisted. But it turns out there is more information that its a non numbers matching engine and the buyer backed out.
Porsche 911 Carrera | eBay

The part I find interesting is the winning bidder and current high bidder are the same. I wonder if the winner and seller couldn't come to an agreement on price after the engine issue was discovered? Or the conspiracy side of me wonders if the winning bidder is pulling some BS scam on the owner?

[CountD]

If it's a real car - and it looks like it is, the seller should think pretty seriously that the COA he received has the real information or not.

When I received my COA on my '75 after serious delays, the numbers did not check out but the numbers on the engine and trans in my car point to a '75 with an October '74 build date.

So the past owner blew up the engine AND trans in my car and found another trans and engine from the same year and the same month of build? I would take the COA with a grain of salt on this one. It could be a very good buy for someone seeing a USA CIS 2.7 is the same in both the S and Carrera. I would take a chance on this one. I wouldn't necessarily trust the COA.

[1979-930]

I agree and was thinking that the COA may be incorrect as well. I assume the original auction winner is thinking the same thing. Why else would he be bidding on the car again.

I do want a 74 Carrera and this may be the one. I'm not super excited about the color. But I also don't care about matching numbers. I want a car to drive. If its the correct model engine and all other parts I really don't give a rats a$$ about a few numbers stamped in the case. The whole collector car thing is just silly.

[77Targa0912]

If the collector car thing doesn't matter why don't you save a real Carrera for someone who cares. Just buy a regular 74 with SC flares and an engine swap. This will save you $30k.

[Rick Brooklyn]

Originally Posted by 77Targa0912

If the collector car thing doesn't matter why don't you save a real Carrera for someone who cares. Just buy a regular 74 with SC flares and an engine swap. This will save you $30k.

I was about to say the same. 74 Carrera is basically a body kit over a regular S, is it not.

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by Rick Brooklyn

I was about to say the same. 74 Carrera is basically a body kit over a regular S, is it not.

There are also additional chassis welds and stiffening in addition to the proper Carrera suspension, in particular rear control arms and mounting location.

[1979-930]

Originally Posted by 77Targa0912

If the collector car thing doesn't matter why don't you save a real Carrera for someone who cares. Just buy a regular 74 with SC flares and an engine swap. This will save you $30k.

Oh I care, but to a point. And a nice replica is just as hard to find. And the nice replica Carreras are asking $55-65k. At that point what's another $20-30k for a real one. If this one sells for cheap, say $40k. Then it's the one. If not I'll keep looking. Options are limited right now and I have time.

Examples of non matching numbers or replicas
Replica $57K
1974 Porsche 911 Stock# 150607

Non matching engine and interior $99k
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-cars-sale/895270-1974-carerra-coupe.html

Real one. I don't like the color. $85k
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-cars-sale/917701-excellent-74-carrera-targa.html

Smart money Vs. Dumb money.

[Matt Monson]

I'd consider this one over the EBay car.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-cars-sale/921384-1974-911-targa-very-solid-matching-s-nice-example.html

Needs some minor rust repair and HEs suggest it is a 75, but for $25k a real solid starting point in an interesting color.

[Grimm]

Originally Posted by Rick Brooklyn

I was about to say the same. 74 Carrera is basically a body kit over a regular S, is it not.

I'm not sure about a '74, but the differences between a '75 S and Carrera include:

1) 5-speed trans
2) front spoiler
3) rear spoiler
4) flared rear fenders
5) 7X15 forged alloy, rear black center wheels vs. 6X15
6) 8X15 forged alloy, rear black center wheels vs. 6X15
7) 215/60 rear tires vs. 185/70
8) rectangular fog lights
9) Black trim
10) Carrera side lettering
11) Leather covered sport steering wheel
12) Power windows (coupe only)
13) leather seats
14) velour type carpeting

so, yep, it seems to be mostly a body kit.

[blau911]

Or the high bidder and the seller are working as a team to drive the price up.
If you look at the current high bidder's bid history, he has 23 bid retractions in the past 6 months. I have been on Ebay for 14 years and have retracted maybe 3 bids during that time.
Here's how it works: you post a car for sale, your buddy bids the car up. Other people jump in during the later part of the auction and bid. Meanwhile, the buddy keeps bidding over. A few hours before the auction ends, the seller cancels his buddy's bid(s), and the third party has been conned into chasing a false bid.

[1979-930]

Originally Posted by blau911

Or the high bidder and the seller are working as a team to drive the price up.
If you look at the current high bidder's bid history, he has 23 bid retractions in the past 6 months. I have been on Ebay for 14 years and have retracted maybe 3 bids during that time.
Here's how it works: you post a car for sale, your buddy bids the car up. Other people jump in during the later part of the auction and bid. Meanwhile, the buddy keeps bidding over. A few hours before the auction ends, the seller cancels his buddy's bid(s), and the third party has been conned into chasing a false bid.

Nice catch. I don't think I have ever retracted a bid.
But you reminded me of a couple of guys I worked with, 10 or so years ago, that would pull that same stunt. Total BS.

[CountD]

Something funny is going on. I wouldn't bother with this one.

[Matt Monson]

They don't even have to retract the bid if they can get you up over their reserve with their shill. That happened to me on the 74 targa that got away last summer. Turns out there was me, a shill and another real buyer. I thought it was two shills and pulled out. The other real buyer got the car. Unfortunately, I was willing to spend $1000-1500 more than where it ended. I might have gotten it if I kept bidding. But I walked on the assumption that it would still be on the lot in a few days and I could make a new offer and close it outside Ebay. Didn't happen.

But therein lies the cardinal rule. Have a number you will pay for a car. Doesn't matter if it is a shill or not. Just stick to your number. Don't let them bid you above your number ever. Stop bidding at your number and walk. They count on you getting emotional and fighting for a car and moving your number. It's part of the game. The way you don't get taken is to not get emotional.

[maninblack]

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

I'd consider this one over the EBay car.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-cars-sale/921384-1974-911-targa-very-solid-matching-s-nice-example.html

Needs some minor rust repair and HEs suggest it is a 75, but for $25k a real solid starting point in an interesting color.

Not so much.

Car has been repainted red(ish). Originally brown. Doesn't run (well, sometimes runs). Looks to need everything. Resto project for sure. Gonna sit at $23k.

[1979-930]

I threw in a low bid an hour before the auction ended and went to watch a movie with the family. I was out bid by two bidders that had 1 bid in the 30 day history. How long before it's for sale again?

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by maninblack

Not so much.

Car has been repainted red(ish). Originally brown. Doesn't run (well, sometimes runs). Looks to need everything. Resto project for sure. Gonna sit at $23k.

I called it a starting point. With nice 74-75 cars going for $40-50k someone might buy this car and put 15-20k into fixing it up. Its a new era. Many Europeans wouldn't hesitate on a car like that.

[maninblack]

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

I called it a starting point. With nice 74-75 cars going for $40-50k someone might buy this car and put 15-20k into fixing it up. Its a new era. Many Europeans wouldn't hesitate on a car like that.

Well, they certainly seem to be hesitating.

My "not so much" was in regard to your comment about the car being "in an interesting color". I called the seller based on the photos and found out what the ad didn't disclose, that the interesting color wasn't original. I (and others) would have paid the $23k asking price if the color was factory.

I still stand by what I said. Car is a mess. Needs, literally, everything.

We'll see what the market really brings on brown targas soon enough. I have a completely restored brown targa middie coming to market soon - new paint, new interior, rebuilt motor by Callas Rennsport. I'd be shocked if it did your number and it's much better than a "nice" car. We'll see.

[1979-930]

So it appears there never was a real buyer. I guess he'll try using a broker this time.

Porsche 911 Carrera Targa 2 Door | eBay

[sfZOO]

There was a real buyer. The dealer bought it and trying to flip it. I think the car sold for $40K.

Originally Posted by 1979-930

So it appears there never was a real buyer. I guess he'll try using a broker this time.

Porsche 911 Carrera Targa 2 Door | eBay