My 87 's' Engine removal Into Turbo Project

[Marcone]

I thought i would start a new thread to document the engine removal and show how little care for the condition of the engine the original owner had ...

This is my 1987 "s"

and YES this is my workspace.. i just put it down off the jack stands cause im done for the night.. yes the workspace is in an out door drive way in CANADA... its getting cold.. i want the thing inside my house QUICK!

Ive posted before about how the car is weird and has option codes that dont exist, in particular "C83"

The vin comes up as Turbo Drive Train. but is not a turbo(Will be shortly YAY)

The car says it was nile green originally(option sticker) but ownership says Silver, its blue right now...but ive found black and red on it under bolts and such on different parts.

Heres a vin Pic at the battery .... if you look close..(pic doesnt show it well.... ) its been etched i think... :S The 'H' and the 'N' aren the same font size and are a little thinner than the rest.



It has turbo numbers on parts in the suspension.... 928 numbers on the head...
Turbo nose but isnt a cheap knock off.. its the real turbo one.

Confusing but ill make it right this winter.

various engine pics( if you notice... there is a grey haze over everything... PRIMER FROM THE PAINT SHOP!!! they even got it on my dash near the passenger side...(theyre gonna fix it... after i complained ALOT)






Ive acquired a turbo kit from some one which includes a new exhaust manifold, intake manifold, turbo, injectors 55lb, and some pistons for lower compression. Pretty cheap too 1400 dollars all i need to find is an intercooler... easy enough i would assume.. OH and a management system.. any one know about those???

im ripping appart the engine right now...im at the point where i have taken off most of the little hoses and wires that i can see.... Rad is out... power steering pump hanging, a/c hanging (just found out it was actually not even bolted to the car in ANY way at all other than the tie rod that tightens it and the belt to hold it in!!)


Still have to remove the drive shaft still(unbolt it) hard to get at with the exhaust in the way..but i took the starter out and seems to be a little more room.

Im gonna try to take the engine out with the exhaust completely in tact (ive undone all the hangers) and then get the exhaust to a point where i can easily get it removed... by cutting it off at some point, pull it out with the engine to get at it to cut.....cause the thing is so hard to remove..and was so horribly done and welded in places its time to replace the whole thing.
By the way..the powersteering reservoir is just hanging at the front.. in case anyone was wondering why it was there..

Curious about the crossmember removal, im assuming i can take the crossmember down .. with the steering rack attached still.. and once i get the engine out of the way.. put it back in and let the car sit on it self again without detaching the steering linkage?? any one know? basically dropping the engine with the steering stuff and crossmember moved to the side and out of the way till the engine is out? far fetched but maybe?

Does any one see anything that should be done before i remove?

Let me know if you have any tips ideas etc.. Thanks

And i will have questions when ive removed the engine ..about getting it refurbished.. what to do what not to do..(just found out i shouldnt hone the cylinders.. ) anyone know of anything helpful like that?

Thanks

Marcone

[WaA420]

Your VIN says your car is an '87 N/A 944. It doesn't say anything about turbo.

[Marcone]

I know that... Im saying the vin that is on it there is etched (FAKED) dont know who did that... the vin we used on the windshield says its a turbo drive train.. no idea what that means... I know its an 87 944s N/A

[WaA420]

What does the vin on the windshield say? The turbo drivetrain would have 95 before the HN and 1 after not 94 and 4.

[Marcone]

not sure..... too cold out side to check...let you know tomorrow hopefully

Marcone

[Marcone]

alright..got curious..and checked..

theyre the same.. and the ownership is too.... but the body shop that painted it and the local (non porsche) mechanic say its classified as a turbo drive train.. maybe there is a computer program that isnt terribly accurate that they use... who knows... i just know i have a friggin paper that says its supposed to be a turbo drive train.. oh well...

Marcone

[JivenJim]

Some will say you're project is Bold and Others will say your nuts.

Butt me since I'm really bored. How far will he get. Now taking bets.

5/1 He never gets the engine out in Canada in wintertime.
7/1 He gets the engine out, but can't get it from under the car and the Exhaust is frozen to the ground.
15/1 Tongue get frozen to bottom of clutch bell housing
20/1 The engine gets liberated to a warmer climate. House Cat is strangely attracted to defecating on Valve cover.
30/1 Will have to Drill off your Cam shaft hex bolt.
40/1 Cylinder bore has a big lip on and won't let him remove the old pistons without Honing.
50/1 forgot to break the Tension on the Crank bolt before removing engine.
60/1 Pistons will be to a stock size piston bore while Turbo's are oversized.
80/1 What do you mean I should put in $800 of Gaskets and Seals
100/1 Aren't Stock Connecting Rods strong enough to handle a turbo.
500/1 What.. I need a stronger clutch and pressure plate.
600/1 Short Block assembled and Now realizing the Turbo Pistons have eyelet cuts for 8 Valves not 16.
1000/1 Long block assembled. Now how do I manage the Engine F/A.
1200/1 Ballast Resistor is not matched with Injectors.
1500/1 Engine gets re-installed with Turbo. Looks Fast.
2000/1 Dang.. no Cross over pipe or Blow of valve and Exhaust is to narrow.
2500/1 it starts at all
3000/1 Electronic engine management works and Turbo doesn't explode.
3500/1 Oh yea, the Head Springs are too weak and you will float a valve
3600/1 Exhaust Valves are to small and not sodium filled and melt.
4000/1 and $8000 later a 2 winters, he has a 250 Hp Turbo 924S running 7 psi boost.

Like Sorry Ah, but seriously thoe, if you do overcome all this, you will actually become my hero.
It can be done, but it Won't be as good as a turbo and will still cost lot$.

[Marcone]

I love your honesty.... and your sense of humour....

Ive been here before turning a BMW 325 into a monster. as far as the cross over pipe and blow off and all the other bits an pieces (gaskets, valves etc) im gettin all new ones.... so custom all the way...

It will be done sir.. it will be done!

but i will take odds on the 20/1 because if you look closely ..there are cat paw prints on my windshield... my cats love the car... so pooping on the valve cover .. a possibility... moving to a warmer climate? i love it here.. its not that bad.. just gets bad for 3-4 moths .... im near Toronto...actually halfway between toronto and niagara falls.. quite a nice area!

anyways i digress...

Marcone

[gtroth]

I thought I read somewhere that the compression on the 16V was too high to even consider a turbo...

[Marcone]

Ya.. it is quite high to put a turbo on it.. apparently the kit i am getting works on the engine..what output i dont know...but im putting in lower compression pistons to make it work with higher boost.

Marcone

OH ..and the bore of the pistons are the same for the turbo and the 16v n/a( i looked into it )

Im gonna win! im gonna win!

[Eldorado]

where are you, marcone? the house looks like a hamilton/burlington area..

[Techno Duck]

This is the 2nd car ive seen with the body gaps from the fender to nose panel filled in. Looks interesting.

I feel your pain with working outdoors. I do the same..changed my headgasket outdoors over the course of 3 weeks (only had time on the weekends). I guess the fact my father has a shop with two lifts makes up for it.. . Just the shop is on the other end of the island, about 25 miles away!!

[Marcone]

Only spent two Slow lazy 3 hour afternoons in the overcast weather so far. Taking a few days off to relax and maybe go to work?

I wish i knew someone with a lift... I did my Bmw outside too ...same driveway.

That thing (bmw)ended up to be a rocket! People thought i was nuts waht i did to that thing...but i did it...cause i was bored..and found good deals everywhere on parts luckily...

And then some one with a shiney painted blender on crack rice mobile clipped me in the rain whilst trying to make me go fast. I was having none of it.. didnt want to waste my time and gas(its expencive).

He passed me from behind to show off.. and hit my rear drivers side.... i went everywhere, he took off straight.. i ended up hitting a lot of curbs Bounced off of 3 like a friggin pinball game and wound up on the side walk... luckily it was late at night... end of story is... i lose bmw get porsche... porsche is waaaaayyyy better. and i thought i would never drive anything but Bmw ever again.

The thing is the Bmw pushed you HARD into your seat( it was a frankenstein monster engine! one of a kind unique, hand made, designed by Me and Some guy from AcSchnitzer) but we're not talkin bout bmw's anymore...

I want this porsche to make it hard to hold on... I love Speed!
Heres a pic of it BEFORE i was done with the bmw.

I took that thing from a Stock 1990 325is To a monster of an engine.. if you ever want to know the extent i went to to make that thing let me know.

Anyways To Eldorado... Im in Burlington. Say hi some time.
Techno duck... The filled in front looks quite nice i think... smooth Slowly it will look nicer in the engine bay.

Marcone

[Eldorado]

burlington has some nice areas.. you're not too far from me, i'm about 3 mins from the QEW in mississauga, just south west of square 1... glad to see another local on the board.

[ae1969]

I will take 3500:1 since we are asking if we should hone the bores.

OR I will take 10000:1 if the turbo kit is coming from x3m944 (Hausbrauen or whatever he was calling himself).....


BUT in all seriousness you have some much bigger issues with the 944s than you did with the 325. If you have question we will help you along the way.

[Marcone]

Sounds good... I appreciate the info...

No No No This is a real turbo system... i just read about that hausbrauen guy.. :S haha...

anyways.... do you know what else im against in this? i like building monsters..but are there SERIOUS flaws in this engine...

as far as ive gone and am going.. im replacing all bearings, gaskets, bolts, nuts from the bottom up... valves and head will be completely refurbished as will the suspension brakes clutch etc... im going to be getting the good parts.. no cheap stuff or stock stuff.. but do i need to know more than just make every thing new? Are the good parts just crap vs turbo stuff?

lemme know..

Marcone

[JivenJim]

Dang Marcone,

You might just be the Great White Hope!

I think everyone would agree you got a good N/A Base.. but them turbo's are different from the ground up. (as I was punning with my odds) So replicating can cost$. If you've done the BMW's then you know that.

As one nut to another: Break it down to manageable chunks. Like you said.

Step one get the engine Inside fast!

2. Store the girl for winter.
Then start to worry about what heir Monsteir, you make with the Cash you can afford.

Break Down:
I like to label the Vacuum lines that go to body and quick tie them to body.
I disconnect the Dme harness and put it on the Engine with everything still connected (intact like) and tie it on engine. Take digital pictures of Everything and Get lots of Freezer style bags (I like the ones you can write on) label Everything cause in 6 months you won’t remember nothing about what goes where.

If you’re not doing suspension work I would consider disconnecting Steering Coulomb at the Power steering rack. Engine attached to hoist. And then Drop the Crossmember with the Rotors and A-arms attached. Take off Distributor cap. Push the engine forward off Torque tube, then out the top with about 30degrees front end up. I think way might be easier with your ground.

AE: I thought that Hausbrauen had some good ideas but think he could not manage the work. Of course he didn’t skip with my cash. But I’d of bought in, if I had it….dooo

Food for thought. Sell your Head. Buy a complete Turbo Engine With DME and KLR. Sell The Turbo Short block. Get the Turbo Head water passage machined for the larger Engine Block. Standard Re fresh stuff. And you’re on your way. There’s a guy in New Jersey who is on Rennlist’s who doing that right now. All very expensive parts.

PS did I mention it’s a brutal 60 degrees F tonight in San Diego. Should I put on a jacket? I did see snow once in a movie, Then I went surfing.

[ae1969]

Originally posted by JivenJim
...........
AE: I thought that Hausbrauen had some good ideas but think he could not manage the work. Of course he didn’t skip with my cash. But I’d of bought in, if I had it….dooo

On the other hand I thought he was an idiot. He had wild ideas...... but horrible execution. He had some interesting junkyard concepts but no hope in hell of executing them... He had so many holes in his 10 page explanations that I got tired of calling him out.

Originally posted by JivenJim
........... Food for thought. Sell your Head. Buy a complete Turbo Engine With DME and KLR. .....

Now that is the best advice he could get for that car if he wants to boost it.

[Razorback1980]

Marcone...you have a lot more energy than I have. I would just take the engine you have, make it the best it can be and call it done. I am pulling for you, but wow, what a lot of work and engineering to try and get where you are going. ...and in the winter where you live? I don't know how you do it. It's a rather chilly 85 here today, so I'm thinking about staying in by the heater. I know it won't take long to pull the engine but putting back what you are talking about is going to take a lot of money and a enourmous amount of time. Good luck to you my friend and let us know how it's going.

[Marcone]

I appreciate the support... Im working for the next few days..so i will be removing the engine on Friday (a week today) then its into the house for the engine. all the dismantling and assembly will be done there.. in a nice warm basement... then off to the machine shop for the head work and block cleaning/refurbishing... assemble it and then take it out as soon as the snow melts... (march-ish) thats what i shot for when i did the BMW and it was a lot of sleepless nights thinking of things i should buy over the winter.... but i got it done... didnt cost much either(few grand) overall. Im assuming that it will cost near the same, considering what i paid for the car (2500 dollars canadian) already have the timing belt kit.. get a bottom end kit and top end kit for gaskets and bearings and seals... then onto the harder stuff... machine the crank, find a good clutch and flywheel, put it all together and im off...

So much fun ....

Bored and nothing else to spend my money on... when its spread over a few months that i cant even drive the car anyways... it doesnt hurt as much. Ill tell you this... My winter car is a piece of *****
Look it up

1980 Dodge Diplomat (200 dollars) runs well

Later

Marcone