Engine set up for a twin turbo converted 1985 911 Carrera?
 

My 1985 911 3,2 Carrera is converted to a 3,3 l twin turbo and i wonder if they used the right engine set up for this?
The cams is: 147-148(is this 964 cams?)
Stroke: 74,4 mm is 3298 ccm
Bore: 97 mm
Compression: 8,2:1
Boost pressure: 0,6 bar
Turbos: 2 Garret turbos

How does this sound to the experts here?

Sounds like they have used aftermarket higher compression pistons in the 97mm cylinders. Nothing wrong with that at all. Same stroke between the 3.2 and 930 motors.

Boost is quite conservative for such a setup. I suspect you could run more boost with this setup... Around 0.8 bar easily.

How does it drive?

Some pics would be nice!

The car drives nice and is quite fast up to 255 km/h. I goes faster but i dont know how much.
The only thing i am not pleased with is that i run a 915 transmission so i cant use firsth and second gear properly because i am afraid to brake the transmission which i have done once already:rolleyes:

Here is a picture of the car
Running 225/45/17 front tires and 255/40/17 rear tires on 7,5x17 front and 9x17 rear rims.
It is Fuchs replica wheels as you can see. They have almost the same weight as 16x9 original Fuchs and they work great
http://i414.photobucket.com/albums/p...t/08082011.jpg

I have never liked the original steering wheels for the old 911 so i use a suede Momo GT2 wheeel. I also like to use rubber floor mats
I have been thinking of replacing the clock with a boost gauge
http://i414.photobucket.com/albums/p...Rf801961-1.jpg

Do you have pictures of the engine? What of charge cooling? Still Motronic?

Leave the boost as is or you will be working and spending on this engine more than driving it.

The car works good as is. I think i will change the intercooler, hoses and hose clamps but that is most because of looks

Just changing to hose clamps like the one on the picture below looks better. I usually change all of the hose clamps with plastic on them and also every wire connection that uses ply on connectors which i solder on
http://i414.photobucket.com/albums/p...ngeklemmer.jpg http://i414.photobucket.com/albums/p...mpestrmpe4.jpg

This is the one in my car at the moment and i am not pleased with how it looks. The core is thin too
http://i414.photobucket.com/albums/p...obeskjrt-2.jpg

I want a intercooler that looks something like this
http://i414.photobucket.com/albums/p.../HyperFlow.jpg or this http://i414.photobucket.com/albums/p...or32lmotor.jpg

Nice looking car. Very stealth :cool:

Agree, be very careful with the 915. I'd save and step up to a G50 if I were you. A 6 speed box would be awesome!

Can you post some pics of the underneath, such as headers, turbos, exhaust etc?!

Hei. Where are you located?
Give me a call if you want to discuss some issues, 90884590

And as 911TT33 mention, please take some more pictures of the setup.


Trond

The way i want the intercooler is to have the hoses to the turbos at the back and straight down to the tubos. Then i can use silicone hoses and everythig looks much better.

The set up with the car i am very pleased with

Swapping to a G30 box is to much work for me at the moment but that sure would have been fun:)

Twin turbo intercooler in my 930.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1315318364.jpg


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1315318391.jpg

Dang dude... looks like you been using your cooling fan to grind up bodies or something. That's some scary $h!t!!!

Really nice set up:) And your turbos is bigger than the ones on my car :)

Is that two 12" x 10" x 4" intercoolers welded together? Have you bought the intercooler from Albert Liang at goingsuperfast?

It looks really nice and that is the look i really like:)

Are you pleased with the intercooler?

Those are some BIG snails :eek: At a guess, I'd say they are either GT30R's or GT35R's ?! Am I correct? How quick do they spool race911turbo? I would have gone for some nice GT28RS turbo's for that configuration for quicker spool and decent top end power (~700 crank HP) :cool:

Those look like gt35's with Tial SS hot housings, to big for the displacement.:rolleyes:
Race911turbo=Albert Liang

Yep, on a 3.8 or 4.0 big bore motor they'd be OK, but on a 3.3, they're too big :confused:

When do you get full boost, Albert? Way past 4K RPM I would think :eek:

MrShades, what size Garretts do you have on your TT setup? T3's?

4300 RPM = 0.5 bar of boost, still stock internal. Too big.... but drives pretty well...

I have 2x GT 35R turbocharger,2x wastegate, intercooler for twin turbo, sitting in the shop.
One week I got nothing to do I cut the header and put everythings on 1989 930. I live 1 mile up on mountain in Taiwan, twin GT-35R turbo is not that bad.....Ball bearing turbocharger spinning well at low end, light pressure.

My plan is getting LN engineering 3.4 L cylinder and pistons, GT-2 EVO cam, race valve spring, twin plug, Pauter rods, raceware head studs. up the engine redline to 8000RPM.

Yes, race911turbo= Albert Liang

Intercooler in 1986 Carrera with 965 turbo motor.http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1315354007.jpg

What A/R are you running in the hot housing on those GT35R's? 0.63?

What sort of HP are you aiming for? 1000+ HP? :eek:

I personally would prefer a twin GT28RS setup to make that car a LOT more enjoyable, and still have excellent response and tonnes of power :cool:

Also, the length of those headers won't help response times on those massive GT35R's :(

It drives better than what I was expected. I run around without idle control valve....I can start cold engine without step on the gas.

I got 6x 82 lbs fuel injectors, AN-10 fuel lines, Aeromotive fuel pump rated for 1200 HP. Fuel and Air side I am ready for 1000 HP.

My plan is getting LN engineering 3.4 L cylinder and pistons, GT-2 EVO cam, race valve spring, twin plug, Pauter rods, raceware head studs. up the engine redline to 8000RPM.[/QUOTE]

IMHO, Still too big for that combination, a pair of gtx3071r's will do much better.,cheers,Stefan.

IMHO, Still too big for that combination, a pair of gtx3071r's will do much better.,cheers,Stefan.[/QUOTE]

Done both of the above. Booooooooring. German Supra.
Want torque, response, and up to 650rwhp? Run GT28xxR turbos.

++1 on the GT28RS :cool: I *think* their compressors flow 35lb/min, so should be good for ~700HP ;)

Sounds like Albert is aiming for BIG (1000+) numbers though :eek:

Each to their own... either way, I love seeing these unique configurations :D

P.S: Chris, have you ever fitted GT28RS turbo's on 993TT heat exchangers? Is it an easy mod?

Yeah, twin GT35Rs did 819rwhp without much effort.

Yes, we have done the twin GT28xxR on 993TT heat exchangers many times:
Turbos & Manifolds Installed
New Header Flange Comparison
That 3.6L did over 700hp on MODE's dyno, later 645rwhp on Dynojet. Huge, wide torque band to work with.

WHOA, awesome numbers! :cool:

At what boost levels did you net those numbers? On pump fuel, or race?

Single turbo A/R 0.84, for twin turbo I swap turbine housing to 0.63.

Damn you do some awesome stuff Chris, I saw he retained the factory lid, did you put intercoolers in the guards? could this be done on a 930 and get enough airflow?

Major compressor surge!

IMHO, Still too big for that combination, a pair of gtx3071r's will do much better.,cheers,Stefan.[/QUOTE]


Think about what HP this setup would make at 8000 - 8200 RPM or just looking at the engine bay would make me excited.
GT-28, GT-30, GT-35 use same V-band flange, I can do a swap in 2 hours.
I don't try it I would never know twin GT-35R turbocharger would feel like....
6 individual throttle body on my shelf should look better in the engine bay!!!!!

A/R 0.63x 2 = ?? compare with A/R 0.84x 1 = ??............
At idle air blow like hair drier...

0.63 A/R is a good size for TT's... you can go down to 0.48 A/R and it will be VERY responsive, BUT it will choke the motor at the top end and limit HP output.

All depends how you use your car ;)

Yes, 0.63 is good for 930 twin TT. Half of 3.3 Liter = 1650cc , each turbo with A/R 0.63 handle 1.65 liter.

The problem with running a big compressor wheel is the exhaust turbine has more mass to get spinning, which = more LAG, but once it's get spinning, it can flow huge amounts of air.

Smaller compressor wheel = quicker boost onset = fatter torque/power band = more fun :D

Chris, how does the boost characteristics differ between the GT28RS vs K16/24 or K16/16G in a TT configuration?

:-) Thanks!

Getting back to the original topic:
A very nice looking car. Do you have any specifications on the turbochargers? There is a tag on each, between the top oil inlet fitting and the side coolant port, with a part number XXXXXX-xxxx.
Any photos of the exhaust?

The 0.6bar sounds very conservative, but a lot depends on the tuning, and how much your 915 clutch can withstand.

I did not convert the car but it is Garrett M27 AR 48 turbo`s after what i can see

Is that not called the T series turbo?

M27 -- is that cast on the compressor cover? There should also be an ID tag on the bearing housing.
The only reference to "Garrett M27" I find is a small GT15 turbocharger, OEM for 2.0L Saab Turbo, etc.
We've used two for a twin turbo before, but on a smaller displacement engine <3.0L.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1315531615.jpg

Even on the small engine, these turbos were a little too small, too much turbine back pressure. Went with a pair of bigger turbochargers and didn't lose any response, and gains in performance.

TurboKraft
I just wrote down what i could see when the car was taken apart when we restored the car
The turbos on your picture looks a bit smaller than the ones on my car(it might just be the picture)but the turbos works very well
I will have a better look when i have the car on a lift
There is no turbo badge on the car and even if i put in bigger turbos it still will not have turbo badges. I might go for a 911 badge but that is all.

Never thought about the turbos but now i have to see what the tag says. If i remember right it is a blue tag on the turbos and the tag was hard to read without taking off a turbo but
i need to know even if that mean to take one off:)
The brakes on the car i Brembo big reds

One qustion about the length of the exhaust pipes i have seen some that use long exhaust pipes and some that use short pipes. What is the best on a 911?

This is how the set up looks(i need to wipe/sand off the the dirt and surface rust on the exhaust) It is the only picture i took before painting of the car
You can see the intercooler under the masking paper. It for sure sound loud when you use the car:)
http://i414.photobucket.com/albums/p...osanlegg-1.jpg

I assume you mean the exhaust pipe before the turbo?

If so, shorter exhaust pipes are best to minimize lag.

No i have heard about the length after the turbos will affect the cars performance.
After what i understood is that there is some benefits with long pipes and also some other benefits with short pipes

AFTER the turbo, a shorter pipe is better as it results in less back-pressure on the turbo, and maximises boost response. You want to get rid of the exhaust gas as quickly as possible out of the exhaust.

BEFORE the turbo, you want shorter exhaust pipes (i.e. the primaries on the headers) to maximise exhaust gas velocity, which spools the turbo up quicker.

That's the theory anyway SmileWavy

This is my theory..

Longer equal length header will give out smoother exhaust energy to turbocharger.
Heat = energy, longer pipe = heat lost before turbocharger, some use thermal barrier coating or header wrap to keep heat in the piping. Some use thicker 3mm stainless steel pipes.

Short unequal length header give out fast respond, but cancel some of energy between cylinders.

Long equal length header = higher HP number.
Short equal length header = faster turbo respond.