Well said.

I think sure 930s are more common than some collector cars out there, but @ anywhere from 300-3000 per year for 15yrs they're still not 'common' as compared to - hmmm, say - longhoods.

Look at the longhood market this last year. It's absurd! Can't touch those things, the worst of the worst yard rats still have value. Even crazy cobbled together molested numbers not matching engine / trans swap modded 'n rodded longhoods pull decent coin. It's nuts.

993s are seeing the same, as they bang the "last of the aircooled's" gong - despite the 930 being arguably more significant / poignant / uberawesome.

930s are a couple/few years from even further hockeysticking along the longhood lines IMO as they age a couple more years, as Pete said and many of us have predicted / hoped for quite some time now - and now we're actually starting to see the movement.

Prices lagged flat with even a nominal drop during the Great Recession... but folks still have $$$ out there and those are the ones driving the market up.

Couple that w/ folks vying for dwindling opportunities to experience raw unbridled Homologation derived levels of Awesome (reference my "what makes 930s so special" reply) as the manufacturers all make increasingly complicated expensive and isolating nanny machines... the values will skyrocket.

Is my '87 60k driver w/ nominal bolt-ons and some JennyCraig'ing @ Hagerty's stated $$$ average of $58.6k? I'd not thunk so and my agreed upon Grundy policy is prob set ~ $35-40k. I've got to up that @ renewal, maybe $45-50k... certainly not $60-90k... yet 8-).

Hold on tight folks, it promises to be a wild ride.

And disregard the blissfully ignorant commentary from he who's transplant precludes him from riding said 930 wave... always some gems of painful painfulness sprouted from such it seems... sigh.

I will mention this. In Germany the 930 & 911 cars in general are worth more than stateside. My 87 GP White that I drove over there prior to bringing it to the USA was parked at the Ring & a guy offered me 80,000 Euros for the car. Thats 108,800$.. Just throwing that out there.http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1388676260.jpg

[QUOTE=Alexm930;7835267]I will mention this. In Germany the 930 & 911 cars in general are worth more than stateside. My 87 GP White that I drove over there prior to bringing it to the USA was parked at the Ring & a guy offered me 80,000 Euros for the car. Thats 108,800$.. Just throwing that out there.

Good info, as Hagarty most likely takes it into account with their valuations. We here in the US probably have the most and best of many sought after cars to own. Those USA folks who still have not got their 930 should realize the advantage they have, at the moment. Over the years, as with other highly collectible cars, the difference in price between countries soon becomes a non issue.

I thought you guys might like to see the production numbers for the 930's through time. As such, I spent a few minutes looking them up and found this book by Adrian Streather.

Porsche 930 Turbo and 911 (930 ): Coupe, Targa, Cabriolet, Classic and Slant ...
By Adrian Streather

1975 284
1976 1,174
1977 1,422
1978 1,257
1979 2,052
1980 840
1981 761
1982 1,027
1983 1,080
1984 881
1985 1,148
1986 2,670
1987 3,094* includes 200 slant
1988 2,784* includes 296 slant
1989 2,743* includes 180 slant

In an earlier Pelican thread I found this further breakdown on body types and country...

Numbers built:

1987

930 ROW Coupe/Targa/Cabriolet = 720/69/142
930 Can Coupe/Targa/Cabriolet = 88
930 US Coupe/Targa/Cabriolet = 1605/87/183
930 US Slantnose = 200

1988

930 ROW Coupe/Targa/Cabriolet = 677/136/242
930 ROW Slantnose = 18
930 US Coupe/Targa/Cabriolet = 701/141/591
930 US Slantnose = 278

1989

930 ROW Coupe/Targa/Cabriolet = 857/115/244
930 ROW Slantnose = 32
930 US Coupe/Targa/Cabriolet = 639/109/600
930 US Slantnose = 147

and from a different source (the Red Book):

1978
Turbo RoW = 735
Turbo Japan = 61
Turbo US = 461

1979
Turbo RoW = 820
Turbo Japan = 32
Turbo US = 1200

Whether 930's are collectables or not is not really the question. You have to look at production numbers of course, but if you compare those of the 70ies and 80ies to those of the 50ies and 60ies OF COURSE there are more cars built. That doesn't mean they are less collectable, in general there were more cars built with globalizing demand and less war in the first world. Today, unlike in the 50ies and 70ies and unlike to the general last third of last century, more cars are being produced of every car. Stuff like a Lamborghini Reventon is an exception, created through intentional marketing. In contrast to an aforementioned 250 GTO.

So in general, collectors that age like everyone else will confront bigger production quantities, with machines that are as desirable for all the other right reasons.

For a collector 3 things in sports cars are relevant (not necessarily in that order):
1) condition
2) origin in sports / achievements
3) numbers produced

1 depends on you, 2 and 3 is a check for 930's, as even the individual years count.

930's will go up in general, 75 Turbos are reaching 7 figures first (maybe in 10 to 20 years?), and 3.3's are last to follow. Then come the modded ones. But consider 100 years down the line, do you really think the gap between SWB's, RSR's and Turbos is going to stay that big?

And VoitureLtd: "We here in the US probably have the most and best of many sought after cars to own." As only a very small fraction of cars worthy of the term collectables actually originate from the US, and US modifications (for insurance, smog, whatever) actually mostly always mean less value, e.g. in Ferraris, Porsches of the 60ies, 70ies and 80ies.. has anyone ever heard of an US version to be worth more than a Euro version?

[QUOTE=rsnodgrass;7835041]Many folks who like heavily modded 930s are buying because of the great performance, not necessarily because they are the 930 in particular. As prices of 930s rise there will be a greater divide between original 930s and heavily modified 930s since the performance crowd will look elsewhere for bang for the buck.



Probably true for most collectors, but consider that unlike most of the other cars modded by performance seekers, the 930 was conceived to be a modded race car, so to some it just seems right to have more performance than the dealer showroom ones, especially if done with Porsche Motorsports developed technology. Many I have seen, the mods are done without even drilling new holes or new welding other than what the factory did with the few produced of the original reason to build the 930.

That would then be a "period-correct" modification, and those can definitely add value...


[QUOTE=voitureltd;7835492]

And VoitureLtd: "We here in the US probably have the most and best of many sought after cars to own." As only a very small fraction of cars worthy of the term collectables actually originate from the US, and US modifications (for insurance, smog, whatever) actually mostly always mean less value, e.g. in Ferraris, Porsches of the 60ies, 70ies and 80ies.. has anyone ever heard of an US version to be worth more than a Euro version?[/QUOTE]

Totally agree with the origin of most interesting cars. I was referring mostly to 930 US production vs ROW. And yes until recently Grey market 930s ( 1980 thru 1985) were worth less over here for the same reasons they are worth more in de. Get them while the purchase price is still good along with the tax advantage available, if going back, and were paid when new.

[QUOTE=Simon930Berlin;7835526]That would then be a "period-correct" modification, and those can definitely add value...

Good to hear others feel that way. I always try not to sell 930s that have some. Really add to the fun factor.

As an owner of a crazy cobbled together molested numbers not matching engine/trans swap modded 'n rodded longhood, I wish to confirm this statement. Well done hot rods are pulling six figures.

Mine is a custom built beauty with everything frankenstein including 930 brakes, a non IC 77 3.0 L motor from a 930 making 350 hp and pushing 2200 lbs. through a custom geared 915 5-speed transmission. It's beeeyooootiful (thanks to Jeff Gamroth at Rothsport for setting it up just right).

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1388691006.jpg

I didn't mean that commentary as a slight to those cars or owners, sorry if it came across that way?

I was simply using 'that' as an example of the lunacy going on in the market right now.

SC's and 3.2's are pulling same dollar as the recent lower market 930s? Seems stoopid to me, and, about time the 930s started to pull on those by fair margin...

your car looks and sounds nuts, good fer you!

[QUOTE=Alexm930;7835267]I will mention this. In Germany the 930 & 911 cars in general are worth more than stateside. My 87 GP White that I drove over there prior to bringing it to the USA was parked at the Ring & a guy offered me 80,000 Euros for the car. Thats 108,800$.. Just throwing that out there.[img]http://forums.

About 1 month after I took new delivery on my '79, while getting a service at the dealer there was a note on my windshield. It was a cash offer on the 930 for + $10,000 over what I paid for it. I think that everybody panicked over "No more U.S. turbos (including me) and were buying these up. I'm still thrilled with 930 ownership, one of my best investments...only topped by commercial real estate . Good R-O-I right now in the Porsche market; 914-6 , even some well built 914-6 conversions/ steel gt fendered cars are on the ascending $$ scale. I'm not flipping anything in my corral , so these current turbo prices are just one more bonus of 930 ownership.
Marty

I still remember when 930 production came to an end. People were paying crazy numbers for 89s. I know of one that was bought for $200k cash from the dealer!

While I will never be accused of being a stickler for numbers matching blah blah...I think your car is awesome. Nice build.

[QUOTE=icemann427;7835417]I thought you guys might like to see the production numbers for the 930's through time.

A published breakdown as a supplement of the production totals previously posted by "icemann427"

1975 ROW 274
USA None
Japan None

1976 ROW 654
USA 530
Japan (28) included in ROW
RSR 934 Group 4 30

1977 Row 986
USA 717
Japan (49) included in ROW
RSR 934 group 4 10
935 group 5 13

1978 ROW 725
USA 451
Japan 50
RSR Group 5 25

1979 ROW 809
USA 806
Japan 22
RSR Group 5 32

1980 ROW 830
USA 634 ( continuation of the 1979 series )
Japan (63) included in ROW

Total of 7348 930s produced thru 1980

Crazy...yes! Far from cobbled together...this 911 absolutely rocks! Much lust!
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1388715755.jpg

Love that car, reminds me of a singer or Magnus walker car.

That must have been a great trek. I look forward to meeting Barrett in person, that guy is solid. Now if I could only drive his old car half as well as him :p

[QUOTE=voitureltd;7836392] Im pretty sure there were 644 and not 654 1976 row cars built can anyone else chime in?
My car is a Euro 930 numbered #644 i thought it was the last one for the year :(

There were 634 units of the 1976 RoW 930 Turbo built. Chassis numbers 930 670 0011 through 930 670 0644. Yours was the last produced. During the 1970s Porsche reserved the first ten chassis numbers were for internal use only, though they were rarely to never used. See more chassis numbers at the 930 Turbo Carrera 3.0-liter: Registry.