What upgrades should I make?

[MikeSid]

Been on the sidelines reading posts for a couple years now. This is my first post and I'm looking for general advice for my project. At this point the drawing board is pretty blank.

I have a 71E motor (from a Sporto car) that I believe needs at least a top end job, if not a full rebuild. I'm trying to get ideas as to what performance modifications to make when I rebuild - or whether to swap out the engine entirely and replace with a 3.0.

The car is a 69T chassis with the stock 901 tranny, 40mm webers and stock exhaust (with rust holes in exchangers).

I'd be very happy with something in the range of 180hp

What is reasonable HP to get out of a 2.2 (2.5 max) without spending the farm at a machine shop?

Is a 3.0 swap a cheaper source of HP in the long run (I'd like to keep the 901 tranny but have no qualms about different engine since this isn't a #'s matching car)?

Any other advice I'll gladly take.

Thanks.

[Rot 911]

If you can find a decent 3.0 in the $5-6K range that will end up being cheaper than trying to rebuild and upgrade your 2.2

[jgparker]

A 2.2 E is a great engine when it is fresh. I'm not sure I would change a thing. You could upgrade to S-specs, but that is big bucks, and you might only get another 20hp out of it. I can send you a dyno print-out from my 2.2 S-port E-cam weber engine if you are interested.

Don't worry about your 901 trans, I've heard you can safely put unto 300 HP through them, as the factory did. I'm putting around 230 through mine now with my 2.8. Just don't dump the clutch in first gear, or it might snap off. I know a number of people who run 3.0 engines on 901s as well. The tough part is getting a 215mm clutch to hold the torque, but you should have the latter 225mm flywheel anyway.

sounds like a fun project,

JP

[MikeSid]

Thanks. I knew I'd get differing opinions somewhere (otherwise I suppose I'd have already have made up my mind).

jgparker, I'd like to know what you did to your 2.2S/E motor and what you get out of it. And if you're willing...what you spent! I'd like to see the dyno too, but I'd be willing to take your word for it on the numbers your getting if that's easier.

I figured, having the E cams and Webers might give me a head start, but I suppose those aren't the most costly parts of the puzzle. Maybe I'll have the case and crank checked and if they're good enough.....

[Tim Walsh]

Hmm.. I'm making about the same thing but with MFI. I'm using 2.2E heads, Pistons, cylinders,cams and case and putting in a 70.4mm crankshaft (from the 2.4-2.7). That will make a nice Hi compression 2.4E engine. I'm hoping for 180 at the crank and will probably cost me in the neighborhood of 4.5K when it's all said and done but that's with buying 1 core engine, 1 short block (2.7), MFI pump, stacks, and porting my throttle bodies. Most of that you can avoid except for a crankshaft change.

[dtw]

All the above are valid points, but we really need to know your realistic budget.

[jgparker]

Here is the dyno plot:



It has 2.2 E P/C, ~9.2:1, S-heads, Early E-cams, Webers, 32mm venturies, SSI and Dual out sports muffler. If you assume a 901 trans has 14% loss, 144 hp at the wheels should equate to around 170 hp at the flywheel. How much did I spend?... Toooo much. Worse case it in your head, and you'll be a little low. A real fun peaky engine with a lot of spirit, and I'm glad I have it.

If you are going for cheap torque and power, the answer might be to find a good used 3.0 long block, and throw those Webers on it. It's hard to rebuild an engine, and it come out as an inexpensive solution.

Thanks,

JP

[Tim Walsh]

Interesting chart. I'm currently building a 2.4E from a 2.2E core motor and a 70.4mm crank. If I'm reading your chart right I should be making around 160 to the wheels with the 2.4E. That's right on target for what I want. Thanks!

[TimT]

Prior to my engines latest iteration, my engine was quite similar to JP's It was 2.2S with a web-cam grind (dont remember which) 9.8:1 webers etc. RWHP was 154 on the best pull. Torque was similar, but was a much flatter graph. Ill have to dig out the dyno chart one of these days.

The 2.2 is a blast in a light car. JPs cams runout of steam at about 6000rpm. the valve timing could be adjusted to bring the power peak up a bit.

[Wayne 962]

Do you have a copy of the Engine Rebuild book (www.101projects.com). Lots of stuff to put on the Xmas list there...

-Wayne

[MikeSid]

As for realistic budget...I really don't have one, since I only have a rough idea of prices (especially for machine shop work). But I would be happy to spend $8K on the engine. When compared to the price, quality, and lack of style of a newer car, these cars are a huge bargain.

So I'll figure on $8K for the engine - and hope I can get away with spending only $7K.

Oh...and other than machine shop work, I "intend" to do all the work myself....but we'll see how that goes....If I get in trouble, Walker is close by.

[Superman]

A used 3L might have issues, or at least be a little tired. So then potentially a rebuild in the future anyway. On the other hand, it has more HP than you stock 2.2, and as much hp as you're likely to get rebuilding your engine, and when you do rebuild a 3L, if you put performance parts in it, you get over 200 hp easily. Upwards of 250 in "streetable" form. Aluminum case, etc. And you might get lucky and find a 3L that stays very healthy for years. Very very possible. Actually, you might be able to get a tired 3L and rebuild it for the same cost as simply rebuilding your 2.2

[Larry Harris]

I agree with Superman. A 3.0 is an extremely reliable engine. You can get an easy 220 hp without being radical. You will find the 3.0 an excellent daily driver.
LH

[MikeSid]

I saw the engine advertised by "rdane". It looks like what I am looking for if I go the 3.0 route. And I suppose if I go that way, I could keep the 2.2 on a stand and rebuild it over time. Hmmmm.....

[dd74]

Go 3.0. You won't regret it.