I want more power from my 3.2

[stevie43_uk]

I'm getting to the stage where I'm looking to increase the power from my stock 3.2 carrera.

It presently has 114,000 miles on it, has ssi headers and superchip.

Can I take the 3.2 to 3.8 or is a 993 3.6 motor the way to go ?

What HP can I expect to get

Thanks

Steve

[Carrera3.5L]

Originally posted by stevie43_uk
I'm getting to the stage where I'm looking to increase the power from my stock 3.2 carrera.

It presently has 114,000 miles on it, has ssi headers and superchip.

Can I take the 3.2 to 3.8 or is a 993 3.6 motor the way to go ?

What HP can I expect to get

Thanks

Steve

Welcome to the board! I would suggest doing a search, this topic (and slight variations of) has been beaten to death (by the same people over and over again including myself) and all the info you asked above has been answered many, many times. There is no "right" answer, everybody's goals and budget are different and you will simply have to decide what works best in your situation.

Good Luck!

Ralph

[911mot]

Power from 3.2?

[adomakin]

alrite steve, another brit finds pelican! be warned though, this place has you spending thousands in a matter of days!

Andy

[hcoles]

I've seen this same question asked before and often the reply comes back to sell the car and get a good 993 or even a early C2. Otherwise you are talking very big dollars. BTW - there is a Porsche mechanic in town here that has a number of swaps and he says the same thing.
What ever you do you will always want more power....
I've done a few DE events and thought I needed more power...then I saw how a good driver can get my car around the track and I think I need more practice...the car is very fine as it is. When these cars are in good shape and properly driven they do very well against most cars you will run into and remember the basic design for this vintage of 911 is about 30 years old. If you want to do drag racing....then buy a drag racing car, a 3.2 911 is not a drag racing car and is not that easy to make into one.

On the other hand if you have the bucks...and do a good job and put a 3.6 motor in..you have one heck of a sleeper and there is tons of fun with that.

IMHO
-h

[Jeff Alton]

The 3.2 puched out to 3.4 or 3.5 can make big power. Just ask Ralph! However, add ITB's to Ralphs motor and you will get even more power..........

Cheers, Jeff

[Shuie]

Search Ralph's posts for '3.5' and figure out what it would cost you to replicate his motor. if 280hp isnt enough for you, then add ITBs and a GE80 cam to the build.

Also, search for posts from 'rdane' for '3.4' and 'rebuild' for specs on a a great 3.4 single plug motor that should be good for an easy 260hp using your 3.2 as a starting point.

There are literally dozens of 3.6 swaps documented here as well.

good luck.

[Carrera3.5L]

You can duplicate mine for around $10K US using your 3.2L motor as the basis (and most importantly, building it yourself!), which is cheap for you guys when converting to £ sterling! There are a couple of guys doing 3.4L Motronic conversions right now on the board, PM Jeremy964 and see if he'll divulge what his anticipated costs are for a second opinion.

If you are interested and don't want to read through my various and sometimes tedious threads that documented my motor build, PM me your email address and I would be happy to send over my build sheet so that you could compare parts prices in the UK. I reused a few motor components that didn't need replacing but did replace quite a few ancillary "while the motor is out" components that you may or may not need to.

I am forced to stick with Motronic and mild cams to pass California emissions testing every 2 years (which it easily does) AND be able to run on 91 octane pump gas, but if you do not have these constraints there is certainly more power to be had as Jeff and Shuie alluded to. A different induction, more suitable cams, higher CR and better gas quality are a good recipe.

However, the more money you throw at it for parts, the cheaper and more attractive a 3.6L conversion becomes. In my instance, I wanted a new, rebuilt motor and one that looks pretty much stock rather than a transplant. No additional headaches to worry about (just search the board for lingering 3.6L transplant "teething" issues). I change the oil, did one valve adjustment and put gas in, that's it thus far (it only has 4K on it at present). No issues with this motor, just nice smooth power/torque up the rev range. My Carrera is just too heavy to take full advantage of it but at least it gets out of its own way now, which they really don't in 3.2L form IMO.

If you have the Carrera cooler w/ fan in the right fender you should not need any additional oil cooling for street use with a 3.4/3.5 under normal operating conditions. On recent high 80's/low 90's days, oil temp for me doesn't go over 210°-215° while driving in moderate city street traffic. Runs at 180° during our modest California "winters" of 50°-60°.

I am happy with the power output of my 3.5L given what I had to work with, and I fully understand the 3.6L motors can and do make significantly more power, but at a premium price. In my personal instance, I just couldn't justify spending more sums of money on a 3.6L transplant for my particular needs with this car. YRMV.

I'm not trying to be the poster boy for 3.4L/3.5L conversions, if you reference some of my other posts I am in the 3.6L camp if your budget allows. Some here try and justify that a 3.4L/3.5L is just as good for an SC/Carrera as a 3.6L, but in reality it's not and I think most realize that. Like I did in my original response to you, everyone's budgets and expected results are different. I'm just trying to show both sides to allow you to make a more informed decision if cost is indeed the primary concern.

Ralph

[Shuie]

I think a single plug 3.4 makes a lot of since as a rebuild/upgrade when starting with a 3.2 Carrera motor. The 3.5 also makes a lot of if you are going to go from the bearings out on the rebuild. There was a nice set of 3.5 P&Cs on the for sale board about a week ago at a price that would have offset the cost of the extra case and head machine work incurred when doing a 3.5.

None of this stuff is cheap. If you can build a 3.5 for the same price as a 3.4, or even a stock 3.2, then you might as well do it. Im looking into building a hi-rev sub 3.0 motor and Im adding up $$$ figures that are not much different from a 3.4 or 3.5 build. And no matter how much whizbang stuff I add to my hypothetical buildsheet, Im not coming up with anything that is going to outperform a stock 964 swap for the same kind of money.

[Jeff Alton]

Well, I have a 3.6 in pieces that I am putting together right now, but I am also still strongly considering making my 3.2 into a 3.4 twin plug with ITB's etc....... Both would suffer the potential "teething problems" that Ralph refers to, but I think the throttle response would be very different between these two engines. How an engine feels is important to me as well as how much power it makes. But then I could just put the itb setup on the 3.6........

Oh, Ralph, face it, you are the poster boy!! Ha Ha

Cheers, Jeff

[Carrera3.5L]

Originally posted by catca
Oh, Ralph, face it, you are the poster boy!! Ha Ha

Cheers, Jeff

Yeah, I guess you're right.

Ralph

[Steve W]

I thought you guys might be interested in this dyno data. This is from a client that I recently completing the final programming of his custom chip. The build of this motor was originally inspired by reading about Ralph's twin plug 3.5 write-up in European Car , although with some different build specs. The primary difference on this motor compared to Ralph's are more aggressive camshafts better suited for his track use - note the hp does not fall off above 6200 as much. This run was done with a street style sport muffer - just like Ralphs. Using the typical assumed 15% drivetrain loss, the crank hp approximates to 292 hp.

[stevie43_uk]

Hi everyone,

Thanks very much for your replies....

Its either a 3.4 upgrade or maybe a transplant of a 'cheap' 3.6 motor from ebay

Thanks again guys

Steve

[JeremyD]

I am going the 3.4 route as ralph eluded to - I just can't bring myself to buy a used engine. I'm a control freak - and personally want to know what I have in my engine.

If I do it, I'll do it right. If I screw it up - it will be me who screws it up. I think as shuie says - if you are cracking the case, then go with the 3.5. My lower end has 57,000 miles on it - so I have NO need.

Cost wise, yes, it makes sense to go with a 3.6 with knock sensors and dual plug. With good gas, and 9.X compression you can get by with single plug and a 3.4.

Most people don't factor into the equation exhaust changes with a 3.6.. they can be expensive. Do the cost estimater on Instant-G and see what you come up with.

Mine - well - I have been planning this for awhile. Some of the items are a given... Bored and replated cylinders and JE pistons... How about head work and new cams - Extrude hone intake...

But while I have it apart - I'm cleaning, I'll powdercoat - and replace all the seals - all the gaskets - new chip - should last me for years to come.