Bad experience with Pacific Oil Cooler Service

[DWit]

Guys,

I’ve been debating with myself whether to post this. My intent is not to be vindictive, but instead to get your feedback on whether or not I was done wrong by them. The added benefit of course is that this may save someone here from repeating my experience.

I am rebuilding the motor out of my 1973 race car, and wanted to start with a nice fresh oil cooler, so I sent it to POCS to be properly cleaned. I have no history on the cooler except to say that it has been functioning normally for the 5 years that I have been running the car.

Once they received it, they called me back to say that it sprung a leak during their pressure test. Needless to say I was quite surprised, since the oil cooler has never leaked a drop before I sent it to them. I questioned whether or not they may have over-pressurized it (since they mostly do aircraft oil coolers, which probably have greater durability standards than do automotive coolers). Of course they denied over-pressurizing it.

The only options they gave me were to return my now-leaking oil cooler to me for a shipping charge, or sell me a used cooler that they happen to have there for $750.

Before you give your opinions, let me add some additional information. I have subsequently learned that an acquaintance experienced the same situation with his 912 oil cooler, namely leak-free prior to sending it to POCS, but leaking after it got there.

I welcome your thoughts?

Dave

[HawgRyder]

I don't know the procedure that Pacific uses....but anytime I have pressure tested coolers or holding tanks...etc...I always test at +10% pressure.
If it holds at that level for a set number of minutes...then I consider it good.
My point is...do you want confidence in the cooler?
Wouldn't you rather it go bad on the bench BEFORE you expire an expensive engine?
My $.02
Bob

[DWit]

Originally Posted by HawgRyder

I don't know the procedure that Pacific uses....but anytime I have pressure tested coolers or holding tanks...etc...I always test at +10% pressure.
If it holds at that level for a set number of minutes...then I consider it good.
My point is...do you want confidence in the cooler?
Wouldn't you rather it go bad on the bench BEFORE you expire an expensive engine?
My $.02
Bob

Bob, what would +10% be on a 1973 motor (with stock oil pressure springs)?

Dave

[Lapkritis]

Did you mark the cooler before you shipped so you can identify it? Was there a reason you sent it for service?

I understand it's common to use a mail-out service for these in 911 circles due to community habit and widespread recommendations. However, unless you've had a metal scattering catastrophic failure, you should be able to clean/flush it at home with the highest level of confidence using diesel fuel and filtering each discharge with a clean white cloth like an old T-shirt.

[piggdekk]

If they have it pressure tested it after ultrasonic cleaning they may have dislogged something that was plugging it. In industrial heat exchanges is quite common to find leaks after ultrasonic cleaning.
luca

[Tom C.]

Originally Posted by HawgRyder

I don't know the procedure that Pacific uses....but anytime I have pressure tested coolers or holding tanks...etc...I always test at +10% pressure.
If it holds at that level for a set number of minutes...then I consider it good.
My point is...do you want confidence in the cooler?
Wouldn't you rather it go bad on the bench BEFORE you expire an expensive engine?
My $.02
Bob

+1 . . . Pacific failed a cooler of mine too. But I'd rather know it was bad before I ran it on my motor. I know the pressure test is 'aircraft grade' because that's the business they're in. I later sent them two engine oil coolers, a front cooler, and my oil tank. All were returned in exceptional refinished condition. I'll use them again without a worry.

[Steve@Rennsport]

FWIW,..I've used Pacific for 30+ years without a complaint or issues testing & cleaning oil coolers and sometimes intercoolers (we've sent them a LOT of coolers during that time).

Sometimes a cooler fails the pressure test and while expensive to replace, I'd MUCH rather this happened during testing, rather than in the car and down the road somewhere.

Naturally, JMHO.

[HawgRyder]

Dave...just for info...my guess would be (when engine is cold and oil is thick) about 65 - 75 PSI for the main oil pressure.
The relief spring and piston should limit it to that.
So .... +10% would make test pressure somewhere around 82 -83 PSI maybe.
Sounds a little low to me...I would probably test mine to 100 PSI just to be sure.
Bob

[Tom '74 911]

Originally Posted by Steve@Rennsport

I'd MUCH rather this happened during testing, rather than in the car and down the road somewhere.

What Steve said. I've sent a half dozen oil coolers and a couple of oil tanks to POC for cleaning and testing, all with great results. Although it's a big bummer that your oil cooler failed the pressure test, maybe you should be thankful instead of angry... maybe it was on the verge of failing... and the only way to know that would be to test it.

How much angrier would you be if they'd sent it back and it failed while on the track w/your freshly rebuilt motor? That would be FAR worse!!!

Just another perspective, from someone who knows how hard these dang cars can be on one's pocketbook!!

[Geneulm]

These guys are a first class outfit and process/clean equipment to a much higher standard than we require : aircraft oil coolers. If they don't do their job, people fall out of the sky. They did a favor: they may have saved you an engine.

[304065]

What Steve said. I've sent them three tanks and two coolers over the years and they have always done fine work. And yes, a couple of those have come back red-tagged, unserviceable. This is the luck of the draw when it comes to 40+ year old used parts.

I really doubt they blew up your cooler by overpressurizing it, but you can see it for yourself if you have it returned. Overpressure leaves a very telltale sign, bulging fins, etc. More likely you had some corrosion of the aluminum which they removed, opening a weak spot, which coupled with the pressure test was enough to red-tag the cooler.

I trust these guys to do airplane coolers where the consequences are much greater than pulling to the side of the track. So I would give them the benefit of the doubt until such time as you inspect your cooler.

I think you can do better than $750 for a used one these days, however.

[Henry Schmidt]

We've used Pacific on and off for 25 years and never an issue. It is quite common for coolers to fail after cleaning.
We always pressure test coolers before we send then out and see perhaps 10% fail after cleaning whether Pacific does the cleaning or Critical Operations. Both companies have my highest confidence.

[DWit]

Originally Posted by Henry Schmidt

We've used Pacific on and off for 25 years and never an issue. It is quite common for coolers to fail after cleaning.
We always pressure test coolers before we send then out and see perhaps 10% fail after cleaning whether Pacific does the cleaning or Critical Operations. Both companies have my highest confidence.

Except, I assume that they pressure test them before they clean them. Otherwise they would be wasting time cleaning bad coolers.

I'm not trying to cast aspersions on POCS. I'm just trying to get my head around how an oil cooler, which never leaked, tested bad at their shop.

Dave

[Lapkritis]

I've seen cars that have driven rigorously for a decade fail on the dyno. Simple answer is the tests are more rigorous than ever encountered during real world operation. If the oil cooler only sees say 90PSI max in the real world, why test a functioning part to 110PSI during cleaning? It may have lasted another decade under normal use or it could last a month. The test is just another cycle of fatigue that weakens the cooler more than prior to the test.

[Ronnie's.930]

Originally Posted by DWit

Except, I assume that they pressure test them before they clean them. Otherwise they would be wasting time cleaning bad coolers.

Dave

It is not common practice to test dirty components of any kind.

[Lapkritis]

Originally Posted by Ronnie's.930

It is not common practice to test dirty components of any kind.

Nothing a little antibiotic ointment or Valtrex can't take care of eh?

[Ronnie's.930]

Originally Posted by Lapkritis

Nothing a little antibiotic ointment or Valtrex can't take care of eh?

That depends on the level of "dirt" we're talking about here and from where that dirt originated!

[Dan J]

I, too have used Pacific for 20 years with no issues
Did some non-leaking coolers leak after cleaning/testing?
Yes, But that's why I had them tested

[jhg41977]

I sent them my cooler in December. When I went to install it I noticed some fibers inside, also the threads for the oil lines had not been cleaned up. A phone call and that was straightened out. They paid shipping both was and tested/cleaned it again. All better.

I also sent them my oil tank. This came back perfect the first time.

They were good to deal with and their prices were good.

[john walker's workshop]

i test them @100 psi, FWIW.