2.7 Engine Rebuild

[casor]

OK everybody, let me have it for buying a magnesium engine. I can take it. Sometimes if you don’t laugh with this stuff, you’ll just cry. It was kind of like going to the doc for an ingrown toenail and finding out you need a heart transplant.

But I really liked the color (copper) and I never owned a Targa before. It’s the giant rear window and the stainless roll bar that always gets me – I can’t help it. I will tell you the sad history later, but the engine is ready to go back in finally so I thought I would post some pics.

OK. So what did I do to this thing?

Rebuilt heads, one welded, all decked
Time Certed engine case for head studs
Raceware head studs, nuts and washers
(6) new exhaust valves and guides
Remachined seats
Resealed cam towers
Repainted fan and housing
Replated all hardware with gold Cad
Powdercoated all tinware, shroud ducting, cylinder ducting, engine and transmission mounts, sway arm, links
Cleaned fuel injectors
Oilite bushings in throttle bellcrank plate
Ceramic coated muffler
Replaced injector mounts in intake runners

New:
Engine and transmission mounts
Engine compartment insulation
Fan mounting strap
Custom transmission ground
New seals and gaskets
New oil pressure sensor
Maintenance items – oil, air, fuel filter, plugs, dist cap, rotor, belt, dist seal
Fuel injector seals and plastic mounts
Rear sway arm bushings and nylon mounts
WEVO transmission coupler
Dansk SS heater boxes
Clutch, pressure plate, throwout bearing

When the engine came apart, Bill Boys at Possum Hollow – who is a real prince and a talented mechanic BTW – gave me the “Houston, we have a problem” call. As it turned out, the head stud nuts were (and I quote) “finger tight”, one of the heads was all beat up and leaking and the exhaust valve guides were not much tighter than a hula hoop. So what was intended to be a “quick cam tower reseal” became somewhat of a major top end rebuild. Amazingly, the car ran well before all this, it just leaked.

The bad head was welded and machined and all the heads were decked .5 mm which is the most you can go apparently. Six new exhaust valves and guides were installed and the cases were counterbored and Time Certed for the head studs. I also upped for the Raceware head studs. I know for a fact that the material they use for those things comes from Mars. That’s why they’re so expensive and that’s why they don’t break. You just can’t get that kind of stuff on Earth.

Here is the engine as I got it from Bill:

[casor]

John Butz owner of CB, another “old time” Porsche mechanic, noted that the reason the 2.7’s had problems was heat. He believes this to be a major contributing factor to the stripping threads and breaking head studs issues, aside from magnesium simply being the wrong material for this application. There is no fender mounted cooler on these cars, so they are down on both oil capacity and cooling compared to the later. Throw in airconditioning and driving hard on a hot day and you’re asking for trouble. In essence, he explained, magnesium’s bad reputation was exacerbated by too much heat.

The 2.7's issues are also exacerbated by not doing your homework.

So, you may ask, how did I get into an unplanned engine rebuild after owning the car for only a year or so? Being a somewhat experienced aircooled guy, shouldn’t I have seen the oil leaks and the tired suspension up front - especially since none of this stuff happens overnight? The answer to the latter is “yes” and to the former, “a lack of due diligence on my part”. I bought the car long distance from a flipper – I know this since, when I finally got the title, it was in somebody else’s name. Lesson #1: get a PDF of the title first. The other issue was a combination of laziness and being “too busy”. Lesson #2: Buy the plane ticket and bring a flashlight – which I should have done. The issues with the engine were so obvious, that my one-eyed rescue dog Max could have picked them up and he doesn’t have nearly the Porsche experience that I do. Even a cursory look would have revealed all.

The "stuff" being piled on top. I decided to do a spiral on the fan for your Focke-Wulf enthusiasts.




Oillite bushings support the throttle bellcrank - the plastic ones don't work.




I spun up an alum insert for one of the ducts - I 86'd the ugly steel pc Porsche had stuck in

[E Sully]

Mid years may have a bad reputation, but once the engine is cleaned up they are great cars.
The magnesium cases need a little extra work. It's not like any of the other years are much cheaper to do a rebuild on. Looks like you have a great car nearing.

[casor]

So, you may ask, why didn’t I have a PPI done? Well yes, I did. Or so I thought. I asked Vertex in Florida to inspect the car and gave them my list of my demands. Corrosion, accident damage, leaks, non-standard parts, how it drives – the usual. Included therein was the performance of a leak down test. Well I never got a verbal or written report on anything I asked for (other than a verbal “everyting looka good to us”) and I had to beg them for the results of the leak down test. The latter information came via an email with no other information and I was assured that the invoice would go into all the remaining details – but for now “everyting looka good to us”. Sure, I later got the bill, but with no detail and indicating simply: “PPI Inspection”. Thanks a lot. Mistake number three was not putting the brakes on the transaction.

The car was leaking from day one and, when I later had it up on my own lift, I could not believe that someone could miss all the issues – front and rear - especially (allegedly) trained Porsche mechanics. Then, like Pearl Harbor, it hit me. They never even put the car up on a lift. You don’t need to do that for a leak down test, so they never bothered. I guess they were too busy also. Emails having this question remain unanswered. And so, that in itself is the answer. So, lesson #4 is that you can’t even trust the PPI guys – go look at the car yourself.

But, in the end, alls well that ends well. I have further and properly skinnied down my list of preferred vendors, I had the opportunity to do my usual master fluff up of the engine, the engine itself was touched by a guy I know and trust, I now have a car that I have always wanted and I learned a lot. Of course, experience is something you get after you need it. Hopefully, it will all work when I stick it back in the car.














I made a jig to hold the intake runners while I drove home and re-staked the new plastic injector mounts. This job was really not that hard to do. I ground out the existing stakes and cleaned up the runners before installing the new mounts. I then re-staked the new ones in the orig spot w/o drama.

[casor]

Max is one of our four pug rescues, but he is 1/2 boxer. Blinded in one eye with medicine that should have gone in his nose, he and 14 other dogs were thrown in a dumpster by puppy mill and left to die. He was about 4 wks old at the time. A neighbor heard the dogs - a number of whom were also similarly blinded - and called a rescue person - Monica from Spanky's project. All of them were rescued and we got Max.

I spoil him rotten.






L to R - Jaxon, Zoe, Rikah and Max

[casor]

Originally Posted by E Sully

Mid years may have a bad reputation, but once the engine is cleaned up they are great cars.
The magnesium cases need a little extra work. It's not like any of the other years are much cheaper to do a rebuild on. Looks like you have a great car nearing.

I think so also and the real mechanics agree with us. It's actually an enjoyable task putting the thing back together, fr suspension included. Now I will actually open the trunk for things other than maintenance!

[RoguePorsche]

any idea of cost for all of that time, labor,etc

thanx Casor

[Cairo94507]

Wow! I wish I lived in Florida so I could tell Vertex I would never ever do business with them. Sucks. I would hope you put that bill on a visa card and then I would have disputed the charge as fraudulent since they obviously did nothing.

Love the engine work. Especially love the 4 Pugs - nice job and the love they provide is worth it all.

[casor]

Rogue - I pulled the engine, cleaned and refurbished all the stuff on top as noted above and I am in the process of sticking it back in the car. For me, it's about a 4 hr job in and out of the car, plus about 2 days of taking all the crap off and piling it all back on. Cleaning was probably another 2 full days or more, but the trans was particularly filthy.

Just the labor on the eng, which includes disassembly, reassembly, the head that needed to be welded, all of them decked and the machining necessary for the valve work was about was about $5-6k. Horribly expensive. The studs are $1k and a Porsche valve these days is $186 and I needed (6) of them. Then there are seals, sensors and other parts that I needed or just wanted to replace since they were hard to get to. Note that there were no new pistons and the intake valves were OK. After all that, I also bought alot of dribs and drabs for the equip on top of the engine as well as having powdercoating, CAD plating done and the throttle plate modified. Transmission clutch, blah blah blah. All in all, it was probably about $13-15K in total. Look at my list - all the stuff is top dollar these days. Welcome to Porscheland.

[casor]

Originally Posted by Cairo94507

Wow! I wish I lived in Florida so I could tell Vertex I would never ever do business with them. Sucks. I would hope you put that bill on a visa card and then I would have disputed the charge as fraudulent since they obviously did nothing.

Love the engine work. Especially love the 4 Pugs - nice job and the love they provide is worth it all.

Cairo - Thank you for your comments. Vertex did in fact do the LD test and I have those numbers which are now, of course, irrelevant. Again, I freely admit that most of this situation was my own fault for not flying down there and looking myself. A lesson learned. Nevertheless, I my instructions, which were explicit and unequivocal, were not followed and I didn't pick this up until it was too late.

There might have been a little "home cooking" here also, since the seller was in FL and recommended them. Do your own due diligence with these things and don't take anyone's word for anything. Show me.
Rob

[casor]

Cairo - yes I couldn't imagine life w/o our pugs. We got Rikah first (the little one) who we think is part Chihuahua since she is so type A. She was dropped off on the step of a foster home after being taken away from her mother too soon. She bit everything in sight but lost this after six mos. She mothered Max when we got him a month later - Max was so sick and scared when we got him that I had to sleep on the couch with him every night for at least a month. Rikah of course felt left out so I wound up sleeping with two snoring dogs for a month.

Zoe and Jaxon are siblings and are all pug - lovable and fat. Their story is that their mother was rescued and they were born in a foster home. Drove up to VT in a snow storm to get them! With Max thinking it was fun the entire drive!

Our little troupe is hysterically funny 24/7. I'd have 80 of these things if I could.

Rob

[RoguePorsche]

Not looking to jack the thread just add to it if thats ok….


My 76' 2.7L is now having issues starting, My guy put in a ignition coil but no luck.

Any ideas on what to look at next????

[casor]

Originally Posted by RoguePorsche

Not looking to jack the thread just add to it if thats ok….


My 76' 2.7L is now having issues starting, My guy put in a ignition coil but no luck.

Any ideas on what to look at next????

Rogue - Hard to diagnose w/o seeing it but nevertheless, I need a more info. ie, does it turn over, is the batt fully charged and you're getting at least 12.5v etc. I would get a manual for the car to help diagnose but, the weakest link in the chain is electrics. Start there. Bad grounds is a key culprit, esp is the car has been sitting. Pull a plug and ground it, are you getting spark? Careful, don't electrocute yourself. No spark is requires a cascade of tests. Check the ign timing statically - these cars have points. Next is fuel. I bet the crappy gas we have these days - which goes bad in 2 wks - is bad. Dump what's in the tank. Is the fuel pump running when you depress the air plate in the CIS distributor? You can hear it. The CIS systems in these cars are very sensitive to crappy gas and the internals clog and corrode.

[casor]

Inexplicably, I d/n take any far away shots of the engine when I pulled it out of the car. Nevertheless, it was a horribly ugly mess.

Oil, dirt and crud everywhere. Paint missing, corroded fasteners, the works:


The trans was particularly horrible. Not shown but now, after 3 days of cleaning, it simply looks dirty


Car on lift, no cherry picker, so we used the car/lift to pick up the eng for transport to Bill's shop:


Success - the lump of expensive crap in the truck bed:

[Spumato]

So I am curious... how much did this project set you back?

[IXjamesXI]

Of course, experience is something you get after you need it.

I think I will paint that on the wall of my garage..

Nice looking motor, do you have someone you recommend for powder coating? I have to do my tins etc and would be willing to drive out your way if there is a good shop.

[casor]

Originally Posted by Spumato

So I am curious... how much did this project set you back?

Ryan - not counting the PPI fee of $600 (for nothing), the result of this sad story is in post #9 above.
Rob

[casor]

Originally Posted by IXjamesXI

Of course, experience is something you get after you need it.

I think I will paint that on the wall of my garage..

Nice looking motor, do you have someone you recommend for powder coating? I have to do my tins etc and would be willing to drive out your way if there is a good shop.

I use Dan at D&W Motorsports at 610-473-2001 in Gilbertsville off Rt 100. He's a good guy and strives for perfection. His rates are reasonable. I have however used him also for alox blasting - particularly on my fr susp - after which I immediately apply epoxy paint w/o using any primer. This stuff is from Klass Kote and epoxy is the stuff to use. Goes on like warm butter, sticks like crap to a shovel, and melts in beautifully. It's as good as powdercoat and impervious to everything - plus it looks like paint and it's close to what was on there already.

[IXjamesXI]

Thanks.. I know where that is and I might look him up. Due for a trip out to visit Frecon orchards. Also going to look into that epoxy.

[casor]

Originally Posted by IXjamesXI

Thanks.. I know where that is and I might look him up. Due for a trip out to visit Frecon orchards. Also going to look into that epoxy.

I live less than 2mi from Frecon. In fact, I dumped a bike on their driveway turning around on gravel yrs ago.....another bad memory.