964 oil pressure after fresh rebuild

[RideSober]

Here is a picture of the oil pressure gauage in my 1990 Porsche 964 taken 2 days ago when the local temperature was a mild 71 F.

The engine was just rebuilt and has less than 25 miles since rebuild.

What are your thoughts?

[AlfonsoR]

Why was your engine rebuilt? Any other prior history that might be related? What was the oil pressure before you had the engine rebuilt? Who rebuilt your engine? Did you re-use the oil pump?

[RideSober]

Originally Posted by AlfonsoR

Why was your engine rebuilt? Any other prior history that might be related? What was the oil pressure before you had the engine rebuilt? Who rebuilt your engine? Did you re-use the oil pump?

Engine had 154,000 miles, so to be safe it seemed due for maintenance, but had excellent oil pressure always above 2.5 bar at idle. Engine builder choose to reuse the oil pump. I recall being told there was no reason to check the oil pump.

[Steve@Rennsport]

You should NOT operate the engine and instead, have it towed to the shop for resolution.

1 bar per thousand RPM is what you should have with 15w-40 oil.

[AlfonsoR]

You might want to remove and inspect the oil filter(s) before you send it to the shop. Just to cover yourself. You can open the filer up and look for metals with this...

JEGS Performance Products 80532 JEGS Oil Filter Cutting Tool

Just because you have low oil pressure doesn't mean you will find metal in the filter, but it's just a piece of evidence, a diagnostic indicator, if you will.

Hope you just have a minor issue. Good luck.

[lindy 911]

Turn the idle up to 950 rpm and see if it doesn't improve to 1 bar. What is the pressure at 2,000 rpm?

[bazar01]

Your oil temp looks like is on the high side. Is your oil cooler fan working?

Your oil level is also way to high and overfilled.

My oil temp does not go that high even on 90 deg weather on the street.

What oil weight do you have?

[AlfonsoR]

I think that you will be taking a risk by operating the engine with oil pressure being low. Something seems to be wrong if you don't have good oil pressure after rebuild, but you did previously. I believe that's why Steve W made his comment the way he did. If you take it to the shop, they will want to see the pressure for themselves anyway.

[lindy 911]

Agreed but at 750 rpm it is common to see oil pressure at half bar...

[bazar01]

Originally Posted by lindy 911

Agreed but at 750 rpm it is common to see oil pressure at half bar...

mine is idling a little over the 3rd mark below the 1000 rpm. So mine is about 900 rpm and my oil pressure is about 1.5 bar on 10W-40 oil at full operating temp. (temp gauge on the 3rd line)

Oil pressure drops to 1 bar when the idle rpm dips to 750 rpm.

[Flat6pac]

The engine was not rebuilt, the engine was resealed. The only new in the bottom was the intermediate shaft bearings. The description was oil is leaking on the throughbolts, oil pressure is good but oil leaks everywhere.
I removed all internals, marking locations so all goes back together as the original was built. The case was cleaned, resealed, and updated with later pistons and remanufactured heads from Ollies, all supplied from Ride Sober.
The bottom main bearings were clear of scratches so it was simply a reseal with the engine having what it started with in the bottom.
964, NOT just another engine build with oil leaks - Pelican Parts Technical BBS
Bruce

[AlfonsoR]

Bruce, any idea what maybe going on? Did you get to witness the oil pressure before engine was removed from the car?

[RideSober]

"Dave,
You can change the oil and change the pressure.
We resealed the engine, we didn't build the bottom end. There was no bearings replaced other than the intermediate shaft. There was no decision on rod bolts and finishing the crank because of scoring of the crank. Everything was replaced exactly as it had run on the mains.
I ll get with Carols and an interpreter and see when he can fix the cowl, the ding on the sunroof and buff through on the quarter lip. I ll talk to him first thing Monday.
Bruce"

This is the reply I got from Bruce today when asking about the oil pressure.

Bruce, Are you serious?

"Scoring of the crank"??? When was that ever mentioned, disclosed, or ever even hinted at??? What day, what time, what discussion, what email, what, anything?

I aksed you why the bearings should not be replaced, you said it was a waste of time and money! I asked you why the oil pump should not be checked and you said it was not needed. I asked why the chains and ramps and rod bearings were not replaced, and you said it was not needed. All my communication with you was pertaining to an engine rebuild, but once you got my money you just did your own thing!

You even stated here on Pelican, that the bearings were "choice" and you defended YOUR DECISION NOT TO REPLACE THEM. You tore the case apart and put the case back together, and never even gave me any option to change the bearings, it was totally your decision.

Remember telling me around 50 times or so you would make sure I was completely satisified with everything? Your personal guarantee of complete satisfaction? So this is how you guarantee complete satisfaction? Just blame the customer?

My car ran perfectly fine, it had great oil pressure, and it leaked oil. Now you start twisting the story around after you decided not to replace the bearings inspite of my inquiry as to why would you not replace the bearings in an engine rebuild. I never asked for anything less less than an engine rebuild, but you took charge and you said based on your 32 years of expereience, you knew exactly what the car needed, don't you remember? Or maybe now you no longer really care about what really happened???

Here you are, again, blaming everything, except your work.

Imagine that...

If there are any doubts about the quality of the workmanship, just look at the pictures of the paint work Bruce had done on my car. The garbage paint work does not show all the damage he did to my driver door, the air foil that no longer works, the roof panel damage done when replacing a body seal, and the shifter that was installed wrong, or any of the other 23 items that were not done at all, or done wrong.

Just a total travesty.

What do you think of this "Porsche" paint job

[sjf911]

Is this another dreaded VR gasket set failure?

[AlfonsoR]

RideSober, I don't think Bruce is saying it's your fault. By saying "it was not rebuilt, it was a reseal", I think he's just pointing out that the oil pressure should not have changed since only the IS bearings were changed out. I believe it's a reasonable assumption too and if the "old" bearings were in spec, it's not unreasonable to leave them in, either.

Bruce has been around this community for a while and to me, from his posts, seems to be fairly knowledgeable and seems like a good guy too. Give him a shot at making things right.

[brads911sc]

RodeSober, Bruce is a known good pelican. so give him the benefit of the doubt. what did you spend? perhaps you paid for a reseal and are expecting a rebuild? perhaps you paid for a touch up and expect a paint job? those two items will run you 20k (12-15 for engine, 5-8 for paint) at any reputable shop.. what was your total bill? Also, you need to look at oil pressure at 1k rpm and 2k rpm with 20w50. Mine is prefect but looks low on the gauge when my idle is very low like yours.

[Packet82]

Originally Posted by brads911sc

RodeSober, Bruce is a known good pelican. so give him the benefit of the doubt. what did you spend? perhaps you paid for a reseal and are expecting a rebuild? perhaps you paid for a touch up and expect a paint job? those two items will run you 20k (12-15 for engine, 5-8 for paint) at any reputable shop.. what was your total bill? Also, you need to look at oil pressure at 1k rpm and 2k rpm with 20w50. Mine is prefect but looks low on the gauge when my idle is very low like yours.

Honestly, it doesn't matter what he paid for that paint job. Whatever it was, it was too much.

I also notice how Bruce change his post. Previously he said:

" There was no bearings replaced other than the intermediate shaft. There was no decision on rod bolts and finishing the crank because of scoring of the crank. Everything was replaced exactly as it had run on the mains."

Now it's:

"The bottom main bearings were clear of scratches so it was simply a reseal with the engine having what it started with in the bottom."

So what is it, was the crank scratched or not? I would give Bruce the benefit of the doubt, but if he's the one that did that paint job, he has some serious explaining to do.

There are touch up paint jobs and then there are paint jobs that leave the entire car covered with orange peel requiring someone else to strip and completely repaint the car again.

Between that and editing the post to remove references to scratches on the crank leaves a really bad taste in my mouth. Either it was scratched and should have been fixed or he lied when he posted the retort. Which one is it?

[mb911]

Wow sorry to hear about both situations botht the engine and the paint. I have rebuilt several (10 porsche engines) and painted 4 porsches so I can speak to some knowledge though not an expert as some on the board are. I cant believe the mains,rod,rodbolts,chains and ramps were not also replaced as a matter of course it is just basic protocol anyhow Wish I could help in some way.

[AlfonsoR]

MB911, everyone has opinions on how to do stuff. My opinion is that replacing bearings is not basic prototcol. However, may I suggest that we not turn this thread into opinions on different ways to skin the cat.

This is a sensitive situation for RideSober and Bruce is good guy. The best thing to do is to help them resolve the situation, and not drive them apart.

[4sd911]

As far as the pressure issue. Has anyone tried to diagnose the problem? It may not be an internal problem. Could be: sending unit, relief piston / spring, maybe other issues.