headers with heat 3.2 Carrea

[MaRu]

I know this topic was discussed some years ago. But maybe something´s new on the marked. So does anybody know of headers with heat. 41 mm inner dia at least?
I only found those so far:
http://www.bbexhaust.com/shop/porsche-911sc-header-with-heat-exchangers-fpor-0400/

Many thanks Malte

the engine will end up at round about 290 hp (flywheel), so there is a need for bigger headers than the SSi

Many thanks Malte

[Peter M]

Malte,

The ones you have listed have a 41mm (1 5/8") outside diameter not inside diameter. BBE also do the same headers in 1 3/4" tube which would give you the 41mm internal diameter you want.

(BTW SSI's have a 1 1/2" OD and std Carrera 3.2 header exchangers have 1 5/8" OD primaries)

I've just gone through the same research for my Carrera 3.2 to 3.4/twin plug/10.5/993SS cams build and decided on a set of 1 5/8" FPOR-0401's so I could use a Dansk Sport (or M&K) 2 in/1 out muffler. Being able to use the common inlet configuration muffler was important to me and didn't mind having to cut and reweld one of the heater inlet tubes on the hotbox to do so (to mimic those on the ones you have linked)

The 401's are available in either 1 5/8" or 1 3/4" primary OD sizes but the research I did indicated the smaller size was the best for my street driven application.

Probably won't have them fitted up for another 2 weeks

[MaRu]

Thanks Pete and sorry for the late reply. You are right, I posted the wrong link. But meanwhile I orderd them.

[sp_cs]

The Eisenmann is another option however i believe you need to buy the full system including silencer/muffler:
Bigger "SSI" system

Interested to know how you both get on with your BBE setups - my 3.2 has been bored and stroked to 3540 and may need to move away from SSIs for optimal results.

[Peter M]

Shirish,
I considered the Eisenmann too and received a quote from the local distributor. They certainly look great but a combination of price, being locked in to use their proprietary muffler and no dyno data anywhere discouraged me in the end.

It's probably the last bit that is most frustrating. There is so little useful dyno data anywhere for 3.2/3.4/3.5's exhausts so it's pretty hard to get any real guidance beyond some themes like:
SSi's work well below 3000rpm and lose power above,
The standard 3.2 headers work very well when paired to a free flowing muffler and in terms of $ per hp this is the most sensible combo,
Aim for a 1 5/8" or 1 3/4" primary tubes for higher reving and/or capacity engines,
Don't lose sleep over primary tube length when using low overlap cams.

I'll post some pictures when I fit up my 401's. I'm keen for the air distribution tube at the back to fit up neatly to the hot boxes. More hp, a good noise and no drone on the freeway would be appreciated too!

[Tom_in_NH]

993 heat exchangers work well on hot-rodded/bored 3.0, 3.2. Flip the flanges on one side and you have a great free flowing header set with heat. Inside diameter on these is approx 1 5/8". A set can usually be had for $500 or so, sometimes with the flanges already flipped. M&K makes a muffler to bolt up to these.

[Peter M]

True Tom but the photos I've seen of the various modified air ducting to and from the heat exchanges always look like Frankenstein solutions. I was hoping for something a bit more seamless and OEM looking.

I might be eating my words in a couple weeks though!

[sp_cs]

Originally Posted by Peter M

Shirish,
I considered the Eisenmann too and received a quote from the local distributor. They certainly look great but a combination of price, being locked in to use their proprietary muffler and no dyno data anywhere discouraged me in the end.

It's probably the last bit that is most frustrating. There is so little useful dyno data anywhere for 3.2/3.4/3.5's exhausts so it's pretty hard to get any real guidance beyond some themes like:
SSi's work well below 3000rpm and lose power above,
The standard 3.2 headers work very well when paired to a free flowing muffler and in terms of $ per hp this is the most sensible combo,
Aim for a 1 5/8" or 1 3/4" primary tubes for higher reving and/or capacity engines,
Don't lose sleep over primary tube length when using low overlap cams.

I'll post some pictures when I fit up my 401's. I'm keen for the air distribution tube at the back to fit up neatly to the hot boxes. More hp, a good noise and no drone on the freeway would be appreciated too!

Thanks for this Peter.

I'm actually thinking the F-Modell Eisenmann 42mm will fit a car with backdated heat without the need for their muffler/silencer, and that the G-Modell version is specifically for those retaining factory heat.

I was planning on getting my engine on the builders engine-dyno which would have provided a SSI to Eisenmann comparison, but costs have escalated so i need to save where possible.

I'll look forward to your BBE thoughts once fitted.

[Peter M]

Originally Posted by sp_cs

I'm actually thinking the F-Modell Eisenmann 42mm will fit a car with backdated heat without the need for their muffler/silencer.....

Shirish,

I could only find 38mm versions. Can you provide a link please?

That would be the holy grail, 42mm versions of SSI's!

Thanks
Peter

[sp_cs]

Need to find the link , hoping I was still accurate

[sp_cs]

This is a link to a pair that came up for sale on impactbumpers.com:

https://www.impactbumpers.com/forum/index.php?/topic/32124-39mm-id-heat-exchangers/

[sp_cs]

See the F-modell section on this page:

See - "Wärmetauscher-Satz aus Edelstahl DM 42 mm / Set Heat Exchanger SS 42 mm"

http://www.reuter-motorsport.de/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Reuter-Eisenmann-Katalog-2017-gueltig-ab-01.02.2017.pdf

[Peter M]

Wow, great find! Part no. P91130.WT42

I would have bought those rather than the BBE's I did.

You know Shirish that you'll need to buy a pair and tell us how good they are!

[sp_cs]

Maybe in time

I’ll get my standard SSIs dynod, then see. I’m expecting it to struggle at the top end. GT3 crank, Pauters, and ‘hirsute’ cams should allow a comfortable 7500 redline, but SSIs may have something to say about that.

[Tom_in_NH]

Originally Posted by Peter M

True Tom but the photos I've seen of the various modified air ducting to and from the heat exchanges always look like Frankenstein solutions. I was hoping for something a bit more seamless and OEM looking.

I might be eating my words in a couple weeks though!

Peter, agreed that many of the installations are hacked. However, I'll bet utilizing the 993 post-exchanger ducting should work, and look pretty good.

Take a look at the attached photo. This is a good look at the 993 ducting. Much of it should work with a G model.

[Peter M]

Originally Posted by Tom_in_NH

Take a look at the attached photo. This is a good look at the 993 ducting. Much of it should work with a G model.

Tom,
There isn't any part of the hot air ducting from a 993 that will work on a G model without significant and very time consuming modifications. The 993 heat exchangers have very different inlet and outlet locations for example.

Only transferable items I can see between them is a few hose clamps and the air in the ducting.