What next?

[shreddr]

I know the quick answer to this question is "get an R12" I have modified my R11 quite a bit, and have probably grabbed all the low hanging performance fruit (induct, laser cat elim & cans, O2 sensor pulled) the rest of my spend was on chassis and aesthetic improvements. the questions is "short of buying an R12, what should I do next that makes sense to get a performance gain" I have read about: cams, chips, PCIII's, larger valves, exhaust accelerators, 1150cc kits, porting, the list goes on. I am pretty happy with the performance gains that I have gotten with the small amount of tuning I have done, but I am guessing that other than the big bore kit, the other things won't add much on their own. so should i call it quits, or are there a few more mods that make sense?
the next question is what makes the R12 generate so much more power than the R11? I know the cc differential isnt much, is it just the 4 valve heads? and if this is the case then what is the limiting factor on the R11, the ability to get a larger volume of gas charge in and out of the combustion chamber?

[BobP63]

Why would you think pulling the O2 sensor would increase performance?

[Jeff Williams]

Shreddr,
IMO its a better engine than the one we have, But its not that far advance than ours, just a little step that all. Some have gotten as much or more from their 1100s, It just cost money.The suspension,(front end) is stiffer and more positive.
I happy with my ride but am going to get the HP,(not the RS), next year if it comes out with the reported 130+ hp.
From what I've heard the bike that N8 was riding in Lemanns had closer to 150hp.
Until then I'll wait. Besides its really the rider that makes a bike go fast not just the engine.
cya
jeff

[varmint]

i'm more or less in the same situation. and have decided to ease off. it would be like shooting my grandma full of steroids, she still aint gonna win at the olympics.

now i'm starting to save up for track schools. with any money left over budgeted for tires...unless i find some carbon fibre wheels for cheap.i would kill for those.



but if you've got the money, and it makes you happy, go for it. that guy from "the world's fastest indian" didn't sell his bike every time something new came along.

[sfarson]

While I note some 12S engine enhancements versus the 11S owned for +5yrs, what I find more observable is the lighter weight of the 12S.

[John Lyon]

What I find most observable is this thing is beautiful (hp and weight-savings are overrated):

[varmint]

read an interview with some bmw exec. he said an hp bike will depend on sales of the regular R1200S.

so we have a sort of catch 22. if everyone waits for the hp it will never happen.

[Bob Hancock]

Originally posted by varmint
read an interview with some bmw exec. he said an hp bike will depend on sales of the regular R1200S.

so we have a sort of catch 22. if everyone waits for the hp it will never happen.

doin' the very best I can here varmint....the best I can.
As for more power from the R12S....higher compression ratio for one thing.

[shreddr]

i forgot to mention i am capable of doing a lot of the labor myself. so if swapping out pistons is the best bang, I can do that, and while i have the heads off I would probably clean them up a bit. i mentioned bored throttle bodies a while back, and the consensus was that it wasnt the limiting factor. here is what i am thinking: high comp pistons (who, where?) larger valves, clean up the heads, and perhaps the exhaust accelerators (would like an opinion on what % this equates to), bored throttle bodies , and i guess that i would need a chip. I am thinking I can do this all for around $1000 in parts, and this should be a noticeable improvement without sacrificing any reliability. comments?

[pmc847]

Here are a couple of links to my project.

I'm having fun now.

My Project

Here is a link to a place that will do TB boring. It's MaxBore I haven't done it yet but still might in the near future. Then on to a PCIII.

I'm real pleased with the way my project worked out and it was a lot of fun doing.

Philip
"It's a great bike but I can make it better".

04 R1100S BCR # 195
03 R1100S BCR #44 R.I.P. new home with 'onekiwi'
Adjustable cam sprockets
Milled heads .025
Larger Valves +2mm intake & Exhaust
Ported and polished heads (just a little)
SJBMW Exhaust Accelerator Kit (modified)
Laser Exhaust
InDuct
SJ PowerFilter
Laser 2 spark Chip
K's 3.5 bar regulator
Ohlins
Sargant Seat
Throttle bodies matched to rubber mounts matched to heads
Throttle bodies venture steps smoothed out.
Exhaust pipe welds ground down
Spiegler SS Brake Lines
LED tail/stop light and turn signals
Aux Fuel Tank (6.8 gallons total)

[shreddr]

i am thinking i can make the majority of the changes i need on the heads: porting, bigger valves, milling, exhaust accelerators, bored throttle bodies, and matched intakes, maybe cams or cam gears (i am a bit fuzzy on this) top this off with a custom burnt chip, and i ought to be good to go until the HP comes out. besides i do like the fact i can throw the two-up saddle on and take a passenger out if i want, that will be only a memory on the R12 or HP

[Jeff Williams]

shreddr,
IMO except for exhaust,cam, intake system, chip, and maybe a fuel management system its not worth it to do anymore to the engine.
The key is the suspension !
That where you want to put your money.
If you don't believe me I know a guy who borrows,(Ivan), my Rt airhead and passes R1200s, modified 1100s, and gsxer, in the tight stuff.
cya
jeff

[shreddr]

PMC did you ever dyno the modified bike?

[shreddr]

when you say fuel management system are you refering to the different fuel regulator, and if so, are all R11 regulators the same or did the BCR get a better one?

[pmc847]

Dyno run

Here's the dyno run. There's more there, just need to tweek a little.

Philip

[Jeff Williams]

Shreddr,
the poor mans management system,(mine as of now), is the K fuel reg which has 3.5 bars of pressure instead of 3.0 bars.
Their is the power Commander system but IMO it has starting flaws and other issues. N8 and the BMW factory team used a system from the F1 cars which a company converted to a plug and play system for BMWs.It will work on other bikes. I'm supposed to be testing one of thesein the next few days,(Robert Hint Hint) Robert Foster,(foster Rad, ie Boxercup), http://www.fosterrad.com/ will be selling them. I'll give you a report as soon as it happens or give him a call or pm him
cya
jeff

[NakedRider]

Originally posted by Jeff Williams
shreddr,
IMO except for exhaust,cam, intake system, chip, and maybe a fuel management system its not worth it to do anymore to the engine.
The key is the suspension !
That where you want to put your money.
If you don't believe me I know a guy who borrows,(Ivan), my Rt airhead and passes R1200s, modified 1100s, and gsxer, in the tight stuff.
cya
jeff

Jeff, was it Ivan than had your RT on the Tahoe leg of the Triple Crown last year? If so, he did some pretty impressive riding even two-up.

[Jeff Williams]

Cadave,
yep that was Ivan on the old 95 R100RT. you should see him when he had his earily 90's Honda F3 last year. You had to watch him when he was in the lead because parts kept falling off his bike. He had a 3 tone black Rustolium paint job, runs and all. It was too plain so he pulled off the stickers he had painted over and put some Krylon lime green test strips on the side. What a piece of shyte.
Jeff

[tomn]

Riding on street going from R11 to R12 does seem a bit extravagant, if I were going from R90S or R100 airheads to R11 or 12 seem large enough difference, would I go from R1100GS to R1200GS? prolly not, IMHO. Isn't like just 3 model years in Japanese bike development? I would stick to R11S and maybe go to the next round, if there is such thing or K12