fim tuning for lennies' S

lennie · 02:26 AM

As you are probably aware from the Granya post, I had my S tuned by Mr FIM himself on Monday. I took some shots and asked Duane if I could post them.

After riding from Walwa through to Apollo Bay Sunday, I set out for the remote location where FIM is based Monday morning. It was a good ride but I missed a major landmark and ended up another 10 kms past the turnoff for FIM. That will teach me for enjoying the Great Ocean Road too much.

Upon arriving we set out to strip the bodywork and uncover the CPU to attach the pick up cable, and install the FIM Lambda. Duane was amazed at how modified the underneath of my bike is when we got the bodywork off. It took about half an hour to get it set up and we loaded it onto the dyno.

This is a dyno Duane has built himself from many years experience in the industry. It even has a brake that can simulate on road loads and uses it for the Ducatis. He has programmed it all into the software the brake allows the bike to experience simulated road conditions to enable him to more accurately measure fuel loads based on gear ratios etc.

He got everything connected and we fired up the bike. After a couple of runs for warm up. he commenced his testing process of throttle position and rpm points capturing the required data. This process in itself is involved and takes some time. Once completed I was party to an educating description of the process and viewed the data on graphs and other tables. He told me that he does not alter the map below the 10 degree open throttle position. This would explain the popping some of you might experience. We analysed the data and discussed the merits of retaining the VariReg as the numbers upto 10 degrees were good and it already ran very good.

It seems my bike was quite rich with the Epicycle VariReg in many areas with upto 20% in a few places but more commonly in the 9 to 15 % range. There were other areas where it was actually lean by upto 9 % and Duane was amazed I was happy with the way it ran. After copying a stock map, he applied the auto correct program and burned a new chip. This process was repeated twice to complete the dyno testing and data logging side.

We retired to the house from the shed for a nice cup of tea and Duane disappeared into his office to analyse some interesting numbers from the final run. He completed this and we installed the new chip and we were ready for the test ride.

One of the things he gauges is a CPU error loading. Mine started out at around 1162 and a good reading is around 600. The final reading for my bike was 542 which is an excellent result.

Next stage. I fitted my crash test dummies test ride gear and took it for a 30km run back up the Great Ocean Road scaring the crap out of quite a few people along the way.

I cannot express enough the difference the mapping made to my bike. Pulled cleanly, ran stronger and was extremely crisp on throttle response. It drove out of corners hard with less throttle and was really surprising just how strong it was.

I returned to let Duane know I was very happy and we put the bike back together for my return to Melbourne. I spoke to him about the extra tuning for the combos to include the SJBMW Powerfilter and he has agreed to get on with it as time allows. No time frame, but he realises the demand and will get to it.

My trip back to Melbourne reinforced my initial ride that the bike was much much better than before. It cruised with a little less throttle and I am hoping to get much better than the 17 kms/litre from the Wodonga to Geelong run of 321 kms.

Brads R1150R was there and looks just like the one I got to borrow a few weeks ago. Duane is getting ready to complete some maps with this one as well.

When you talk to people on the phone you eventually get an image in your mind. Duane was shorter than I expected and I was taller and thinner than he expected. I will have to not develop those kind of images in future.

I have attached a few photos for you to look at.

The weapon on the dyno and the maestro himelf. This guy really knows his stuff.

The laptop.

The PC.

They even talk to each other.

The CPU attached to the weapon with other bits of electronics.

This is what the whhel looks like at about 180 kph.

Crash test dummy after the run.

I hope this is good reading and interesting enough.

Micky Motor · 02-25-2003, 04:37 AM

So Lennie, how much more horsepower and at what RPM?

Don't you have any charts?

M Motor

motoyoyo · 02-25-2003, 08:22 AM

Lennie, what chip did you have installed before Duane modified the mapping? Was it a stock chip or one of the FIM production units? If it was an FIM unit, I'm just curious why it would have been so far off unless you have additional modifications that it didn't take into account.

I just got back from a 700 mile trip and noticed that my Staintune/Induct/SJPowerFilter/FIM chip bike ran rather rich without the baffles for some reason. I put the baffles in on the last half of the ride and the bike pulled stronger and smoother everywhere. Not exactly what I had expected, but it was nice, and quiet as a bonus.

roger albert · 02-25-2003, 08:42 AM

What you describe sounds a lot more like running lean than rich. A LOT more. Other than perhaps at some small rpm range where there could be flow inversion due to a resonance point, there is no way that removing baffles makes the motor run richer, or installing them out makes it run leaner.

On what you you base the rich running? More visible soot?

Just trying to reconcile your symptom and cure.

curiously
roger

pmc847 · 02-25-2003, 08:59 AM

What mods have you performed? Is you ignition advanced? Do you have the cat plug in or out? If possible please post grafts.

Philip

motoyoyo · 02-25-2003, 09:07 AM

Roger, I was experiencing significantly more fuel consumption than two other stock R1100's that were along on the same ride. This may not have been a fair comparison but there were other indicators as well. We had to run through a particularly nasty section of road twice in the same day. It had been freshly covered with sand from a recent snowfall, and I had to take it extra slow at barely open throttle positions for about 15 miles. The pass was not particularly high at around 5-6K feet.

Once through the section the bike was blubbering like a fiend on any mild acceleration. The guy behind me said he could smell a strong fuel odor coming from my bike. It took several miles at high rpms to get things back to normal. The next time through the section I had the baffles in and didn't have any of the same problems. Everything ran smooth and sweet. I know it doesn't really make sense, but that's just what I observed.

The reasonance you mention may have been a factor since there was a noticable rough spot in the aceleration without the baffles in. This is also the spot where the blubbering would occur. With the baffles in there was a much smoother transition on aceleration and the resonance was almost unnoticable. Kinda wierd, but I don't want to make a big deal about it, since the bike seems to run great with the baffles in.

roger albert · 02-25-2003, 09:11 AM

Hi, not trying to make a big deal either. It just seems to violate basic physics and the way the motronic works. I'm sure it doesn't violate physics, but it violates my understanding, and I'm nearly as disturbed by that

The resonance could account for the rough spot and poor economy if continually operating at or near that condition, but is still not consistent with broadly higher fuel consumption.

Did you truly see better consumption with similar throttles and loads, but with the baffles in? This is interesting.

roger

lennie · 02-25-2003, 12:04 PM

Motoyoyo,

My bike ran the stock chip from the factory. I have some extensive mods that have been done over the last 4 years. I used extra fuel pressure to get the bike to run better and this is why it was running rich.

We have experienced better throttle response with the baffles in on a number of bikes more likely due to extra back pressure.

I run sound restrictors reducers that are smaller than the headers with no actual performance loss.

Micky,

The dyno is not calibrated yet so the numbers are irrelevant. It actually produced more on this dyno, but I will have to get to the local Dynojet to see if I can actually measure it.

rob_wijhenke · 02-25-2003, 12:08 PM

I guess Lennie's HP is his secret. But if we all keep on asking he might reveal it to us...

Lennie, how much?
Lennie, how much?
Lennie, how much?
Lennie, how much?
Lennie, how much?
Lennie, how much?
Lennie, how much?
Lennie, how much?
Lennie, how much?
Lennie, how much?
Lennie, how much?
Lennie, how much?
Lennie, how much?
Lennie, how much?
Lennie, how much?

Who's next?

lennie · 02-25-2003, 01:13 PM

Rob,

I need to get to a Dynojet dyno here in Launceston in the next week or two.

I know that it was extremely rich in the top end and it should pick up a bit of hp by the feel of the throttle.

On road and seat of the pants feeling is that it gets there quicker and smoother than I am used to. It is even very deceptive at just how it runs now.

I promise that I will get the run done, but do not get disappointed with the results. I have done some significant mods since the 100 rwhp runs from before. I have changed the cams, the airbox, tank intakes, airfilter and the exhaust. I am hoping that it at least makes the same or better but would not be surprised with the way things work from the chip tuning that it may run too rich to get the best result. If it makes the same then I know the airbox mods, cams and exhaust at least work.

Trevor Rossack · 03:06 PM

Lennie
It must have been a very interesting day at Duane's, I sure would have liked to have been there to watch the entire process. Thanks for the photos and story. Sounds like you are well pleased with the results.

Micky was taking the micky (look at his posting)- Dynos were part of a discussion some of us had on the weekend.

Too many people place too much emphasis on dyno graphs. A dyno is a useful tool to monitor progress of any changes made to a machine. It is most relevant to the dyno that is being used. It is ridiculous to compare figures from one to another and dynos do lie. It is hard sometimes to get consistent readings on the same bike (no changes)but on different days. Most dynos can not take into consideration the ram effect of the air at speed.

Cheers
TREVOR

lennie · 02-26-2003, 07:29 PM

Trevor,

I know Mickey was taking the Mickey about the graphs. I personally don't care about the power as I can create more peak with a loss in the midrange. The torque gets you off the line, throught the midrange to the peak power up top anyways. Just my $0.02 antways.

Duane does not place a lot of importance on the numbers anyway. He has data logging equipment and the experience to be able to make the required changes to get the power through correct fuel/air ratios. He is one smart character. I was told he was "the man" when it came to fuel injection and I wholeheartedly agree.

I called him on my return to Melbourne to let him know I was over the moon with the results and he was very "humble and gracious" for the postive feedback and also in the knowledge I was a very happy customer.

The dyno, like you say, is a tool and in most cases measures one particular facet of a car, bike or whatevers performance. Wide open runs that can give you a graph.

It is the acurate measuring of all the throttle postion and rpm coordinates and the loading of the rear wheel to simulate road conditions that give the real world results we all really need. This is how Duanes dyno is setup so he can achieve a result in 3 hours instead of 2 days work.

Duane is extremely thorough and gives a money back guarantee on his chips. He states "if the customer fits the chip and the bike does not run better, then he says to send it back and he will refund the money".

In the case of the different tuned combinations, you get the upgrade at postage cost. This is more than fair from any consumers point of view.

I am not trying to commercially put forward his products but only thought it would be interesting for people to see and understand what is done. It took all of 3 hours to strip, setup and tune the bike. Not a lot of money for what was achieved.

There seemed more interest in the great seat posting that Pat did and that is ok. It just highlights what is more important to the general public. Comfort over performance is very true as the extra power and smooth running still don't make up for a sore butt at the end of a long trip.

Well I hope it was informative anyways. Have fun and keep the shiny side up.

Joe · Joe's Garage

Lennie

I've been paying attention.....The only problem is it's hard for Duane to make a chip for every combination and I'm still waiting for his mapping for a TBR system(any open single up system type)with intake snorkel & SJ Power-filter. I have a BBP chip now and it's good on some stage settings at lower RPM's and better at other stage settings at higher RPM's that tells me we need better mapping with this combo. I said this years ago if your not getting a good map you might as well put a K12rs reg in you'll be rich in some areas and better in others just like a mismatched chip but a lot more money in your pocket for buying just the regulator.

I'm glad yours worked out but I think I'm going to try to bribe Eron for his PC3 secrets

Besides It's too far for me to drive to OZ to visit Duane........ I'm in the middle of a suspension, tires and brake overhaul project now then it's time to play with motor tweaking again. I find when brakes ,suspension and adhesion are working right I'm faster then HP improvements anyway.First things first.

tvrla · 02-26-2003, 11:03 PM

Lennie,

It doesn't seem to bother you too much that there was more interest in the seat.

I liked seeing the pictures and finally seeing what you looked like. All different than what I'd expected. Of course!

I'm excited about doing some of the things you've done to your bike. Let us know what changes you have with the fuel mileage.

Terry

lennie · 02-27-2003, 02:40 AM

Joe,

I figured people were paying attention but I am not sure why there was not much response. Maybe people were just awestruck that Duane and I look the way we do. Check Duanes glazed look in the eye.

I agree with you about the K12 regulator as this was the stop gap approach I used. I still run the higher pressure regulator with the chip. The BBPower chip will be close as it can be, but as you said there are many combinations.

We are going to try and get the final piece of the combination tuned as soon as Duane has another high priority project done that is near completion. He really is a great person and extremely customer service oriented. I was totally impressed with his not bull**** down to earth approach.

Australia is a long way to come, and for me, getiing out to Duanes was a long way as well. It is done and I will get some riding in real soon.

If you are lucky Erons efforts may be able to be used to good effect for those with varied combinations other than what is available from us.

Terry,

I am not bothered by it but more surprised it did not ellicit a greater response. But I find a lot of what is written very interesting and inciteful of the people that contribute to the board.

After the weekend comaraderie of the S board people here in Australia, I am sure it would span the many countries in which we live. A common interest in something as good as the S is a great thing.

I bet you thought it was me standing next to the bike and Duane was actually test riding the bike. That is the mental picture we had of each other.

I am still trying to get to the cams as well as some other new things. I will keep them secret until I can get something sorted out.

brad black · 02-27-2003, 03:27 AM

joe

given no one over this side has probably ever seen a tbr system, you'll be waiting a long time.

it's always fun going to duanes to play with bikes. i think i've done it maybe 10 times now, for various things. we used to belt up and down the great ocean road, in either direction, so the dyno makes it much safer, for both rider and licence. there's a couple of great hills that the bikes will pull for a long time toward red line in 5th. you get to give things a good work out. runs them in real well.

brad

roger albert · 02-27-2003, 06:12 AM

Hi all,

Lennie, thanks for the work and sharing it. It's hard to know such a good service is available, but only if you're down under. We're all just jealous up/out here. I for one look forward to seeing more.

thanks again
roger

tvrla · 02-27-2003, 08:29 AM

You blew it and put labels under the pictures. Then again, why would Duane have that big grin on his face from tuning another bike?

As Roger said, the rest of us are jealous. Thanks for taking the time to document and photograph the experience for us!

BTW - I'd be willing to bet that the women riders found other things more interesting than the spinning wheel in that photo.

Terry

Olaf · 02-27-2003, 09:22 AM

Lennie,

Thank you very much for your time and effort regarding the S. I for one have found you post's most informative and enjoyable.

Again, thanks for your efforts!

Jon

lennie · 02-27-2003, 12:48 PM

Brad,

It is a lot of fun and good to finally meet Duane. I at least got to do a fang along the Great Ocean Road with the test after the dyno work. Might have been more interesting with my riding gear on though. It is good to safetly test the bike with zero risk to the rider and a greater control of the testing. The control on its own would achive much better results anyways. I might even get back after the next round of mods.

Roger,

Great mate. No need to be jealous. If you are running one of the combos then you will get a chip so close that it will be really good and you might not notice. Duane was saying that "once you get to a certain point with the lowering of the CPU error, it is a point of diminishing returns. The numbers end up moving back and forth when you are that close". I was trying to speak from experience of how much a difference it makes once the bike is properly tuned. Harks back to the good old days when you finally get jetting right with carbs.

Terry,

I guess I did blow it with the labels. Duane might get that kind of contentment from doing a good job. But then again I think he has done enough of it to not get that happy. Again, no need to be jealous. Between myself, Brad and more importantly Duane, we are trying to get useable combinations together and tuned for all to enjoy. And the girls may have found it boring as well.

Olaf,

Thanks for the thanks.

Again, I was not upset but intrigued at the different responses to mine and many other posts on the board and find it fascinating to understand what gets people going enough to contribute. More often than not, the response are interesting and even quite amusing.