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AZ_porschekid's Avatar
 
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CDL... when do you need one?

Curiosity killed the cat on this one.
If I throw a not for hire sign on the side of the truck, do I still need a CDL if I tow more then 26,001 lbs?
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Old 09-11-2018, 07:18 PM
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Old 09-11-2018, 07:24 PM
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Varies in each state.....26,000 here.....Less if it has air brakes.........
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Old 09-11-2018, 07:27 PM
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As I understand it, it all goes by GVWR, unless you're a farmer. From the discussions I have had it doesn't matter if you're for hire or not. The "not for hire" trucks are normally the guys trying to stay away from getting DOT numbers.
Old 09-12-2018, 02:27 AM
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The Federal Government now sets the rules for interstate CDL. Some states have intrastate and those are their laws. Unless you are in a state with intrastate CDL and the law allows it, yes, you need a CDL
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Old 09-12-2018, 02:45 AM
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This topic is frequently discussed in the RV world via 100s of lengthy threads over the years. The consensus is non-commercial = no CDL required. Many of the larger, heavier 5th wheels and tow vehicles (including mine) are over the 26,001# limit. These heavier trailers were often towed with MDTs or HDTs (at least until the emergence of the Super Duallies in the last 3-4 years rated to tow +30,000#). Yet nobody on these 100s of threads can cite a single example of anyone ever being written up or even warned by law enforcement for a violation.

From a practical standpoint, it is concerning that anyone can walk into a dealership and purchase either a large diesel pusher motor coach or large, heavy 5th wheel and proceed to drive across country -- with no previous experience other than driving a small car around So never assume the guy driving the ginormous RV rig next to you and a few feet away at 70MPH has any clue what he's doing or has ever pulled even a small utility trailer, because they most likely have not!
Old 09-12-2018, 04:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZ_porschekid View Post
Curiosity killed the cat on this one.
If I throw a not for hire sign on the side of the truck, do I still need a CDL if I tow more then 26,001 lbs?
Just to be clear, the 26k lbs. refers to GVWR, not what you are towing, correct?
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Old 09-12-2018, 07:20 AM
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I do DOT compliance for a living - and have been doing so for about 25 years.

First - the CDL requirement is related to commercial driving. That means that you are engaged in some type of business. That business can be hauling things for hire, or it can be your own business, like a body shop, that is transporting customer cars as part of the business transaction. It can also be an automotive related business that is using larger transport vehicles for advertising such as going to the SEMA event.

So step one - are you in any type of commerce? If YES, continue...

Using only the GVWR (gross vehicle weight RATING not the registered weight or actual weight) follow on below. You will find that the air brakes do NOT figure into the requirement contrary to popular belief.

1. Is the combined GVWR of the truck and the GVWR of the trailer over 26,000 lbs (just add the two together)? If YES - is the trailer itself over 10,000? IF YES then you need a Class A CDL. If no - continue...
2. Is the truck itself over 26,000 GVWR? If YES - then you need a Class B CDL (which will allow you to tow a trailer 10,000 even and smaller - if the trailer is bigger you need a Class A).

There is also a Class C CDL but you aren't going to need that with what I suspect you are doing.

Now to cloud the water a bit... some states do require a large vehicle operators license for non-commercial vehicles - Nevada and California come to mind. Gets complicated but as you are in Arizona these don't impact you. Some states may also require an advanced license for air brakes - but these will be a state requirement.

I'll PM you my phone #. You can call me direct and I'll walk you through the any scenario.

angela
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Old 09-13-2018, 06:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laneco View Post
I do DOT compliance for a living - and have been doing so for about 25 years.

First - the CDL requirement is related to commercial driving. That means that you are engaged in some type of business. That business can be hauling things for hire, or it can be your own business, like a body shop, that is transporting customer cars as part of the business transaction. It can also be an automotive related business that is using larger transport vehicles for advertising such as going to the SEMA event.

So step one - are you in any type of commerce? If YES, continue...

Using only the GVWR (gross vehicle weight RATING not the registered weight or actual weight) follow on below. You will find that the air brakes do NOT figure into the requirement contrary to popular belief.

1. Is the combined GVWR of the truck and the GVWR of the trailer over 26,000 lbs (just add the two together)? If YES - is the trailer itself over 10,000? IF YES then you need a Class A CDL. If no - continue...
2. Is the truck itself over 26,000 GVWR? If YES - then you need a Class B CDL (which will allow you to tow a trailer 10,000 even and smaller - if the trailer is bigger you need a Class A).

There is also a Class C CDL but you aren't going to need that with what I suspect you are doing.

Now to cloud the water a bit... some states do require a large vehicle operators license for non-commercial vehicles - Nevada and California come to mind. Gets complicated but as you are in Arizona these don't impact you. Some states may also require an advanced license for air brakes - but these will be a state requirement.

I'll PM you my phone #. You can call me direct and I'll walk you through the any scenario.

angela
My truck has a 10,000 lbs GVWR, my trailer has 17,000lbs GVWR. GCW is listed at 16,500 lbs for the truck. I do the farm exceptions (Incorporated as agricultural), both are used for the ranch out in northern Arizona. I'm at sill for now, so This is more of a what if situation...
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Old 09-13-2018, 09:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZ_porschekid View Post
My truck has a 10,000 lbs GVWR, my trailer has 17,000lbs GVWR. GCW is listed at 16,500 lbs for the truck. I do the farm exceptions (Incorporated as agricultural), both are used for the ranch out in northern Arizona. I'm at sill for now, so This is more of a what if situation...
Farm vehicles are a VERY different animal than anything else in commerce. A covered farm vehicle of your size (combination over 26,000) is exempt from the CDL requirements when used for agricultural purposes transporting directly from or to a farm or ranch. The plates/registration must indicate that it is a farm vehicle (plates will vary from state to state).

Your exception is found in Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulation 383.3(d) - Applicability.

https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/retrieveECFR?gp=1&ty=HTML&h=L&mc=true&=PART&n=pt49.5.383#se49.5.383_13

Additionally, your state may grant more expansive exceptions. Be aware of one thing...Make sure that your use is clearly in support of a farm/ranch. If the use is not - then all bets are off and your combination requires a Class A CDL.

angela
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Old 09-15-2018, 09:31 AM
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