Breakthrough on handspoon skills!

[berettafan]

Recently traded a 45 I couldn't hit squat with for a Sig P226 in 9mm with the RX sight. Nice gun, fills the hands well, shoots butter smooth. Shot decent with it first time out but still wasn't anywhere near making holes that touch at even 7 yards.

So I went to youtube and watched a lot of instructional videos. Found one comment that I though 'hmm, I probably am not doing that so i'll have to try it'.

Snuck out today for an hour and burned through about 200 rounds trying this new technique.

AHA! This **** works! Yes it's almost like cheating with the RX sight but poor grip and trigger control will still make you look bad.

Here's what the trick was: Strong hand grips like a C clamp front and back, not like a hose clamp. made all the difference in the world.

The goal is to eventually show up at a local IDPA match and not make a complete fool of myself. Today was a huge step in that direction. Now that I've figured out the grip more or less I'm able to focus on trigger pull. It's also a lot more fun doing actual drills at the range (draw and fire for example) with the goal of competing as opposed to just shooting at paper.

I shall update the group as my career goal of being not quite the worst handgun shooter on the east coast progresses.

[vash]

so only pressure on the front and back of grip?

[flipper35]

And the heel of the weak hand fills the gap on the finger side of the strong hand grip for more surface area on the grips. Though I have a hard time both thumbs forward since I grew up on revolvers.

[Tobra]

That makes sense, all the force to take it off target is in that plane. Death grip will make your barrel wander.

[Seahawk]

This is the grip that works for me. Long video but it sounds like what you are doing:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJrA7wMXuuQ

[berettafan]

I honestly can't believe how long I've been doing it completely wrong. never paid much attention as I'm not really big on pistols and rifles. but now that I've found a game where I can actually get proficient with it I'm going to work harder at it.

[berettafan]

Originally Posted by vash

so only pressure on the front and back of grip?

pretty much yes. like tobra said it seems pressure on either side contributes to pulling the gun around. instructional videos always seem to emphasize pulling straight back with the trigger too.

one thing this red dot does for you is show you real time, without even firing a shot, just how much the gun jumps around if you're not really focused on it.

[berettafan]

videos I've found helpful include Sig Academy (various, the guy in them is super relaxed and really helps open your mind up to what matters and what doesn't), Hikock45 (has a video talking about how 'accuracy' in pistols is nonsense for practical purposes and demonstrates it with an Ed Brown vs a factory Glock) and a few others with pro shooters including Jerry Miculek (great comments about bringing the gun to the eye and not vice versa).

with some more practice I think I'll find I can shoot decent without the red dot. will be fiddling with that some as you can leave the dot off and still see the sights.

[John Rogers]

Some times when doing my range safety officer duties at our outdoor range in Dulzura I go up to the pistol ranges to see what is happening and shoot the bull with some of the instructors or military RO's. Most of the time they tell the students "you have to do it this way" and even if that way is not working they make them keep trying. There are several instructors that will have the new shooters try something different until they find something that works. Looks like that is what you did and it a good thing.

[Seahawk]

Originally Posted by berettafan

videos I've found helpful include Sig Academy (various, the guy in them is super relaxed and really helps open your mind up to what matters and what doesn't), Hikock45 (has a video talking about how 'accuracy' in pistols is nonsense for practical purposes and demonstrates it with an Ed Brown vs a factory Glock) and a few others with pro shooters including Jerry Miculek (great comments about bringing the gun to the eye and not vice versa).

with some more practice I think I'll find I can shoot decent without the red dot. will be fiddling with that some as you can leave the dot off and still see the sights.

Cool.

[flipper35]

We use snap caps with a Laserlyte insert to check trigger control. It really shows how much you move the hand spoon when you pull the trigger.

A lot of people put too much finger through the guard and across the trigger too.

Just my .02 and I am no way a world class shooter, but I can clean the Texas Star with a S&W Model 28-2 as quick as anyone around my parts. Quicker with the 1911.

[Tobra]

Originally Posted by berettafan

one thing this red dot does for you is show you real time, without even firing a shot, just how much the gun jumps around if you're not really focused on it.

Try putting the dot on target and compare what happens when you use new and old grip technique.

If you draw down and squeeze as you acquire the target, rather than try to put the dot on there, think about it and then squeeze, you will do much better too.

Originally Posted by flipper35

A lot of people put too much finger through the guard and across the trigger too.

This greatly contributes to pulling you off line.

Tip of finger on the trigger, well past the last knuckle is the ticket.

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally Posted by Tobra

Tip of finger on the trigger, well past the last knuckle is the ticket.

Exactly. More like pressing a button than pulling on a lever.

[berettafan]

Hey Seahawk that video is one I had watched. Very clear instruction. He talks about support hand fingers opening at a 45 deg angle I think. That also was eye opening.


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[VincentVega]

Originally Posted by berettafan

I shall update the group as my career goal of being not quite the worst handgun shooter on the east coast progresses.

Thats funny. I might be your competition.

[Tobra]

Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins

Exactly. More like pressing a button than pulling on a lever.

Yeah, pushing a button, perfect.

[masraum]

Himm, interesting. I'm going to try this. Thanks.

[Eric Coffey]

Originally Posted by berettafan

pro shooters including Jerry Miculek (great comments about bringing the gun to the eye and not vice versa).

Yep, that's a good'n.
You should also try to incorporate good isometric tension (push/pull) and have your support hand do the lion's share of the "clamping force" for a more relaxed trigger finger on your strong hand.

If you want to add another layer/technique, you can try torqueing your grip a bit (pinch-grip) which drives your hand higher and "into" the gun more. Sort of like the difference between gripping a golf club vs. gripping a hammer.
You can also try moving your support hand up/forward by one knuckle. Basically you want to be as high up and forward on the gun as comfortably possible.
You might search YouTube for Bob Vogel on grip technique. I think he has a couple vids to demonstrate and explain it better than I can.

ETA: Dry-firing should help build muscle-memory/strength as well, and it doesn't cost anything.

[id10t]

Only pistol accuracy I really care about is with my 22s - and t hen only because we use 22 pistols to shoot golf balls at 50 yards (yes, we use a bench/rest/bag). Beyond 15-20 yards was impossible for me until I put a 2moa red dot sight on the Ruger Mk II.... Now I can get 7 or 8 out of 10 at 50 yards.

[gsxrken]

Thanks for the link. Growing up progressing through pellet guns, .22 and then numerous centerfire calibers, we got very good relatively speaking at rifle shooting. I can still recall my disgust the first time I had an opportunity to try handgun shooting. To this day, ringing a silhouette plate at more than 50yards is an accomplishment. Last year we attended the Sig Academy in NH and came away with a lot to work on, but the locked out support arm/hand was a big one for me. I had been locking out the right hand and support arm was hinged slightly. For years! Now I need to unwind that with a lot more time behind the gun practicing properly.