The Fed...I was not correct....

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Originally Posted by Sooner or later

The problem started decades ago. LTCM went bust and we ignored the problem and let it build.

Watch The Warning on PBS Frontline. Read up on Brooksley Borrn and how she was railroaded out by Greenspan and his cronies when she had the gall to suggest we needed regulation in the derivitive markets

Speaking of the devil, Mother in Tucson (who politically is to the right of Attila the Hun conservative) is a friend of his...She used to pass stuff I had written to him, some of which he disagreed with (before 08) and some he agreed with...

[sammyg2]

Originally Posted by Sooner or later

Sam, without fed intervention in 2008 the money supply would have dried up. There would have been little money to lend. With less money to lend rates would have climbed significantly. Fewer auto loans. Fewer home loans. Fewer business loans. An even deeper recession if not worldwide depression.

I have a slightly different perspective.

[sammyg2]

President: Mr. Gardner, do you agree with Ben, or do you think that we can stimulate growth through temporary incentives?

Chance: As long as the roots are not severed, all is well. And all will be well in the garden.

President: In the garden.

Chance: Yes. In the garden, growth has it seasons. First comes spring and summer, but then we have fall and winter. And then we get spring and summer again.

President: Spring and summer.

Chance: Yes.

President: Then fall and winter.

Chance: Yes.

Benjamin Rand: I think what our insightful young friend is saying is that we welcome the inevitable seasons of nature, but we're upset by the seasons of our economy.

Chance: Yes! There will be growth in the spring!

Benjamin Rand: Hmm!

Chance: Hmm!

President: Hm. Well, Mr. Gardner, I must admit that is one of the most refreshing and optimistic statements I've heard in a very, very long time. … I admire your good, solid sense. That's precisely what we lack on Capitol Hill.

https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Being_There

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Originally Posted by Sooner or later

Sam, without fed intervention in 2008 the money supply would have dried up. There would have been little money to lend. With less money to lend rates would have climbed significantly. Fewer auto loans. Fewer home loans. Fewer business loans. An even deeper recession if not worldwide depression.

Agree...

It wasn't Derivatives that killed the Beast it was what the D's were based upon that killed it...Namely that Home Loans were being made to people who had no business getting them...they were not credit worthy.. It was all done to keep the game of musical chairs going for as long as possible..

After 2004 16% of the economy was based upon home construction...Home loans were the last refuge of keeping the illusion of a prosperous and robust economy alive... Without that juicing of the system the economy would never have come out of the doldrums that befell it in 2000...Before 2000 Equities were what was propelling the economy.

The 1990's were not the prosperous decade that everybody likes to fondly remember...the illusion was like cotton candy..You had a revaluation upwards of assets after the Cold War, Technology was making America more productive as it was displacing workers, aka Killing the MC which started in the mid 80's when Corp's like IBM got lean and mean, you had the Entitlement Payroll Taxes HIDING the real Federal Deficit..(a lessor Defense Budget because there wasn't a Cold War anymore to suck money in a black hole)...

RE was a black hole in the 90's...till the end of 97.

Unfortunately most people can not see beyond their noses by thinking it was the D's market that done ya in...You have clarity to look beyond the obvious to see what lies behind the curtain..

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In 1970 or so a fundamentalist Christian Hal Lindsey wrote a book entitled, "The Late Great Planet Earth." Which equated modern events to the Book Of Revelations in the bible. If one wants to think about it his observations were harbingers of what has come to pass in America. So the question becomes what was Lindsey seeing that caused him to make the correlation?

Simply one thinks that Lindsey was seeing the same kind/tenure of things happen in 1970 America that John saw in the Roman Empire in the 1ST Century AD. You have to skim off the religious connotations to see the similarities in underlying dynamic (emotional) of each of those times. Both were times of increasing instability and loss of ethical and moral virtues.

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Originally Posted by sammyg2

https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Being_There

I like to watch....

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I get upset when I see smart people not getting it, even after I lay it out for them. They don't rethink their own perspectives by questioning their veracity. They don't think where is my mistake..how do these facts work into the equation?