Sharps replica - paper cartridge

[flipper35]

OK, we inherited a Pedersoli Sharps Carbine .54 caliber and it is a paper cartridge rifle. I understand the basics, you roll the powder and round into paper and when you close the breech it cuts the paper releasing some powder into the tray which ignites when you drop the cock.

How do you go about rolling things the right size? What paper do you use? How do you do all this stuff?

I don't have a picture yet, but can post if it helps. I figured all y'all know enough you didn't need a pic anyway.

[Tobra]

I suspect Jeff Higgins will be along presently

[legion]

I'm sure this is all well-documented online.

Unfortunately, youtube banished all firearm content, so I think you have to go to pron sites now.

[flipper35]

I have looked on line and it hasn't been terribly helpful when you have questions on how to accomplish parts of it. All I learned in my OP is from reading/viewing online.

[sc_rufctr]

Do you have a range near your house with black powder shooters?

It may be best to talk to someone who owns a similar rifle. I'd bet they be more than happy to show you how to load and fire it.
& it may be best to get someone to check the rifle for safety reasons.

[Bill Douglas]

I hope this helps. Page 16

https://www.davide-pedersoli.com/uploads/supporto/15CARTRIDGE_GUNS_MANUAL.pdf

[flipper35]

Originally Posted by sc_rufctr

Do you have a range near your house with black powder shooters?

It may be best to talk to someone who owns a similar rifle. I'd bet they be more than happy to show you how to load and fire it.
& it may be best to get someone to check the rifle for safety reasons.

I have not met any at the range that fire this style, mostly true muzzle loaders. We inherited a couple of those as well, plus a muzzle loading shotgun.

Looks like Bill is Mr Awesome of the day.

[John Rogers]

Here are several websites to show what to do. Make sure to use real black powder as substitutes don't work well with paper.

https://www.wikihow.com/Roll-Paper-Cartridges-(Reenacting)

https://www.guns.com/news/2017/01/26/how-to-make-combustible-paper-cartridges

https://svartkrutt.net/articles/vis.php?id=51

Cast Boolits

Companies: Buffalo Arms

[Jeff Higgins]

You can get everything you need from Dixie Gun Works or Buffalo Arms.

The two big things are the correct bullet mold and what is known as "nitrided" paper. The nitriding process basically turns it into "flash" paper, allowing its complete combustion in the chamber. Plain paper makes a real mess and really slows down the shooting.

Ignition is via a standard percussion cap (or the larger "musket" cap) placed on a nipple, just like a muzzle loader. That is why the Sharps pattern rifle, even in the later metallic cartridge versions, is a side hammer.

These things are inherently very messy to shoot. Without a cartridge to seal things up, you get a lot of leakage past the breech block. Soot and fouling everywhere. High pressure gasses come out much like they do on a revolver, where they escape between the cylinder and barrel. These seal better than that, but they can still spit enough to hurt. You left forearm (assuming you are right handed) takes the brunt of it. Don't wear short sleeves...

I used to shoot mine mostly as a muzzle loader. Just keep the breech block shut and load it from the front. Rolling the paper cartridges onto the base of the bullet is an honest to God pain in the ass. I finally got rid of it to a Civil War re-enactor kind of guy who was just tickled to have it.

[tabs]

I have had a Farmingdale Shiloh Sharps 1863 New Model Military Rifle since before Christ was a kid..54 caliber.

It is really not that hard, nor really that time consuming rolling you own..I used a Lyman 54 Minie ball mould for the slug, and a kit from Shiloh (when they still offered them).

Basically you roll a piece of Nitraid paper around a wooden dowel, use a paper glue stick to seal, twist the bottom to form the cartridge, pour the black powder into the paper cartridge, seat the bullet down into the paper and dip the end of the bullet and paper cartridge into some melted Bees Wax to hold the bullet in place...It also provides lubrication for the bullet to keep any fouling down.

After evey shot blow down the barrel to extinguish an burning embers left from your last shot.

Really easy peezy...and they are a hoot to shoot....you get a feel of exactly what it was like back in the day.

If I hunted with black powder muzzle loaders a breach loading rifle would be the only way to go for ease of loading in the field.

[Bill Douglas]

I'm pleased to help Flipper.

If anyone has a firearm without the manual; this site has manuals for hundreds (thousands?) of guns including odd and uncommon ones. https://stevespages.com/page7b.htm

[fred cook]

Originally Posted by flipper35

OK, we inherited a Pedersoli Sharps Carbine .54 caliber and it is a paper cartridge rifle. I understand the basics, you roll the powder and round into paper and when you close the breech it cuts the paper releasing some powder into the tray which ignites when you drop the cock.

How do you go about rolling things the right size? What paper do you use? How do you do all this stuff?

I don't have a picture yet, but can post if it helps. I figured all y'all know enough you didn't need a pic anyway.

The only thing Jeff left out was to use a wood dowel to roll the paper tubes to the proper size with the bullet at the end of the dowel and inside the paper roll. A little glue and you are ready to add the powder and fold the end of the paper. Dixie can fix you right up!

[flipper35]

Awesome info guys. At least now I see where to get everything. The manual says you can skip the paper part if needed, but seems messy/wasteful and I thing the paper will keep it compressed against the round better.

Mostly would shoot as a curiosity so not many rounds per year to go through it. I assumed lots of cleaning since it is black powder.

The kids and I hate to see a firearm go unused, even if it is only a few rounds per year.

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally Posted by flipper35

Awesome info guys. At least now I see where to get everything. The manual says you can skip the paper part if needed, but seems messy/wasteful and I thing the paper will keep it compressed against the round better.

Mostly would shoot as a curiosity so not many rounds per year to go through it. I assumed lots of cleaning since it is black powder.

The kids and I hate to see a firearm go unused, even if it is only a few rounds per year.

Yes, lots of cleaning. Fortunately, the very best solvent in the world for black powder residue is plain old tap water. Clean it up with that, then "clean" it again with some Hoppe's #9 bore solvent (you are really just coating the bore to prevent rust) and you are done.

Black powder really, really likes to be compressed. It shoots more consistently and actually burns cleaner when compressed. That is where these things fail when used as a breech loader - there is no way to compress the powder in a paper cartridge, nor is there any way to compress it if you pour it in loose, without the paper cartridge, from the breech.

That's why I primarily used mine as a muzzle loader. Like any other muzzle loader, you can lean on the ram rod and compress the powder when you seat the bullet. It burns a lot cleaner, and the rifle is more accurate that way. When used in this manner, the breech block becomes no more than a means to clean it easier, since you can pass patches all the way through.

[flipper35]

Well, we do have a ram rod or two here as well. So with this rifle as a muzzle loader can I assume you pour the measured powder in, ram the lead down and put the percussion cap on and go?

[Jeff Higgins]

Yup, just like any other muzzle loader. Just make sure you close the breech block first...

[tabs]

Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins

Yup, just like any other muzzle loader. Just make sure you close the breech block first...

So thats why your powder was falling on the ground...a lesson learned huh?

[Jeff Higgins]

I used to go through a lot of black powder until I understood the nuances of these antique arms.