Start/Stop Ignition explanation
 

Can someone explain to me the benefit?

I loved it in my X5d (220hp) as it went unnoticed but hate it in my Turbo Panamera (550hp) in stop and go traffic it makes driving the car miserable. Can an engine be too powerful for it to be effective? I am beginning to think I will never use it again. Does it make the Panamera that much more efficient? Is it not a bit of an oxymoron; if you were concerned about such a gas savings would have you bought the Beast in the first place.

Pelican logic required......

Helps manufacturers meet regulations...

I hate it in my Jaguar xfs but easy enough to disable it...only have to remember to do it everytime you get in the car...it can not be permanently disabled without unplugging wires..

Probably makes a difference at long stoplights, drive-thrus etc, especially when you multiple it by a bunch of cars.

I’ve never had or driven a vehicle with it and like many of us here have had cars that once you got it to start you just prayed it would stay running, so I suspect I would freak out each and every time it stopped and would wonder if it would restart!

does it make a huge difference to one car and one person's fuel bills, probably not unless they spend several hours a day commuting in stop and go, but then it's not really designed to help your pocket book. It's designed to help the planet.

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So...if your running a/c the car shuts down for a few minutes until the cabin temperature starts to creep up, then the car starts again to bring cabin temps back down...
Doesn't make to much sense but as stated its to try n cut co2 output...

I had it on a ford pickup that I rented. The truck felt like it stalled at every intersection. There was a hesitation when I'd give it gas and then the gas pedal was depressed and the truck would jump forward. I hated it but it was just for a day.

exactly.....

No, freeform has it right; Helps manufacturers meet regulations..

There are no regulations on how long that machine needs to last. It certainly is not very "green" if the machine needs service more often, or worse yet, needs to be scrapped.

Example: Later model Saabs moved the cat closer and closer to the exhaust manifold. This was said to be 'green' as it got the cat up to operational temp's a few seconds quicker. (multiply x # of starts, x fleet size...) Just pay no attention to the fact that those turbo'd cars now had the cat sitting directly below the oil pan. This heated block of ceramic would carbonize/pryrolize the oil around the oil pump pick-up and starve the motor for oil. So, the car lasts 50k miles and is close to totalled. Yay, scrap-heap so Green But at least the placement helped manufacturers meet regulations..

It in my wife's 2016 Cayenne and I hate it, like others said easy enough to turn off just wish it could be permanently turned deleted.

I lol'd and pointed when I saw a newer 911 with ASS at a stoplight here recently. Pretty emasculating system for the driver.

The manufacturers want you to think they’re helping save the planet so you’ll love their cars. There are plenty of third world countries where the auto makers sell cars with far less emissions equipment simply because they don’t have to.

So we should follow the 3rd world countries lead?

Totally spurious experiment. The little beaker is fuel to start a warm engine one time. The large one is fuel used idling an engine for 90 mins. A genuine exhibit would show almost the same amount of fuel in each, because the fuel needed to start an engine in 90 minutes of driving would be about the same as idling for 90 mins. In other words, you would multiply the small fuel sample by about 30 to 40 times. Their own experiment showed that starting and stopping saves about 8% fuel, but they are not doing a blind test and have skewed the results.

That's probably why the Durametric Pro was invented.

So @ 8% savings; 25,000 miles a year would save $540.xx of gas @ $4.00 per gallon..... assuming 15 MPG.

Thanks for input...... I won't use it anymore...... I can have it default to off.

It wasn't all that long ago when vehicles would just refuse to start every now & then, or take quite a bit of cranking to fire up. In order for this stop/start technology to work, the vehicle needs to start instantly each and every time. IC engine technology has come a long way in the last few decades. That being said, I hate this feature too and disable it every time I drive a vehicle so equipped. As mentioned before, it's all about CAFE and CO emission standards.

That’s because you’re doing it wrong. The car will restart as soon as you ease pressure on the brake pedal, at least our Chrysler minivan does.

I anticipate the light changes or traffic so that the engine is running before I move my foot to the accelerator. A manual is even more intuitive.

I found it easier to learn how to use it rather than try to remember to turn it off every time.

When the A/C kicks it back on because you’re at a long light is a little annoying


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I think the conclusion was the car has to shut down for 7 minutes before this feature actually saves fuel.

https://youtu.be/V0Q31YeG8ac

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The old geezer is strong in this thread ...

I avoid city "driving" altogether and if I ever get a new enough car that is equipped with ASS, I'll just get used to it, because it will be an appliance. A 500 hp "Porsche" SUV has a lot more wrong with it than ASS IMHO.

G

just turn it off
or don't put it in neutral (for manual) and then clutch in
or don't push your brake pedal to hard (for automatic) at stop lights , play with pedal so it things you wanna depart

Alternatively you can push the button that turns it off.

what is this thing you call "clutch?"

SmileWavy

i did say "just turn it off" didn't I?


I've had both auto's and manuals with it, I rarely bothered turning it off, because well, It's only a problem if you come into a traffic jam or city traffic with loads of red lights

My GF drives a 2017 Golf and she hates the Stop/Start function. She disables it every time she drives the car.

I haven't confirmed this but she asked and VW can't disable it.

... Also, I know a guy with an X5. His car would stop for no reason. It went back to BMW several times and they couldn't fix it. Eventually they gave him a brand new car.

Not the same thing but new cars as getting so complex, not even the dealer mechanics are able to fix them.

I loved it on my F150. I love it on my M2 (though it takes more coordination as the car has to be in neutral with the clutch disengaged) and I was astonished that our 2018 GTI doesn’t have it.

Now my game in the M2 is to coordinate everything perfectly with the traffic lights . . . Clutch in, shift into first, clutch out, look for idiots running the red, cross the intersection . . .

on my bmw I can code it out with an app and odb2 dongle
I haven't bothered. It only bugs me in tjams and then it's just a button to snuff it

I put one of these in my 2019 Raptor: https://www.autostopeliminator.com/collections/ford/products/2015-ford-f-150-autostop-eliminator Unfortunately it can be coded out by programming with Forscan, but produces other side effects.

On my wife's 2019 VW it can be coded out with OBDEleven.

My wife's 2013 BMW X3 has it. We both hate it. In addition, there is some sort of "bug" in the system where 60% of the time, instead of just starting up the engine again, it gets confused and throws the transmission in neutral and won't start until you put it back in park. Of course it does this right as you're trying to take off at a green light.

bimmercode
+ odb2 dongle (but must be a good one in the approved list)

and you can turn it off

I have a button on my 2015 235 that disables it permanently. . The manual states it will cause excess starter war - not worth it.

Our Macan has that. The first time I drove it around the block it died at the stop sign. Just like my El Camino did when it still had a carburetor. I cussed, then remembered that it was a feature, not a bug!

It is real easy to disable it permanently in the key fob. It is turned off and it never does it now.

I have that "feature" on my highlander.
Hate it.
I can turn it off with the push of a button, until the next time the car is started. It defaults to on every time.

I've pretty much developed the habit of turning it off every time I start the car, but once in a while I forget and it really bothers me.

Also read something about that - I think that was in the latest 000 mag/Book.
The reason it's not always permanently defeatable in cars and comes on by default is that if it did not, the manufacturer would have to certify the car's MPG in all modes (on and off). If it automatically comes on and you have to defeat it each time you start the car, they get away with certifying the car with it ON and do better MPG as a result. Unless I read that wrong.

I'm all for fuel economy but I hate that gizmo. Over the years pros kept saying you do the most damage on engine start, and now we're stop/starting the engine 20x more per day. There's no way it can be good for the engine lubrication / starter wear and the manufacturers only really care about the warranty period. When I asked the Audi techs about my wife's SUV (not permanently defeatable even with aftermarket software) and they said "oh we never had to replace any starter motor".. Sure but how long has this been mandatory, a couple years tops ? not the best test sample...

Just for the record by 2009 F150 does not have it. I like it that way.

Rented a 2010 Hyundai in Europe with ASS, so it’s not as new as we think it is.


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The buick regal tour-x wagon I test drove has this non-turnoffable feature. It CAN be defeated, only by driving the car in manual mode, shifting 1-2-3-4-5-6 etc vs having the car in Drive/park/reverse mode. Basically, if you shift out of drive into manual mode on the shifter as you get to the stoplight, it won't stall. You just have to remember to do it.


I think buick has an oversized battery and starter, which they tout as their solution to the on/off stresses, but my big concern is the startup oil/wear, especially at the turbo. Many of these new engines are these 2 liter turbo/supercharged deals that try to get as much power out of as little displacement as possible. Add in 10 million unnecessary stop/ starts, and I don't see how any of these engines don't blow up.


The new volvo v60/v90 also have this feature, but according to the dealer, can be turned off each time the car is driven. The dealer offered for me to try it out. I said "no thanks" and didn't even want to bother.

I saw a 991/992 or something at a light the other day with this feature. I LOL'd too when it cut off. Something about a 911 doing this is just plain wrong! :D

This is a bit of a stressor for me, as at some point, I will need a newer car, and this seems to be the "new" trend coming down the line. The disposable engine. I really wouldn't want to by a used car with this feature, especially from someone in the city/stop and go commute.

Me: old dinosaur.
Curmudgeon factor: 10.

It is almost funny how different cars of toady are.

On my 1985 911 there is not even a clutch safety switch. It is 100% possible to stand outside of the car, reach in through the window, have the car in gear, and start the engine. It wold be real stupid to do that, so I have never tried it.

I have to check the tire pressure with a gauge manually. Traction control and ABS are 100% mandatory now, and not on my 911.

On my 1986 El Camino I can start it from outside the car, but it has to be in park or neutral. It also has no other modern gizmos. They were built when the driver and operator of the car was supposed to be responsible for the operation of the car.

I can imagine a vehicle in stop and go traffic in San Diego on a 70 degree day can save some fuel. Most folks only keep a car a few years so wear on the starter is no big deal. Maybe in the winter when the heat from the engine remains staying warm while sitting at a light it would be ok.

hey who are you calling "toady" ?;-)

Yeah, that's why I like my current dichotomy. I have a super cheap electric Golf on lease that is wonderful for this stuff. Silent, no stop/start needed, torque up the wazoo, no gas savings required, peanuts for running costs or maintenance.

Then I have a 911 when I want the engine running and could not care less about MPG. It does need refilling annoyingly often though. The Auto start/stop is defeatable on the 911s at least till the 991 AFAIK... With the Wife's Audi it take serious reprogramming and still will not be defeated unless the AC is always on ? $%$#% ??? Or you have to drive in Sports mode which sounds good but can be a little rough at times and holds lower gears. So to defeat their silly mandated gizmo that saves minimal gas, you end up wasting way more gas by driving in sports mode all the time, than you would if it was defeatable permanently. That's "toady's cars" and modern tech for you ;-) Sometimes it's just silly !

Mathematically what you're saying would only work out if the engine stopped for seven seconds every repeatedly for 90 mins... So, 7 seconds off, one second on for 90 minutes (neglecting the 1 second it ran, because im not going to back calculate the total time of the experiment to account for this). The fuel needed to start looks bigger graphically because it's in a much smaller cylinder. If it was in the same size cylinder it would be too hard to see. Probably should have used the same size graduated cylinder regardless to prove the point. Obviously the longer the period the engine stays stopped for, the more efficient the technology is.

The might have screwed up the driving part of the experiment... I also think they should have done it several times with the drivers switching between the cars. I guarantee you I would score lower economy that what ever green peace idiot they used in the other car even if I had the start stop. I always rack up the lowest possible mileage in any car that I own vs. the manufacturer's rating because I use a lot of throttle when I drive.

Speaking of new/recent technology in cars these days...so my truck is so old (2009) I still need a key to start it. My wife and daughter's cars are started by pushing a button. Just thinking ...have stolen cars been reduced because of this? Used to be able to pull the lock out of column and start the car. With a button that's not possible.