You think the men and women who fly F-18s are pussies?
I wouldn't know. I don't know any of them myself.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19vJ27Q5WSg

Intital Ntsb press conference from last week. Not jet A, avgas. Plane touched down well short of runway, sheared off multiple approach lights... .

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Well, we do have people like Col Bobby Efferson or Captain Kim Campbell that brought their A-10 back after having them perforated.

Neither, but Col Efferson had nearly 400 holes in his aircraft and Capt Campbell lost all hydraulics. There are others I am sure, but they both hand flew the aircraft back and landed safe enough. Col Efferson apologized to the crew for not keeping the aircraft on the runway even though the gear on one side was all shot up.

Capt Cambell

https://images01.military.com/sites/...?itok=_DgXKWV0

Col Efferson

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They landed way short. Feathered wrong prop?

Or if it were avgas related the remaining engines may not have been producing full power.

Just received my Collings Foundation 2020 newsletter.

The Wings of Freedom tour will continue this year. Starts today at Deland, Florida. Tampa on Monday. They have a replacement B17 under restoration and plan on having it on the Wings tour within the next two years.

Good to hear that they will continue to fly and share these historical birds.

Why does the FAA allow these to be flown ?

The plane must be long past expiry date.

They do a complete refurb on the planes. They bought the replacement in 2015 and started the process. So they will spend 6 years or so to go through it.

They are due to have a stop at my town this year and I will be on the B25 if they show up. That will give me a trifecta with riding the B24, B25, and the crashed B17. Hell, I might even drop the 2400 to fly in the P51 for 30 minutes.

It is not often one can have a ride back in history. I won't miss the chance.

The tail is still in one piece, in many wartime crashes and downings the tail gunner would be the only survivor. Nothing changes.

How many replacements of these historical birds are left ?

Didn't know these were used for commercial activity such as paid passengers.

No such thing for an airplane. One of my friends has a 1946 Cessna 140. It passes the annual with no issues after 70+ years.

I soloed in a 47 taylorcraft. It’s about maintenance.

And Age is irrelevant if it was bad fuel.

The B24 is the only one still flying. There are several B17 still flight worthy. A lot of P51 still flying.

Collings, along with several other non profits, offer flights to the public. $475 for the B24 flight of about 30 minutes. B25 is $425. P51 (2 seat trainer) is 2400 for 30 minutes and 3400 for an hour. They plan on hitting over 100 cities in the 2020 tour.

You can walk about the bombers during flight. Tail to nose in the B24. You take control of the P51 and they will do aerials during the flight.

You can to a walk through the bombers while they are on the ground for $12. Not much room in any of them. A lot of ducking, crawling, and squeezing to get around.

Warplanes are pretty cool, but not real practical as a commercial tool. The venerable C-47 aka DC3 can be found at almost every large airport. They ares still used everyday to haul cargo and passengers.

There is not one B-52 in service today that is not way older than the pilot. Some B-52 were flown by the pilots father, and his grandfather. The newest B-52 is from 1962. There is nothing else to replace it.

Local air freight company runs a Curtis C-46. Every week they load it with fuel oil and groceries and fly across the inlet to the remote village. Awesome watching it take off.

Looks like they have added a P40 Warhawk to this year's tour. You can get flights on it.

So the lineup coming fo you should include.
B24
B25
P51
P40

There are 40 plus B-17's still in existence. 9 or so are flying with another 5-6 being restored to flyable condition....


B-24's.... there are 2 flyable, Collings has one and Commemorative AF has one. There are another 10-11 in existence.

Not many at all...

at some point, preservation has to take precedence since accidents and loss will happen.

Unless it's a rare, one-of-kind, fly them all as long as possible. There are already plenty in museums that will never fly again. There is no comparison between a static display and a flying piece of history.

Did this when they were out here a few years ago. Very cool indeed...

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1579321214.JPG

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1579321071.JPG

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1579321071.jpg

I'll speculate that this one had engine trouble causing it to miss the runway.

Looks like the last B-17 crash in 2011 was also due to engine trouble, fire from a fuel leak due to a fractured weld ...
I'll agree with earlier comments that the statistics do not bode well here.

NTSB has already said, several months ago, that #3 and #4 props (R side) were both feathered (engines not running).

The fuel quality checked out OK (no water or contaminants).

Also, FWIW, the flaps were not extended.

I think the flights should be longer.
A lot of wear-n-tare is from full throttle and landing stresses.
The extra fuel cost would be marginalized to the entire flight.
They were made for cruising for 10+ hours.

This may not conform with the program intentions, market viability, or total costs of upkeep though.

We know that one engine was out, they radioed that. We don't know that the second feathered prop was out, or by mistake.

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Uggh

Ugh is right.

When I flew on Nine O Nine the flight engineer was a girl. Prior to take off I asked her how she got the job. Did she have any credentials. Nope, nuttin, I just asked to do it and got the job.

When I flew on their B24 a few years later we were required to be seated and buckled in during landing. But it wasn't enforced. There were several people standing looking out the side opening when we landed. Not that the seat belts would have done much good since they were 1945 era.

Wow, that video doesn't sound good for the Collings Foundation.


(FWIW, I have a rain gauge just like the one in the video - behind the guy mounted on the deck rail)

It doesn't make sense to me to have 2 pilots , both well over seventy.
I could understand 1 of them being over seventy, backed up by a younger captain in command.
Somebody with good reflexes and military or civil aviation background.

And don't get me wrong, I'm not against old people flying
But I am questioning the sanity of having them flying big old planes with a lot of passengers...

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WOW! What a beauty! Thats a shame....

Oh man! Not good!:cool:

When I flew in it I sat immediately behind the pilots. Sitting on the floor backed up to their seats (a little lower level). I am sure the two on those seats didn't make it.

We were never giving any emergency exit instructions. No one checked our seatbelts. I had to show the girl I took on the flight how to operate hers. Our "flight engineer " was a young girl. I asked her how she got the job. "I just showed up and asked for it".

I few years later I flew on their B24. Similar pre flight safety measage. Upon landing the "flight engineer " didn't even get everyone seated and belted in. Some were standing and looking out as we landed.

The flights were terrific. I would still do them again. They still send me their annual magazine.

In Texas we have the confederate airforce which has some beautiful large ww-2 birds, I think a b17g? I cant rember. But I got to see them on a static display. https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/CSkAA...PYO/s-l300.jpghttps://s3.eu-west-2.amazonaws.com/a...0239-large.jpghttps://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/a...5614-large.jpg

What was the service life intended to be on a B17? I've seen pictures of them returning to bases all shot up, missing pieces, etc.. I imagine they were designed to be repaired quickly rather than long term airframe life?

The B17s were designed well before WWII broke out, first test flight 1935. I don’t think they were intended to be disposable like the Liberty Ships were. The fact they came back all shot up was a testimony to how rugged they were.