Good post, thanks for reinforcing my point with your perspective.

One of the chicks I dated twice when I was still in high school was mostly looking to have a baby, and get away from her parents. In her mind, she would get knocked up by Mr. Perfect, and they would live happily ever after as adults. It was one of the smartest, and hardest decisions I made, to to think with the big head and not the little head. I saw her a year later and she had her baby, but no husband, he was in jail already, and she was on her own. She went right into the hard world of adulthood and worked as a waitress. I have no idea if she ever moved past that level of job and WIC support. Fortunately it was not my problem.

I have had a job since I was a junior in high school. I made plenty of stupid decisions, in my life. Overall mostly good choices and only a few bone head moves, that were not life changing. I credit my parents as teaching me right from wrong, and the work ethic of do my job and get ahead.

All this may be true, but everyone, and I do mean EVERYONE, has the ability to better themselves and to work hard. I knew a guy from a broken home in Texas that started out as the janitor at a hursing home and was the activities director inside of 3 years. First time I saw him I thought he was going to mug me. My office manager had a couple of drug dealers for parents and made herself into something. I know literally hundreds that have done similarly.

I know plenty that came from solid families that never amounted to schiff, it works both ways.

This. I know some folks that when you hear about their parents and what their parents did you wonder how they every got ahead. And I know some people that are quite well to do, good parents, that have kids that are in jail already for some stupid crap. It all comes down to the individual and their work ethic.

Some people make results. Others make excuses.

It is funny that you have experience seeing people lift themselves out of bad situations, but show a disregard for this persons job, which could absolutely be career. I know a guy that started as counter staff at mcdonalds in grade nine, never worked anywhere else, never went to college and he owns three now, makes well over a million a year. My wife started as seasonal help at the bay, just retail, has never gone to college, worked her way up and now earns me by a wide margin. That fry guy position could work into a very lucrative career, and fast food workers work bloody hard for their money.

Gordo, the man you mention made a career out of owning fast food restaurants, not working there. Working at a fast food restaurant is an entry level, minimum wage job. It is hard work, as is digging ditches and washing dishes. None of these are careers, but can be, as an entry level position, an entry into a career.

This guy that assaulted that woman, IMHO, is unlikely to ever make anything of his life. He managed to work his way up to manager, and parlayed that position into felon.

I know a local man that started mowing yards for a living the week after he graduated high school. He used to cut his uncle's yard, and he was my neighbor. That kid quickly saw pushing a mower was not the best way to earn money. so he started hiring crews, and bought mowing rigs.

He now owns several businesses, and he is a multimillionaire and owns several tree farms, and other companies. He lives in a house in an exclusive gated community, and has a house that is bigger than the country club. No college for him, just hard work, and good service.

it isn't whether a few people can make it from a poor starting line, it is how many people can do so and whether the economy and culture, etc. foster this or retard it

a country that promotes capable people will do well; one where they are retarded or slowed will not do as well

as one example, the US did very well with women in the workforce and execc. positions - but Japan did not

when hp and other US firms started hiring capable women in the Japanese offices, the Japanese firms got a big shock, and changed their practices

the same applies for people born in poverty or near-poverty as for gender issues

Absolutely. My own personal hero in this regard is actually a friend of my two sons. We'll call him "Danny" ('cause that's his name...) comes from the most horribly broken home I have ever personally encountered. The kid was astute enough to recognize that by the time he was 12 years old, and succeeded in having himself declared an "emancipated minor". This was two years before my sons met him.

He moved in with one of his dad's friends who took pity on him. Still not the best environment, but far better than home. He was working full time by then (illegally, here in Washington anyway) to help support his adopted home. Didn't finish high school because putting food on the table was a little more important. My sons met him when they were working their high school jobs at the local Target.

When Danny was old enough to move out on his own and only had to support himself, he was able to cut his hours and finish up his GED. At 20 years old, he landed a job wrenching on garbage trucks for our local collection service. At that point, he moved back in with his mom, who was by then on permanent "disability". His dad was long gone. Now he was taking care of his dipschitt mother, raising his younger sister (because his mother wouldn't), and working full time. So what does he decide to do from there?

He went back to school. A couple of years went by, and his younger sister got a scholarship and went away to school (thanks in no small measure to his tutoring). With her gone, he left again as well.

Fast forward another five or six years to today. Danny is a father, happily married, a home owner, and in possession of a degree in mechanical engineering from the University of Washington. And he still stops by to check on and help out his mother, in spite of having every reason in the world to completely walk away from her.

It's called "character". It can be taught, to a degree. Life circumstances can affect it, to a degree. But those who truly have it - like Danny - will rise above regardless of whatever life throws their way. Those who do not can be "born with a silver spoon up their ass" and still squander it.

At half my age, Danny is my hero, and I tell him every time I see him.

Back on topic in regard to the guy, the guy in trouble. WHY do people always feel they have to react to everything, feel they have to put it right.

Growing up I had hoodlums, we called them hoods, and Maoris always saying things like "Hey Dogface, got ya mothers car this evening?" Trying to start a fight. I'd just say "Yep, lucky she lent it to me, anyway how are ya doing?" The problem went away.

This guy could have said "Why hell Mam, I'll be whistlin' dixie to git you yer fried chicken." Mocking her alleged racial taunt. He has a bit of a giggle at what he got away with saying and the problem's gone away.

That is inconsistent with African American culture

Yeah, sadly we have a lot of that around here. I call it "My d**** bigger than your d****." mentality. I tend to focus on the bigger picture as do the people I associate with.

Because there are a lot of stupid people and in modern society they egg one another on.
See my earlier post about how the N word makes em feel entitled to be reverse racists.

and how folks are generally stupid on the internet.

I think my trajectory was more like a 3rd baseline bunt to beat out the throw to first base,, I stole second on a diving slide/collision, and legged it out the to third on a sacrifice fly ball.

No silver spoon here !

Throughout history there are always people complaining about "the current economy" and how messed up and unfair things are. Some people just complain, many others just start working and get ahead. It is a huge disadvantage to be lazy and expect others in the the world to "play fair" and it is a hard lesson to figure out life just ain't fair.

There is no doubt at all, good looking people have a huge advantage in life. I will never experience that advantage. Intillecence and hard working people have a big advantage. I do think I am smarter and harder working than the average person.

A stupid, lazy and really ugly person has a tough life.

The greatest generation grew up in the great depression.
Unemployment over 20%, bread lines, people fighting for work and people starving. Yet they persevered and most of the ones I've met were good citizens with morals and an incredible work ethic. The hardships made them stronger and better.
So much for blaming it on the economy.

I believe that upbringing and environment have everything to do with it.
If your family, friends, parents, relatives and role models are all low-lifes it will be hard for you to be anything other than that. Culture has a great influence, not genetics.
Do genetics play a part in the development of a culture? I don't know for sure but I believe they do not.

I suggest that instead of giving hand-outs and excuses, we try to fix the real problems. What we've been doing so far only makes it worse.

Teach people that there is a way to do it right, and teach them this is what "good" looks like and this is how we get there. That's how you make it better. But that has to start early before they get ruined.
Deep down people want to be successful and be good citizens, but too often they simply don't know HOW!!!!
No one shows them. They learn how NOT to be good or successful, lots of examples of that. Too many. Spending time in the penitentiary becomes acceptable, expected, normal. And once those bad seeds are sewn it's hard to escape them.


Do they teach economics anymore in school? I doubt it based on what I've seen. Basic free market, supply and demand stuff.
Many grown-ups I've met don't even fully understand that concept and IMO that is a sin.

More educational emphasis needs to be put on trades, shop classes, vocational training, how to balance a check book and how to manage money responsibly. Basic life skills.
Saving money instead of over-spending. Starting at the bottom and working your way up.
Schools need to feature guest speakers all the time, people who can tell the students how they climbed out of the sewer and how the students can too.
Give students the tools to be successful, and most importantly teach them HOW TO USE THOSE TOOLS.
They see others doing well, but really have no idea how to do it themselves. They try to figure it out but it just seems impossible. So they get frustrated. They get resentful. They think its not fair. And they give up.
Then they get desperate and do bad sheit and make it all worse.


Note there was a time in my yoot when I was going to change the world. I was going to make a difference. I was gonna pick em up and set em straight, give them the opportunity and the tools and watch the miracles happen.

Unfortunately the only thing that was learned was how crappy human nature can be and that good habits have to start very young, and it's almost impossible to replace bad upbringing with good.
IOW the more I tried, the more I got screwed and ripped off.
I learned that there is such a thing as a lost cause, the world is full of them. I learned that only a fool ignores human nature and is idealistic instead of realistic.
And as harsh as it seems, the truth is this: there are good people and there are bad people and it's hard to tell the difference sometimes. Other times its obvious if you are honest about it.

It is possible to make a difference but it has to start young and even then, you are lucky if you make enough real difference to notice. But with a good plan and enough support, it can gain momentum and become a movement. It can eventually move the see-saw and really make a difference. Unless PC principal interferes with his agenda.

that's a younger man's fight now.
My plan is to keep the bad stuff at a distance as much as possible, and be prepared to deal with it if it gets too close.

In other news.....
https://www.fox5ny.com/news/new-york-man-claims-to-have-found-joint-in-popeyes-chicken-sandwich

Right on Sammy, very well said.

Quoting Higster:

"So, those of you touting Popeye's responsibility for this are, by insinuation, asserting that Popeye's was negligent in preventing this man from attacking this woman. You are asserting that Popeye's failed to do something. Please, then, explain what that "something" might be. Something tangible - some area in which Popeye's clearly failed. Something you would put in place, in your own business, to prevent an employee from doing something similar."



Jeff, as a Boeing Employee you traveled the world in many foreign countries.

Are you saying, that if you had a confrontation with a local employee while on the clock, that Boeing would not be responsible in any way?