That's interesting and not surprising. I haven't spent much time on BaT, but I did find myself wondering "how do you protect yourself, and how do you know if the car is any good?"

I guess that's my answer. You don't. Seems like it's mostly a porn site then. Nice place for fantasy.

I've driven many of the 6mt Cayenne's and IMHO I think it's not great
Shifts great but just doesn't work right with the rest of the car
I have had a few Cayennes of my own, 09 S currently, and love em but I
think the auto is much better

To me that’s the greatest farce of BaT. People think the comments on BaT are a form of vetting, which is sorta true, but it’s all based on pictures and description. Pictures can hide a lot and pictures don’t give you any realistic perspective on the mechanical condition. You are basically paying top dollar for a car sight unseen. Buyer beware.

Didn’t BAT start out as non running project cars? Hence the “bring a trailer”?

How did it get to be the place to go? Marketing?

I’d never buy a car without putting eyes on it in person.

Without a doubt, some edgy cars make it onto BaT. Usually, you can smell them through your screen but not always. As far as having to rely on photos and description, how is that different than any other sales site online? :confused:

The only difference between BaT and other common sites is the quality of the merchandise and the quality of the photos, plus the fact that you WILL have 7 days or more to arrange a PPI, go see the vehicle or have someone do it for you, ask difficult questions, look at records, etc. You WILL also have an opportunity to buy the vehicle at a specific time but the price will be determined by a fair auction, (no sniping possible). The buyer's fee sucks but it's also the only way to keep zit-faced clowns in their mother's basement from ruining every auction, like on eBay 50% of the time. I sold a car on BaT a while ago and it was the easiest transaction of my car buying or selling life but then I've only done it about 200 times.

If you win an auction, the car is yours. No ghosting by the seller because someone offline offered him $500 more, seller changed his mind, etc... Show me another place where 300SL Mercedes and Ferrari Daytonas are constantly for sale, as well as E55 AMG w211 wagons, early 911s, 996 turbos w low miles, (a constant trickle of those), pristine BMW M-cars not owned by teenagers, etc., etc...

The imaginary site doesn't exist. There is eBay and auto trader where you can look at a couple or few thumbnail photos that are often the size of my thumbnail, no engagement from seller, if something looks like a half-way decent car or deal on CL these days, it was usually sold a month ago or it's a scam, I could go on and on. BaT is far from perfect and I complain about it all the time in their comment threads but it's by far the best site I've ever seen and I've been obsessively hunting down cars online since the internet was invented. If there is a better site, please share it here. :)

I keep seeing people on this site complaining about buying, or the risk of buying a car unseen, or from pictures, or from a written description on BaT.
There are numerous inspection companies all around the country with certified inspectors. They do a good job to the first order. With that you get a written report based on a physical inspection, a driving inspection, service records inspection, and pictures. Its been a couple of years since I used one. I was looking for a 69 corvette convertible. I had 4 or 5 of them inspected before I found one that I flew cross country to do a final inspect and purchase. These inspectors are plenty good enough to do a first order inspection. They will take pictures of anything you ask for, and do a pretty good job describing the car. It cost about $250 for each inspection. Well worth it in the end. I was able to eliminate lots of cars that looked great in pictures, but the physical inspection is what helped sort good from bad. If your going to spend north of $30K for a car it's cheap insurance.

Then you are not buying a car on the internet. What's your point? You are limited to walking on a used car lot in your hometown like it's 1976 and settling for what they have or using local classifieds. I live in the car capital of the universe and I can almost never find what I'm looking for locally. A nationwide search doesn't even always find what I want.

BaT became the preferred portal for selling collectible and/or interesting cars because of the prices paid for really great cars, (and sometimes not-so-great cars), the reason for that is the quality of presentation. You cannot just send them some schit photos and a scant description of you rig and ask them to sell it. They won't do it. They also reject hundreds of cars for every one they accept these days, it's a curated site. They are picky but not picky enough w air-cooled 911s and certain other cars they like, IMO. They will list any C2 'vette on earth, for instance.

A lot of the cars are top flight, absolutely well known cars and sellers in the small world of collector cars. Some of the best of the best get sold there on a weekly basis. I'd put their QC waaaay above Barrett Jackson or other big auction houses but not sure that's saying much. There is plenty of time to look at or arrange a PPI on BaT. It is impossible for a car to get sold out from under you.

I think it is a great auction site, and fun to browse.
Some I click on because I have no idea what they are.
Some I click on because I want to see that color combination.
Then there are a few I think about buying, but never have.

There is almost always at least one car I want to check back on later to see where it bid to. Right now that car is the white 996 Cab with Tan interior.

I sort of suspected that. They did not sell a lot of them, though, and there is a dedicated market for used ones. The one in the OP sold for ~$30k and the very next day, an even cleaner one pops up w low miles:

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2008-porsche-cayenne-gts-8/

I guess that is my point wrt BaT. If you DID want one, where else are you going to find even one, much less two in a row in this condition w 150 high resolution photos, videos, back and forth w seller, etc...

When any particular collector or rare car does well on that site, the others come out of the woodwork and appear shortly thereafter. Where else are you going to find multiple early '80s, ROW 930s w low miles and absolutely bone stock w long time owners and extensive records? I've never even found one publicly offers before that site. There were 3 in a row a couple months ago.

Denis, I’m curious how you say that a car can’t be sold out from under you. Having listed two cars there myself there is nothing that keeps a seller from selling a car to someone else post auction. They take the seller fee up front, the buyer fee on the backside, and they are done. After that point the transaction is entirely between the buyer and seller just like any other sale. Also worth noting that if you buy a car on BaT and it fails inspection, you are SOL. And if the seller wins the auction and flakes out (which has happened), BaT won’t re-list your car.

You obviously love the site, which is great. But ultimately it’s just another auction, they have simply done the best job of utilizing the internet as their sales vehicle. Personally I still have no trouble finding cool and unique cars utilizing other classified sites, and saving a lot of money in the process. Also, I still write more detailed ads then they do.:)

Yep, they seem to have expert-level turd polishers on staff. I passed on a car years ago, only to see it end up on BAT for more money, and with the issues I noted conveniently hidden and/or not photographed.
Totally. I am sure there are plenty of excellent cars that are honestly represented there, but they seem to have a few holes in the net. As mentioned, they are not the only ones. You should see some of the "gems" that roll through Barret-Jackson here in Scottsdale every year. Fools and their money...it will always be a thing, as long as the supply of uneducated and/or non-enthusiast check-writers doesn't dry up. ;)

If you are the top bidder and the item meets reserve, it’s yours. If it doesn’t meet reserve, that 7-day auction is over and it’s back on the open market, yes. Unlike eBay, where good cars constantly get sold outside the auction during the auction, that cannot happen on BaT. If a car gets pulled by the seller during the auction or if other substantial evidence of misrepresentation occurs, BaT will pull it and usually ban the seller from ever buying/selling or participating on the site. Show me where they do that on other online sales sites. On eBay and other sites, a dealer can run an auction while also marketing the car on several other portals plus sell it on the street or their lot. BaT is massively different.

Buyers do occasionally flake but they lose their buyers fee and may be permanently banned from the site, depending on circumstances. I agree w their policy of not re-listing cars, it would be a cesspool like eBay if they did.

Sure, you can find good cars and deals anywhere. I find them all the time and I’ve never bought on BaT. I’ve bid on cars that I regret not going higher on, however, and regret not bidding at all on others. A few extra dollars for something exceptional is a fair trade anytime. The world is choked w “deals” on schitty, average used cars.

You can find cars like this on eBay and CL all the time w 300 high-res photos, paint meter readings and records from new. Right? :confused:

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1994-bmw-850csi-11/

Just to reiterate though, after the sale is “completed” and the fees are paid, there is zero leverage that BaT holds over either the buyer or seller to complete the deal. Banning is their only leverage, but that’s not a very big stick. I agree that it’s a better online marketplace than EBay or others, but I think they intentionally lull people into a false sense of security when they talk about the community vetting.

It's definitely not perfect. Buying a car face-to-face w cash in hand is not perfect either. Getting an expensive PPI from a respected shop, (which I have done), is also not perfect. Things get missed and unpredictable things happen. Frankly, I'd rather see 100 great photos of every inch than anything else.

Do you know of a better internet sales site? I'd love to hear it. :cool:

Hey man, if you think that BaT provides a service that’s worth the premium then more power to you. I personally think it’s more hype than value but everybody has an opinion.

I am not a business person, so for me I may view things differently.

If it is the car I want, at a price I'm willing to pay; then why compare to market prices that may not be that exact set of options?

Those other cars don't matter.

That's how I approach cars too. Pretty much everything else, too, come to think of it.

A good reference point for me is how much participation the seller has in the auction. You always see the auctions where potential buyers are asking questions etc, and the seller never responds...or gets worked up/angry in the response... (red flag) . I definitely trust the ones who are communicative throughout the process and especially the ones who offer its location for people to come look at it if they want, etc.. .

I will say that BaT can make the timeline MUCH better for the seller though as they do not tell the seller when the auction will go live. "It will go live sometime in the next 2 weeks".. That is ridiculous... I travel for work and both of mine first went live during the time I had the least chance to be on the internet..

I agree w the first paragraph completely. As for the timeline thing, the one time I sold a vehicle there, I think they let me know within a small window when it was going up(?) Can't really remember now...