Weekend Warriors, or how NOT to do it.....

[dad911]

From Steve's plumbing thread, and not wanting to derail his thread: weird outside hose bib plumbing - WTF?

Originally Posted by look 171

You guys get creative plumbing out east too? I thought its a west coast thing to find the creative type. We don't have too many creative plumbing here, but a ton of serious creative electrical work we have torn apart over the years. Almost every old house we come across have some type of unacceptable electrical work.

These are a few of things I've encountered in the last few years:

Wires too short? Just tape on an extension:

No need for that pesky plumbing roof vent....


This house also had an intercom that was sheetrocked over, leaving the transformer buried in the wall and powered, and during a prior remodel 2 or 3 of the circuits for the kitchen receptacles were boxed off and buried, leaving the whole kitchen on a single circuit, including the fridge.

Another home we remodeled, built by a national big-builder, had no lighting boxes on the outside of the house. The electrician left tails, screwed the tie-bars to the sheathing/siding with drywall screws, and covered it. Didn't even caulk the coverplates:

[Arizona_928]

I thought this was going to be a thread on those yahoos with big diesel trucks and 5th wheels

[dad911]

Oh well.

Once again I should refrain from posting new topics in the middle of the night.....

[masraum]

Years ago, when we had cable and lived in our own home, my wife watched a lot of HGTV including a bunch of shows where they renovated homes or repaired homes. There was a show with a guy named Mike Holmes that would go into a home and fix work that had previously been done poorly (usually way, WAY out of code) and a lot of what they'd find was horrible electrical hidden in walls and behind drywall.

The pics above reminded me of that. I remember some episodes where they'd get into the drywall and say "we found 25 wire junctions or live wire ends outside of boxes behind dry wall in this room"

[Zeke]

The title is fine.

There are copious amounts of home building and improvement hacks online. Could keep you entertained for hours. The worst I have encountered are spliced electrical circuits inline with no box. Exposed wirenuts to just twisted and taped.

In the days of knob and tube wiring that was how it was done — twisted and taped. But it's really bad when you see modern day NMC (Romex) integrated with a non grounded system and yet installing grounded type receptacles.

[craigster59]

Originally Posted by masraum

Years ago, when we had cable and lived in our own home, my wife watched a lot of HGTV including a bunch of shows where they renovated homes or repaired homes. There was a show with a guy named Mike Holmes that would go into a home and fix work that had previously been done poorly (usually way, WAY out of code) and a lot of what they'd find was horrible electrical hidden in walls and behind drywall.

The pics above reminded me of that. I remember some episodes where they'd get into the drywall and say "we found 25 wire junctions or live wire ends outside of boxes behind dry wall in this room"

I remember that show "Holmes on Homes", filmed in Canada. Good show.

There was an episode of "Extreme Home Makeover" that was filmed in or near Ventura California. The family had a son who was in a wheelchair so the episode dealt with making the home more accessible and featured a huge shower with multiple shower heads.

On those shows they would bring in the crew and knock it out in 48 hours and then do the big "reveal"

Well, it was only a year or so afterwards that the family was in the news, suing ABC. Shoddy workmanship due to the expediency of the project, shower was a moldy disaster, peeling paint, constant leaks and electrical shorts, etc.

To top it off the house was reassessed with the improvements and their taxes went through the roof. Be careful what you wish for.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by craigster59

I remember that show "Holmes on Homes", filmed in Canada. Good show.

Right, that's the one! You can't really tell, but I always got a good vibe off of the guy. He always came across as if he really did want things done right.

There was an episode of "Extreme Home Makeover" that was filmed in or near Ventura California. The family had a son who was in a wheelchair so the episode dealt with making the home more accessible and featured a huge shower with multiple shower heads.

On those shows they would bring in the crew and knock it out in 48 hours and then do the big "reveal"

Well, it was only a year or so afterwards that the family was in the news, suing ABC. Shoddy workmanship due to the expediency of the project, shower was a moldy disaster, peeling paint, constant leaks and electrical shorts, etc.

To top it off the house was reassessed with the improvements and their taxes went through the roof. Be careful what you wish for.

Yeah, my wife used to watch some of those makeover shows. You once you had watched a couple few episodes of each, you'd start getting the feeling that there were things that they didn't show you for a reason. And if you looked the shows up, there would be stuff online saying that they'd show a painted room, but it might only be half painted, the half that the cameras showed.

[dad911]

Holmes rubbed me wrong. Big Ego, point out how the prior work didn't meet code, then proceed to do things in the US that would not pass code here.

Like screwing studs instead of nails. You can't cite code violations then ignore the national building code nailing schedule.

[dad911]

I knew someone that was interviewed to be on house hunters. They already bought the house, were going to be shown two more, then were to pick their own. They didn't go on the show, but once we knew the procedure, it was typically easy to guess which house people were going to choose.

Not sure there is a 'reality show' that's not fake.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by dad911

Holmes rubbed me wrong. Big Ego, point out how the prior work didn't meet code, then proceed to do things in the US that would not pass code here.

Like screwing studs instead of nails. You can't cite code violations then ignore the national building code nailing schedule.

Interesting

Originally Posted by dad911

I knew someone that was interviewed to be on house hunters. They already bought the house, were going to be shown two more, then were to pick their own. They didn't go on the show, but once we knew the procedure, it was typically easy to guess which house people were going to choose.

Not sure there is a 'reality show' that's not fake.

Absolutely.

[908/930]

I think there are some screws that can be substituted for nails, like the ones from Simpson strong tie. Way slower than nailing with an air nailer and way more expensive.

[Nostril Cheese]

I'm really thankful I grew up in construction. I'm amazed at the stuff that people do to cut costs.

Side question... whats with everybody wanting old school mortise locks these days?

[gregpark]

Originally Posted by dad911

Holmes rubbed me wrong. Big Ego, point out how the prior work didn't meet code, then proceed to do things in the US that would not pass code here.

Like screwing studs instead of nails. You can't cite code violations then ignore the national building code nailing schedule.

He rubs me the wrong way too. It's like he hand picks projects with a problem that he can exploit, show how inept the last guy was and how superior he is. Then when he demonstrates the way it should have been done by an expert like himself, and not like that last asinine, he finds even more problems and ends up tearing half the friggen house down. All to boost his own ego. I like Norm Abrams a whole lot more and believe he's forgotten more than Holmes ever knew

[Zeke]

A family on my street was approached, or they applied for, one of the make over shows of the 90's. Work actually started and the payout was going to be a new complete set of kitchen appliances, no cash. It didn't make it through the 2nd day as the director told the husband and wife, "We need a LOT fore drama from you guys.'

Argue about this and that, and so on. They refused to get hot under the collar only for the camera when nothing was actually wrong about how it started off. The crew pulled out and that episode was junked. Honestly, IDK if they got any appliances or not.

I do know that within 2 years the same same couple added a 2nd story and extended the smallish house (1200 sq ft) reward on the lot. About $300K worth. I used to walk down a couple times a weeK and chat with the contractor. He was the boss and on the job every minute. His family did damn near everything up to the drywall — foundation, framing, elec, plumbing (I don't remember if they did the HVAC). Old cigar chomping guy as nice as could be.

The place turned out great even if overbuilt for the neighborhood. About 1500 sq ft of new. And there was no drama. It took 6 months, not a week or so. You should have seen the house after demo. The whole back half was gone, temporarily boarded up and the family lived there throughout the process. If there were ever going to be tenisons, they would have shown up then. The kitchen was temporarily located in the front living room. I'm not sure, but the old original bathroom was spared along with one bedroom.

There were 2 little kids at the time for a family of 4. Now that might have been a show. The young couple across the street did the same deal. It took a good ten years for the 2 houses to reach the value to cover the costs.

[look 171]

Originally Posted by dad911

Holmes rubbed me wrong. Big Ego, point out how the prior work didn't meet code, then proceed to do things in the US that would not pass code here.

Like screwing studs instead of nails. You can't cite code violations then ignore the national building code nailing schedule.

Yep, I remember that. they were framing a building in a wet location. I noticed that screws were used?

[look 171]

I never really pictures of my work. Had I know about this thread, I would have ran out of memory on my phone on the last job. Talking about cluster F wiring. Hold crap. I am surprise the house hadn't burned. Boxes buried all over the place, tape connections hidden between the two floors. Only two circuits feeding the entire upstairs, two bedrooms, two baths, and a den upstairs. A switch must be turned downstairs in the hallway for half the outlets to work upstairs. The same switch controlled the exterior lights. Yikes. We spent three weeks replacing and tearing out almost all the drywall to the whole house. Owner was pleased but wasn't too happy about what was discovered but he had plenty of warning before starting. The wife on the other hand, thinks we are ripping her off because everything is in great working condition.

[Zeke]

Originally Posted by look 171

I never really pictures of my work. Had I know about this thread, I would have ran out of memory on my phone on the last job. Talking about cluster F wiring. Hold crap. I am surprise the house hadn't burned. Boxes buried all over the place, tape connections hidden between the two floors. Only two circuits feeding the entire upstairs, two bedrooms, two baths, and a den upstairs. A switch must be turned downstairs in the hallway for half the outlets to work upstairs. The same switch controlled the exterior lights. Yikes. We spent three weeks replacing and tearing out almost all the drywall to the whole house. Owner was pleased but wasn't too happy about what was discovered but he had plenty of warning before starting. The wife on the other hand, thinks we are ripping her off because everything is in great working condition.

That is the main reason I am not motivated whatsoever to even consult and advise. When the wife wants the work, it's fine. 90% of the customers that contacted me about doors and windows was the wife. Easy sale as the husband usually went along with the wife.
Did Baz recently start a conversation about being pussywhipped?

When you see that coming you get the contract out immediately. But for the rest of the work, women have become ignorant cows AFA knowing what to expect and what makes sense as well as code.

Most of the men of the house aren't much better these days. Best work you can get nowadays is for the elderly. Unfortunately there are so many scammers looking to rip off older people that it's a lot of work to convince them that you are competent and fair.

I live in a completely different demographic than Jeff (look171). Long Beach is as poor as Oakland and Fresno. Nothing but siht work going on in LB unless the city is building something for themselves. Then it's top cabin.

Residential upgrades are on par with cleaning out and upgrading lost cost housing. Because of that finding a good painter is impossible. They all left for the richer areas of L.A. or Orange County.

[1990C4S]

Originally Posted by dad911

Holmes rubbed me wrong. Big Ego, point out how the prior work didn't meet code, then proceed to do things in the US that would not pass code here.

Like screwing studs instead of nails. You can't cite code violations then ignore the national building code nailing schedule.

He was known as a bit of a jerk locally. The majority (not all) of his shows were filmed in Canada, not the US, so some of the codes will differ.

Originally Posted by look 171

Yep, I remember that. they were framing a building in a wet location. I noticed that screws were used?

I know he built house somewhere south, maybe New Orleans? He always used screws in Canada.

[tevake]

I'm puzzled about the screws for framing. I'm well into rebuilding the shop on my place. Have been using screws throughout the project. They go in much smoother than pounding in nails, hold better and can be removed if needed with out distroying everything.

Is there a code issue of using screws in framing? I'm working on my own and winging it.

Cheers Richard

[gregpark]

Screws are more brittle than nails and can break. It's up to local building codes though. Around here the inspectors will not allow pneumatic nailing for certain shear walls because hand hammering sucks it up tighter. But this is California, the land of over reg