Okinawa

[Danimal16]

Today marks the 76th anniversary of the landings on Okinawa.

[john70t]

Weird, I'm watching "War in the pacific" as background noise and it just got to Okinawa when I clicked on this thread. On the bookshelf in front are the books "Typhoon of steel" by James/William Belote and "The battle for okinawa" by Hiromichi Yahara for the japanese perspective,

[Baz]

Thanks, Dan.......the greatest generation........

Here's a good read:

Harrison World War II Marine veteran honored on anniversary of Okinawa invasion

[LEAKYSEALS951]

My grandfather was at hacksaw ridge.
Never spoke much about it.
He and my grandmother never owned a car. Used Bus, Cab, and Trains.
Died in 1978 by Malboro reds.
I guess I'd smoke too.

Thanks granddad.

[Baz]

Originally Posted by LEAKYSEALS951

My grandfather was at hacksaw ridge.
Never spoke much about it.
He and my grandmother never owned a car. Used Bus, Cab, and Trains.
Died in 1978 by Malboro reds.
I guess I'd smoke too.

Thanks granddad.

Thanks for the post and comments, Leaky. Respect to your grandfather! Greatest generation....

[Baz]

From Wiki:

The battle has been referred to as the "typhoon of steel" in English, and tetsu no ame ("rain of steel") or tetsu no bōfū ("violent wind of steel") in Japanese. The nicknames refer to the ferocity of the fighting, the intensity of Japanese kamikaze attacks and the sheer numbers of Allied ships and armored vehicles that assaulted the island. The battle was one of the bloodiest in the Pacific, with approximately 160,000 casualties combined: at least 50,000 Allied and 84,166–117,000 Japanese, including drafted Okinawans wearing Japanese uniforms. 149,425 Okinawans were killed, died by suicide or went missing, roughly half of the estimated pre-war 300,000 local population.

[Danimal16]

Originally Posted by Baz

Thanks, Dan.......the greatest generation........

Here's a good read:

Harrison World War II Marine veteran honored on anniversary of Okinawa invasion

Baz,
This is a great read (long but good). https://www.amazon.com/Tennozan-Battle-Okinawa-Atomic-Bomb/dp/0395599245/ref=tmm_hrd_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=&sr=

[Baz]

Originally Posted by Danimal16

Baz,
This is a great read (long but good). https://www.amazon.com/Tennozan-Battle-Okinawa-Atomic-Bomb/dp/0395599245/ref=tmm_hrd_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=&sr=

Thanks, Dan. Just bought it. $6 on eBay.

[fred cook]

Originally Posted by Danimal16

Today marks the 76th anniversary of the landings on Okinawa.

I was there 50 years ago (Februrary 1971) as part of a small SeaBee group going to start construction on Diego Garcia. We were there for about 2 weeks waiting for our ship to come in (no, really!). There had been some unrest between the Okanawans and the Americans so we were restricted to the base. Spent some time in the EM club playing the nickel slot machine and drinking Japanese long neck beers!

[HardDrive]

I've watch and read a lot about the war in the pacific. Horrifying.

[Danimal16]

Originally Posted by Baz

Thanks, Dan. Just bought it. $6 on eBay.

It is very involved. But the discussion on the bomb, is the most succinct I have ever read. The previous chapters to that lend credence to the wholesale slaughter that was already occurring throughout the Pacific and CBI theaters.

[Purrybonker]

IDK, greatest generation? IDK, All Quiet on the Western Front, Slaughterhouse 5...

I don't see anything heroic or memorable in any of this. I am not immune - I am of Germanic descent- my father was RCAF, my step-father was Luftwaffe. Neither of them romanticized war, ever.

What does that mean - greatest generation? The generation that slaughtered millions of themselves, is that cause for celebration?

It's all human slaughter no matter how you label it. Nothing to be memorialized or celebrated or even justified.

Just forget it FFS and move on...

[Heel n Toe]

Originally Posted by Purrybonker

IDK, greatest generation? IDK, All Quiet on the Western Front, Slaughterhouse 5...

I don't see anything heroic or memorable in any of this. I am not immune - I am of Germanic descent- my father was RCAF, my step-father was Luftwaffe. Neither of them romanticized war, ever.

What does that mean - greatest generation? The generation that slaughtered millions of themselves, is that cause for celebration?

It's all human slaughter no matter how you label it. Nothing to be memorialized or celebrated or even justified.

Just forget it FFS and move on...

It's The Greatest Generation because of how much they sacrificed to stop Nazi Germany and Japan from taking over the world.

How do you not understand that?

Or are you just trolling?

Idiot.

[sc_rufctr]

They are the greatest generation because of what they had to do.
Do you think any of them knew what it would mean for future generations?

- I doubt it... They answered when called and most of them had no idea what they were getting into.

Okinawa: The final death toll was staggering. A huge sacrifice to gain a step closer to Japan.
But it had to be done and it was the best option at the time.

The Normandy landing was also the best option they had but can you even imagine stepping off the ramp at Omaha beach?

Heroes every last one of them. "Lest we forget".

[Danimal16]

Originally Posted by Purrybonker

IDK, greatest generation? IDK, All Quiet on the Western Front, Slaughterhouse 5...

I don't see anything heroic or memorable in any of this. I am not immune - I am of Germanic descent- my father was RCAF, my step-father was Luftwaffe. Neither of them romanticized war, ever.

What does that mean - greatest generation? The generation that slaughtered millions of themselves, is that cause for celebration?

It's all human slaughter no matter how you label it. Nothing to be memorialized or celebrated or even justified.

Just forget it FFS and move on...

Wow, you need to read these books that have been mentioned. I would also recommend that you read "Helmet for My Pillow", "With the Old Breed: At Peleliu and Okinawa", "An Army at Dawn" (or anything by Rick Atkinson), "Last Stand of the Tin Can Sailors", "The Mighty Eighth", "Hiroshima" by John Hersey, or so many others. I would also offer you read "The Blond Knight of Germany", for a German (non-Nazi) perspective. Leon Uris's DocuNovels, "Mila 18", and "QB Seven", are excellent fictions based upon the sacrifices of the free men and women that stood against Hitler's Horrors. With the release of the secret records of the Tokyo and Guam war crimes trials (after 50 years) I am sure new facts will be revealed.

None of the legitimate written history of this horrific war that I am familiar with glorified anything, quite the opposite. Also, the Greatest Generation is a term coined by Tom Brokaw so he could sell a book. I don't see the term as applicable to what that generation actually and willingly subjected itself too. And do not confuse those that served to defeat world wide Facists in the same light as those Facists that sought to force their evil on mankind. The "GI" Generation did not glorify war, they hated it.

As far as "Just forget it . . . ", THAT is exactly what not to do!

[Danimal16]

Originally Posted by fred cook

I was there 50 years ago (Februrary 1971) as part of a small SeaBee group going to start construction on Diego Garcia. We were there for about 2 weeks waiting for our ship to come in (no, really!). There had been some unrest between the Okanawans and the Americans so we were restricted to the base. Spent some time in the EM club playing the nickel slot machine and drinking Japanese long neck beers!

What Battalion were you with? I served with NMCB FIVE on Okinawa (Camp Shields) for a short time and then was farmed out to the Det in Adak.

[gsxrken]

My grandfather fought in Okinawa and then stayed there afterwards as part of the Occupation. Each soldier had to find a civilian home to live in since of course there was no Army post yet. He never discussed anything he saw or did other than to mention as the big man in his platoon (6-1” 210lbs) he carried the M1918 BAR. He brought back some interesting family heirlooms including some handmade silk and a muzzleloader with intricate carvings all along its barrel.

About the only visible reminder of the War was that he would never own anything made in Japan.

[Purrybonker]

Originally Posted by Heel n Toe

It's The Greatest Generation because of how much they sacrificed to stop Nazi Germany and Japan from taking over the world.

How do you not understand that?

Or are you just trolling?

Idiot.

Ask yourself this... What would the world look like today if "Nazi" Germany and Japan had "taken over the world"?

What's the worst case? We'd be driving even better cars than we are now? What do you think - we'd all be wearing Charlie Chaplin moustaches and kimonos today?

Oh wait - Porsche, Mercedes, BWM, (not to mention about a dozen or so other industrial power-houses) all existed pre-WW2.

What if Genghis Khan had taken over the world - or Attila the Hun? Or the Romans? Or the Greeks or the Egyptians. Oh wait - they did and yet somehow humanity survived and evolved and continues on it's endless, ridiculous path.

Do you think for a minute that it matters an iota today whether Peter the Great prevailed over King Charles the 12th of Sweden at the battle of Poltava circa 1709?

That's about how much the outcome of WW2 means today. It's history = just sad, horrible history.

Stupid, ridiculous ideas like fascism, imperialism and trumpism are unsustainable long term and will always end in their own undoing.

Look, I'm not saying that it's wrong to remember the victims of war (and that includes pretty much every person in every nation and of every stripe that lived and died through it), but I do think that it is reductive to romanticize and memorialize war.

You obviously disagree and prefer an ad-hominem approach. You'd prefer to "go to battle" and attack over this issue.

There we are.

[Heel n Toe]

Originally Posted by Purrybonker

Ask yourself this... What would the world look like today if "Nazi" Germany and Japan had "taken over the world"?

What's the worst case? We'd be driving even better cars than we are now? What do you think - we'd all be wearing Charlie Chaplin moustaches and kimonos today?

Oh wait - Porsche, Mercedes, BWM, (not to mention about a dozen or so other industrial power-houses) all existed pre-WW2.

What if Genghis Khan had taken over the world - or Attila the Hun? Or the Romans? Or the Greeks or the Egyptians. Oh wait - they did and yet somehow humanity survived and evolved and continues on it's endless, ridiculous path.

Do you think for a minute that it matters an iota today whether Peter the Great prevailed over King Charles the 12th of Sweden at the battle of Poltava circa 1709?

That's about how much the outcome of WW2 means today. It's history = just sad, horrible history.

Stupid, ridiculous ideas like fascism, imperialism and trumpism are unsustainable long term and will always end in their own undoing.

Look, I'm not saying that it's wrong to remember the victims of war (and that includes pretty much every person in every nation and of every stripe that lived and died through it), but I do think that it is reductive to romanticize and memorialize war.

You obviously disagree and prefer an ad-hominem approach. You'd prefer to "go to battle" and attack over this issue.

There we are.

Yeah, so you're just trolling.

Nobody can be that dumb... unless you're someone who thinks this is a good way to demonstrate some oddball level of being "woke."

Thanks for playing.

[oldE]

PB,
In some aspects you are correct. Time does tend to diminish the impact of the lives of many and indeed the lives of empires. But we still feel the effects of the Roman empire two millenia later.
I feel your dismissal of the events of the first half of the 20th century to be a bit narrow in focus. What might be the consequence if the Axis had been unopposed?
There would likely be no Jewish presence in Europe. Korea would not be divided, but would be a territory of Japan. Forget Hyundai and Samsung. North America would have pulled into its isolationist shell like a turtle.
The scars of those military occupations would be felt for centuries. They are certainly felt today, as there are those alive who remember.
The young men and women who went to war had little idea of the long term effects of their commitment, but those of us alive today who reap the benefits, should not dismiss that so lightly.

Best
Les