Originally Posted by speeder (Post 11380978)

I always laugh at people who complain about the price of labor, especially in CA. and other places where it's been so artificially depressed for decades due to cheap, imported workers. Take a moment to ponder what a crew of ditch diggers working in the hot sun for 10 hours and showing up on time, (or even showing up at all), would cost if there were no migrants from Latin America and you had to rely on native born Americans. In a time of extremely expensive everything, which it would be if not for cheap labor.

As Heidi Fleiss famously said when someone complained about her prices, "Do it yourself."

Do it yourself for a couple of days and get back to me on a fair rate. Take your judgements about the people you're hiring out of it and how little you think they should work for, because they have "no skills." HTF do you know what their skills are? You probably can't even have a conversation with them, due to your lack of language skills.

I just paid someone to put rear brake pads on my Jetta wagon yesterday, because I did not feel like doing it myself. I can change brake pads in my sleep and spent all last week on the ground or bent over working on a car. Because I did not want to wreck my back further, and because I'm old and have a lot more $$ than time, I paid a shop to install them. I'm about to go on a trip and I just did not feel like doing it. The best $80 I spent all week. It helps that the guy I paid to do it is one of the only people on earth that I would trust to do a better brake job than me. I am beyond meticulous as a mechanic and especially on brakes and safety related items.

He is Mexican, fwiw. Born in East LA and as American as they come but thoroughly Mexican. Smarter than about 99% of the posters here, based on the written word, anyhow. His brother graduated at the top, and I mean the top of his class from Yale University. From a very working class background. Marco, the professional mechanic, is as polite and intelligent a young man as you will ever meet. He is employed by my close friend at his high-end Mercedes-Benz shop, probably his most valuable employee. They normally get $120 labor alone to do brake pads on one axle but I get the buddy deal. On most other days, I'd gladly put pads on someone's car for $80 an axle, just not yesterday. They are the annoying, rotating piston type, fwiw. :)

Higher wages for people at the bottom of the labor pool is the absolutely best thing for the economy, it's a proven fact. Anyone w half a brain understands this...it's both the cause of and a result of a very healthy economy.

Originally Posted by rusnak (Post 11381920)

Wait a second.

You said that it's better to pay people MORE than they are getting now, then you paid a guy $80 for what is worth $220? (include $100 for parts).

How can you complain about employers when you get the so-called buddy deal? Does that not make you a hypocrite?

Can you explain how a mandatory increase in the minimum wage does not cause artificial inflation? And can we stipulate that inflation is the enemy of an economy?

Originally Posted by speeder (Post 11382045)

You need to work on your reading skills, as well as your economic knowledge. Nowhere did I write, or even suggest that someone at a shop installed a set of brake pads on my car and also supplied the pads for $80.00. I wrote that he installed them. And that the regular price was $120, not $220. I had the pads and did not feel like installing them.

As for higher wages causing inflation, it's never happened in the United States. We've had tons of inflation and we're having it now, none of it caused by wages. Especially the minimum wage. That's an ignorant argument, sorry.

Originally Posted by rusnak (Post 11382470)

Oh I see. I am supposed to read your mind. That makes sense now. You must be one of those...let's see now.....rich, busy (no time to change brake pads), elderly, lazy (didn't FEEL like changing brake pads), meticulous, mechanical genius Americans who can change brakes in his sleep and, and oh yes add mind reading to that also. You did not WRITE anything about supplying the brake pads but I was supposed to READ that. Read your mind, that is.

Denis the mind-reading mechanical genius who is rich and old and lazy and throws money around to raise up the poor non-mind reading Americans.

And let's not forget you are an economic expert on Socialism who can make $$ magically appear out of his ass, so you can pay a higher wage without passing that cost on to customers. Yes now you seem so much less wrong-headed.

Originally Posted by rusnak (Post 11382680)

^ Denis, even Russia is transitioning to a market based economy. Socialism is alive and well only in the minds of the disenfranchised and now elderly hippies who pine for the heady days of the 1960s when you could imagine a different world, and people would happily go along with your brilliant ideas. But in reality, costs are costs. That is what you should be "reading" about "labor" in this thread. But I digress. The real point is that we need to just all agree with you all the time.

Originally Posted by speeder (Post 11382696)

You don't need to agree with me and I apologize if my tone was huffy. We just need to understand each other better, so we know what we're disagreeing with. Higher wages are not socialism, not at all. Unless you are paying people for not working.

Originally Posted by rusnak (Post 11382470)

Oh I see. I am supposed to read your mind. That makes sense now. You must be one of those...let's see now.....rich, busy (no time to change brake pads), elderly, lazy (didn't FEEL like changing brake pads), meticulous, mechanical genius Americans who can change brakes in his sleep and, and oh yes add mind reading to that also. You did not WRITE anything about supplying the brake pads but I was supposed to READ that. Read your mind, that is.

Denis the mind-reading mechanical genius who is rich and old and lazy and throws money around to raise up the poor non-mind reading Americans.

And let's not forget you are an economic expert on Socialism who can make $$ magically appear out of his ass, so you can pay a higher wage without passing that cost on to customers. Yes now you seem so much less wrong-headed.

Originally Posted by Zeke (Post 11382726)

You were a lot nicer when you were in WI. L.A. is tough.

Originally Posted by look 171 (Post 11380370)

No skills, 180 a day??? At 5 days a week, that is 43k per year, and no tax. That's a lot of money for none skill bodies.

Originally Posted by 1990C4S (Post 11383062)

Showing up all day and working hard hauling crap might not be a 'skill' but it's what people get paid to do, it's why we pay people.

America is a big open market, what's the right price? Should it be $100? If you are willing to pay $150 and no one will do the work for that price, who's wrong? You or the labor market?

Originally Posted by speeder (Post 11383109)

Yep, it's called a free market and all of the sudden, these supposed free market capitalists don't seem to like it. :rolleyes:

Originally Posted by 1990C4S (Post 11383062)

Showing up all day and working hard hauling crap might not be a 'skill' but it's what people get paid to do, it's why we pay people.

America is a big open market, what's the right price? Should it be $100? If you are willing to pay $150 and no one will do the work for that price, who's wrong? You or the labor market?