Does that matter? We changed the definition of vaccines already. We can just decide what we want it to show and work backwards to the definition

Yes, it does. If you define efficacy as getting the disease (to me this means getting infected, but I could be wrong about that), that's only part of the story. Not getting hospitalized or dead is the more important goal, no?

Keep looking at your wake, steer by that. Look at the f'ing numbers in the OP...if you are in your 20's without other health issues, what would you do?

And, for the love of god, stop blaming the guy who fast tracked the vaccine: The Progressives ran against the vaccine, said they wouldn't take it until they won. Jesus.

Remember "open for business", "just like the flu", "masks don't work", "herd immunity is the key", Joe calling OMB a xenophobe for stopping international flights?

And, again, for the love of god, what is Joe-Joe doing NOW to help? How is that border thingy working out? How many Afghani's were vaccinated before we set them loose?

If we are again in crisis, we need to shut it all down again, right...football and baseball crowds, the works: No more "super spreader" events. Remember?

How do you want to move forward, what metrics will you use? How do we try and get ahead?

Your thoughts before this gets moved to PARF because Progressives hate math.

I responded to the OP in post #19. That chart applies to deaths from 1/1/2020 to 9/11/2021. Covid first hit around 1/1/2020, but action didn't seem to start until 4/2020 when it was recognized as a serious problem. There were somewhere close to zero cases on 1/1/2020, now there are over 40 million. I'm not seeing the percentage that ranges from 0.003 to 0.0012 as being too useful right now, do you? Plus around 70% of the US population has had at least one shot, so that will lower the death rate dramatically. If I was heathy in my 20s, I would get the shot. I'm not afraid of it. I have a tradition of getting the flu shot every year, as I don't like getting sick and not being able to work.

Are these questions directed to me or the OT forum?

If only we could have but one more thread about covid or vaccines :(

Tell this to my unvaccinated navy vet nephew in his early 30s currently sitting in a hospital on 10L of oxygen likely looking at permanent lung damage.

Just because you “survived” doesn’t mean your life will ever go back to normal. Spending a month in a hospital sure seems like a ****ty alternative to getting a shot in the arm.

Sorry about your nephew. I've been saying this for a long time...plenty of people who "survived" COVID have some pretty horrific health issues after the fact, some that may last for life. And not just in risky populations either, as your nephew's experience shows. This gets FAR too little press - everyone focuses on death. Wear a mask, get the shot, and stop pretending you know more than the experts after spending 30 mins watching some quack YouTube vid. It shouldn't be this difficult of a decision....

The jab does not keep you from catching, and more importantly spreading this. It does not appear to do a great job of keeping you out of the hospital even.

It is simply incredible to me how effective the propaganda campaign has been

Exactly. And if you’ve never been around someone with lung issues, it’s an ugly sight. I have an uncle that had bad COPD and eventually got a lung transplant. Before he got that though, it got to where he could only breath somewhat comfortable standing up. He literally wore the finish off a spot near their table where he would stand leaning against the kitchen table propping himself up. He did that for nearly a year, before he started the long recovery from having a lung transplant.


I hope we don’t see a rash of people needing lungs in the next several years, but the early reports on long covid and lung damage are scary as hell.

Sorry. I am.

What is next however, what is being done NOW to prevent the next Navy Vet from being sick?

Figure it out. That is what I am trying to do.

Sorry again, folks. I appreciate your concern for the dying and the sick: I have no one in my immediate life who has died from CV. I have spent a lot of time at my MIL's care facility, delivering everything. They are shutting down again.

So. What is next? How do we fix the nonsense.

I am not, again, anti vax. Get the shot.

Give it a whirl. Smart guy like you this is a lay-up.

You can't get the vax because your system reacts adversely, right? A mask is 90% (estimated) for preventing the wearer from spreading the virus. For you, I would recommend an N95 mask to protect yourself from inhaling the virus. I'd steer clear of indoor gatherings or even small outdoor crowds. I'd confirm you have quick access to monoclonal antibodies, which are purported to work 70-85% of the time. Your doctor might have some other preventative recommendations. Get a quality at home quick test, which should be available.

Again, focusing only on mortality is not very wise…lots of other health complications to worry about.

Per what data? Everything I see indicates the exact opposite. In my state, 97% of COVID hospitalizations are unvaccinated.

He doesn’t use data…he just takes a big whiff of someone’s foot and starts typing. Don’t waste your time.

Dude, I am in a controlled study. I have the best medical advice available.

Answer the question: What is next, what should be done...

We know where we have been.

That is funny!

The numbers are cooked. Look at Israel, or anyplace else with high jab uptake.

The stats are so gooned up in the US it is not possible to reliably know WTF is going on

Israel’s current vaccination rate is around 60%. The US is around 55%.

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I'm not ashamed to admit that I literally laughed out loud at this.

Then I've done my good deed for the day and I can rest. :)

I thought you were asking about yourself. Forgive me- I didn't know you were getting the best advice possible. Anything different beyond what I suggested?

My answer for what is next, what should be done is not that of an expert. I can only speculate. I think we're on the right path. Vaccinations are increasing as a result of the fourth wave and people realizing they can't quit and consider this over like they were thinking before Delta hit. I honestly don't know how the battle of thought is going on getting vaxxed or not. As evidenced by many posters here, too many are anti-vax based on any number of ridiculous evaluations of what the facts are. Vaccinations will increase as it becomes a condition of employment, travel, public gatherings, restaurant policies, etc. I'm all for that. To let this thing run its course unimpeded is insane in my book. We're already crossing the line on the capacity of our healthcare system. I do think this fourth wave is slowing down a lot. Hopefully we can get to a manageable level of hospitalizations. As far as I'm concerned, if people want to pay for their stupid choice with a visit to the hospital, damage to their health, and maybe a visit to the morgue, let them. It saddens me that this choice is putting such a burden on our healthcare system and destroying families. Hopefully when more people see the result of stupid, more people will decide to do the right thing, at least for their own sake. These people don't seem to care about anyone else's.

Another thing that needs doing is the rest of the world needs to get vaxxed. This will be endemic if we don't face facts and get this down to a dull roar, like polio and small pox, for example. Fortunately, it seems the rest of the affluent world isn't as anti-vax as we are. The US has now pledged to donate 1.1 billion doses of vaccine to the neediest countries in the world. Hooray for us. We are looking to be donating more than all other countries combined. That's the leadership I grew up seeing this country provide.

Here in Los Angeles, land of the lib squirrel, we’re highly vaccinated and the Covid hospitalization numbers are plummeting. So there is that.

You’re up 7k cases and climbing, but don’t let numbers bother you. California is THE covid hit spot right now.

We are not highly vaccinated here...and almost no one is getting it nor have been from the start. Almost no one wears masks (and have not from the start). Mostly people passing through on their way to somewhere. As few old, dying people reportedly caught it (no test) in a nursing home last year and passed...but most were already diagnosed with life-ending illnesses and all had many comorbidities. The facility just got an extra $36K for saying their deaths were due to COVID.

It seems odd that the facts on the ground are so different in different area. I have had a few younger relatives catch it in another state...but it was not even as bad as a cold. No one I know there has died from it either. One elderly friend was contacted and told they had it (as was everyone they had been in contact with)...but they had not ever been tested and did not get sick. I am not sure what argument one could make to a healthy teen or 20-something to induce then to be vaccinated when we do not know if there are any long-term effects of the vaccine. If any citizen that chooses can be vaccinated for free and be protected, why would anyone want to force others to take the vaccine that do not want to?

No question that the vaccine is a brilliant bit of work by the previous administration...but that doesn't necessarily mean it should be required for everyone.

COVID: By The Numbers
 

Up here in NorCal, the Floriduh of California, we have a bunch of unvaccinated people, and not so shockingly, no icu beds available. Amazing how that works.

Cases are positive PCR tests, not cases of people being ill

Yes to CA., no to Los Angeles County. The Inland Empire, (counties just to the east of LA), are experiencing a big spike in hospitalizations. Those are much more conservative/right wing and less vaccinated places. Same with the counties in the very northern parts of the state, where the recall did well at the polls. Total schit show at the hospitals and ICUs. Sad. :(

This article might be behind a paywall but details the situation in LA vs. Inland Empire, from today's paper:

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-09-23/california-covid-hospitalizations-zone-in-on-inland-empire

Similar story across the nation. Lower vaccinated states are experiencing the highest hospitalizations/death and the higher vaccinated states are experiencing the lowest. Pretty linear relationship. It's not rocket science. Get vaccinated.

All y'all that have been jabbed and are considering a rejab should check your antibody titer and do a D dimer test first, or not.

I honestly don't give a good GD what you do.
Mass psychosis is a heck of a thing

Hemet Global Medical Center took out 5 of it's icu beds since August. Apparently people are not as sick they have the same number of beds in the hospital 101 I believe.
I'm curious what percent of people that get covid do you think need hospitalization?
Mike

I think the vaccine is relatively successful as such, and the pleasant surprise is it’s more successful as a preventative antidote or cure.

Yes it is, a heck of a thing. The virus isn’t political. It doesn’t give a good GD about your crazy conspiracy theories and BS. If you are not vaccinated, it will kill you a lot of the time. Here’s someone who might have taken your expert medical advice:


https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/california-mother-unvaccinated-dies-covid-b1924322.html%3famp

But hey, at least she did not have to risk the side effects of the Bill Gates/Fauci vaccine or become magnetic! :rolleyes:

You fking clown.

Poor Denis, too stupid to understand I don't read your angry ranting. Predictably, there is no doubt you are making some other comments that violate the terms of use for this website


Too bad so many people like you moved to California and ruined the place

you got that right....

Darwin’s not political. But he’s gonna eat.

You are definitely not exaggerating. There is a definite correlation going on.