The 993 Carerra

[yellowperil]

is it becoming an old man's car? Just curious. (Not just because I'm old)

[livi]

Around my parts everything aircoooled is almost invariably an old mans car. Younger guys don´t have the connection with them from groing up. No 911 posters on their walls. Secondly, even if they would, most couldn´t afford one. Prices are ridicoulus. Thirdly, they are really getting on by now, visavi creature comforts and such.

[recycled sixtie]

Yes probably an old man's car. You seldom see any being driven except for a car show. I test drove a used one about twenty years ago and I said to myself I will get an air cooled P car one of these days but never did.

[masraum]

They are 25-30 years old. Most of the younger generation look for the new hotness.
On top of that, they are pricey which often makes them accessible to successful folks with plenty of disposable income. Then combine those with the fact that they probably aren't doing that well in the numbers race (0-60, 1/4 mile, etc...) compared to more modern stuff. So even if someone younger were looking, they'd probably think "why would I pay that much for something that's not head and shoulders faster than something newer, faster, and cheaper?" Of course, we know why.

[look 171]

there are a bunch of young guys driving air cool cars around here. Its the cool thing to do. Any old is cool nowdays. UP in my neighborhood, for the longest time, there are only three guys I know of that have air cool 911s. No 914s, sorry. Now I see 6-7 different cars driven by men that are in their early 40s but all are G body cars only one other 993 beside mine. I think its easier to get into a G body car then a 993 due to cost but around LA there are more then few younger drivers in their 993s. Younger means early 40s. 356= old man car for sure.

[look 171]

Originally Posted by masraum

They are 25-30 years old. Most of the younger generation look for the new hotness.
On top of that, they are pricey which often makes them accessible to successful folks with plenty of disposable income. Then combine those with the fact that they probably aren't doing that well in the numbers race (0-60, 1/4 mile, etc...) compared to more modern stuff. So even if someone younger were looking, they'd probably think "why would I pay that much for something that's not head and shoulders faster than something newer, faster, and cheaper?" Of course, we know why.

A 35,000 Caymen S can run circles most cars out there especially the 993. I know my Caymen feels faster them my 993 TT. Top speed, maybe not, but out of the hole, it feel almost as fast, but I know its isn't. Stick shift is another purchase deterrent.

[Deschodt]

Plus they are somewhat overrated IMO, probably based on their good looks.
Very smooth engine but also very linear so not as exciting as one might hope, in stock form too softly sprung, too quiet an exhaust, exact same "yawn" interior as a 911SC (with more warning lights on the dash, often ON because something is wrong), a squeaky windshield, an annoying immobilizer that can leave you stranded, expensive valve guide repairs / secondary air port coking up, etc... The most "GT" of all 911s I owned and at the same time, both the prettiest & most dissapointing to drive to me. Of course that is just my opinion (based on a string of ownership from 356 to 991) but to me it falls in the "neither-nor" zone, not classic enough for that raw experience, not quick and modern enough for the speed/reliable/carplay experience...for the insane money. If they were 20K cheaper then no problem, because they are pretty and all my gripes are fixable aftermarket... And now I will put on my kevlar helmet and seek cover.

(Did I mention it's the prettiest 911 even penned?)

[look 171]

Originally Posted by Deschodt

Plus they are somewhat overrated IMO, probably based on their good looks.
Very smooth engine but also very linear so not as exciting as one might hope, in stock form too softly sprung, too quiet an exhaust, exact same "yawn" interior as a 911SC (with more warning lights on the dash, often ON because something is wrong), a squeaky windshield, an annoying immobilizer that can leave you stranded, expensive valve guide repairs / secondary air port coking up, etc... The most "GT" of all 911s I owned and at the same time, both the prettiest & most dissapointing to drive to me. Of course that is just my opinion (based on a string of ownership from 356 to 991) but to me it falls in the "neither-nor" zone, not classic enough for that raw experience, not quick and modern enough for the speed/reliable/carplay experience...for the insane money. If they were 20K cheaper then no problem, because they are pretty and all my gripes are fixable aftermarket... And now I will put on my kevlar helmet and seek cover.

(Did I mention it's the prettiest 911 even penned?)

I have to agree with you. My old 930 which drives like a truck with stiff suspension drives more like a proper 911 then my 993. Yep, its the prettiest of all 911 imo especially the turbo with the big hips

[masraum]

Originally Posted by Deschodt

Plus they are somewhat overrated IMO, probably based on their good looks.
Very smooth engine but also very linear so not as exciting as one might hope, in stock form too softly sprung, too quiet an exhaust, exact same "yawn" interior as a 911SC (with more warning lights on the dash, often ON because something is wrong), a squeaky windshield, an annoying immobilizer that can leave you stranded, expensive valve guide repairs / secondary air port coking up, etc... The most "GT" of all 911s I owned and at the same time, both the prettiest & most dissapointing to drive to me. Of course that is just my opinion (based on a string of ownership from 356 to 991) but to me it falls in the "neither-nor" zone, not classic enough for that raw experience, not quick and modern enough for the speed/reliable/carplay experience...for the insane money. If they were 20K cheaper then no problem, because they are pretty and all my gripes are fixable aftermarket... And now I will put on my kevlar helmet and seek cover.

(Did I mention it's the prettiest 911 even penned?)

Interesting. I've never driven one, but I did ride in one that was modded (suspension and Recaro SPG, maybe more).

I don't think they are the prettiest 911 ever. I'm not saying that they are great looking cars, but I don't know that they are the prettiest.

I loved, loved, loved my old '88. If I had a bunch of spare money laying around needing to be burned, I would be looking at air cooled.

[speeder]

Wow, that poster gets almost all of the years of 911 turbo introduction models wrong. The 964 through 997 are all wrong, not sure about the 991.

[yellowperil]

I have a '95 993, it's a great car NOTHING ever seems to go wrong with it, almost zero maintenance, and I really like it. But, when I have anyone in the car with me whose never been in a Porsche, I'll say something like "be prepared to be under whelmed"
and when the ride is over they seldom disagree. Makes me wonder...…..

I still like it.

[Tervuren]

Anything that gets expensive is going to be an "old mans car".
Young people haven't had as long to build the means of buying such expensive stuff.
Its been awhile since I last looked at 993's for sale, the prices just said no.

[pavulon]

Originally Posted by yellowperil

I have a '95 993, it's a great car NOTHING ever seems to go wrong with it, almost zero maintenance, and I really like it. But, when I have anyone in the car with me whose never been in a Porsche, I'll say something like "be prepared to be under whelmed"
and when the ride is over they seldom disagree. Makes me wonder...…..

I still like it.

I have a car which nobody exits complaining of a "meh" experience--but today, I'd likely buy a 993 if it was comparably optioned, looked after and priced. Nobody is getting younger and tastes/appreciations refine with age.

[Deschodt]

Surprised nobody really flamed me for my 993 opinion... Totally drifting from the 993 topic now (did I mention it's a gorgeous cars) - but for me, given current car prices (new and classic), I want either the most raw historically correct experience (a 356 or an early 911, as early as possible), or on the opposite end of the spectrum, a 991.2 GT3. Anything in the middle was great back 10y ago, but seems overpriced now, and neither of those extremes is "Meh". The oldies are slow but sound so good and drift so well your ride will likely remember it - and possibly without having to break the speed limit much. Too expensive for sure, but will always be the originals.

Anything in the middle, for ME (after having owned a few) and assuming you'd have to purchase now, is now better served by other brands given the current horrendous prices and the costs of rebuilds, plus the lack of amenities in porsches in general. Price an SC rebuild today and let me know how excited you are to pay that for 180hp ;-(

I just sold my 991.1 this week end - I sold it for $1000 less than its purchase price..in 2017. I literally drove that car for $15 a month for the past 5.5 years plus gas and tires. It's nuts. (and it only works if I don't buy another, obviously which I will not). There's a shark jumping curve for cars in my head - how much I'd pay for the pleasure I get (factory power, looks, handling) and a lot of cars I love have jumped to the wrong side of it over the past decade. 993 included, 356 too, Alpine a110, BMW 3.0CS, you name it... These days I'd buy a used M2 over any 1974-2022 Porsche. Except a GT3, but hey, those are 100K over MSRP now. Sigh !

And yes, every single 993 I see - I live in a porsche heaven area - is driven by a gray haired guy.

[DWBOX2000]

Prices say otherwise but not a car I have a need to own. Not sure when I changed my opinion on them but they come off a bit soft in appearance. I think Porsche continued that look through the gen 1 996 and then figured it out with the gen 2 though not digging the new ones.
Old man car, yes; but only because they are the only ones who can afford them. Last air cooled, always desirable.

[matthewb0051]

I had a C4 993. Loved it but don't really miss it like other cars.

I had orders to relocate to El Paso, Fort Bliss when I sold it. Was very concerned about the leather dash getting destroyed in the desert.

It did have crap headlights.

[pwd72s]

Originally Posted by look 171

there are a bunch of young guys driving air cool cars around here. Its the cool thing to do. Any old is cool nowdays. UP in my neighborhood, for the longest time, there are only three guys I know of that have air cool 911s. No 914s, sorry. Now I see 6-7 different cars driven by men that are in their early 40s but all are G body cars only one other 993 beside mine. I think its easier to get into a G body car then a 993 due to cost but around LA there are more then few younger drivers in their 993s. Younger means early 40s. 356= old man car for sure.

I can recall when early 40's meant "old man" to me...

[wildthing]

I wish more people read this so that the prices go back down to “just another used car” levels.

The reason I want a 993 (and I’m 47) is that I wanted one when they first came out. I have a G50, mostly analog, and driving that daily is a chore. Maybe the power steering and supposedly better a/c gives me the perception that I could drive the 993 daily and still have the air-cooled experience.

I won’t sell the G50, but maybe I will sell the 991 for the right 993.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by wildthing

I wish more people read this so that the prices go back down to “just another used car” levels.

The reason I want a 993 (and I’m 47) is that I wanted one when they first came out. I have a G50, mostly analog, and driving that daily is a chore. Maybe the power steering and supposedly better a/c gives me the perception that I could drive the 993 daily and still have the air-cooled experience.

I won’t sell the G50, but maybe I will sell the 991 for the right 993.

My old car was an '88. I don't remember ever thinking that I needed power steering.

Also, Glen has gotten his car updated with one of the aftermarket AC systems (Griffiths?) and says that it'll freeze you out of the car, and his is an SC, I think. So a G50 car should have a better system to start with (better vents at least). I thought mine was actually really good in my old '88.

[Marine Blue]

There are plenty of the younger generation that absolutely love the air cooled 911’s. It seems the primary draw is the late 70’s through the 993 with the wide bodies getting lots of the attention. Obviously there’s love for the new stuff, primarily the GT cars.

If air cooled prices hadn’t skyrocketed over the past 10 years I’m confident more of the 30 something’s would own these cars now. Pricing is definitely a barrier to entry.

As far as performance being underwhelming, if anyone has an opportunity to really drive these cars the way they were meant to be driven on the back roads and canyons I seriously doubt they would be underwhelmed. While the performance won’t come close to the new 911’s there’s absolutely no doubt the experience will be insanely engaging and if they get it right it will be very rewarding. I’m always shocked with how fast I can go in the 964 once I got the suspension set up correctly.