So whats interesting is that I have no problem sleeping starting at about 4AM.

I think I need to adjust my rhythm as much as anything else.

I tried going to bed 2 hours earlier to start moving it and winding down but that just means I lay there from 10-4 instead of 12-4.

Chris, your cicada rhythm is all messed up. Try sleeping underground for 17 years, you'll wake up feeling like pissing off everyone with hearing ability.

Oddly, our doctor recommended caffeine if you have adhd. It does work for my daughter and myself. Otherwise I need a documentary that isn't too interesting on the tv to occupy my mind enough that it doesn't want to work hard. Some days I wake up when the sleep timer turns the tv off though unless I set the timer for at least 3 hours.

Exercise definitely makes a huge difference.

Exactly. I had a prescription for Ambien once. Got up one morning to find that sometime during the night I had filled a tall glass to the very rim with wine and I mean you couldn't get another drop in the glass. I have no idea why because I don't even drink wine. I was at home by myself so, I did it. Yeah, I didn't take any more Ambien after that.
I use a Kroger brand sleep aid gel tab that is comparable to unisom and it works for me

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My Dad told me to count my breaths. Just focus on that one thing counting breaths and if something else enters your thoughts then start over. It has worked for me sometimes but I still like my Kroger brand sleep aid.

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The 4-7-8 count:
Count of 4 inhale, count of 7 hold your beath, count of 8 exhale
Supposedly, the long exhale simulates your sleep breathing.

My problem has typically not been getting to sleep, but waking up. For a long time for probably 5 nights out of 7, I would wake up after five hours more or less independently of when I went to bed. If I had 2-3 hours to lie in bed I would eventually go back to sleep and then get 2-3 hours of deep sleep that felt great. But that was impossible on weeknights, so ages of getting five hours of sleep a night sucked. I managed, but it didn’t feel good. I’d already done other sleep-hygiene things years ago. Best thing by a lot for my sleep has been taking a dose of Doxepin before I go to bed. The large majority of the time I’ll get 7-8 hours of solid sleep and the difference has been huge.

Five hours of sleep is my normal. For me..that is all I need for the day.
If I were doing strenuous work all day...I would prob sleep 6-7 hours.

I can't remember the last time I slept for more than 7 hours in one night.

Good thread!

I wake up at 2-3 am every night, and can’t fall asleep for 1-2 hours. It’s a problem.

I’m going to stop by the store on the way home and get some gummies.

This guy has a pretty good series on insomnia with several possible treatments, most avoiding drugs and alcohol.

The Cliff's notes:

Reset our internal clock by keeping regular hours including meals and in bed by 9-10, getting plenty of exercise during the day outdoors if possible, and controlling light in the evenings. Bright overhead sunlight tends to wake us and subdued off-white light or fireplace tends to cue our internal sleep cycle. Keep the bedroom very dark while sleeping. Stay off the screens in the evening.

https://youtu.be/vdc8JonEax8

It took me fully 24 hours to get this. :D

One of these big things during this time for me is lack of exercise as many have mentioned. Restrictions due to surgery. Time to start moving again soon - will report back. :)

I think I told this story a few years ago when I was having so much trouble with sleep aids, but here it goes again.

We had remodeled our bedroom suite and changed what had been the bathroom into a closet and vice versa. One night in an Ambien addled stupor I got up, went to our old bathroom, pushed my jackets aside, and pissed all over my shoes. It took a few hours the next morning to figure out why my closet was in disarray and my shoes were wet.

There is always sex. Pretty good sleep aid.

You're too far away but appreciate the offer. :D

If she falls asleep on ya ..... yer doing it wrong :D