New WMD Information

[fintstone]

Another dem lie about the administration and Iraq eposed. I wonder why this is not reported on the mainstream media?

Wilson contradictions leave Democrat senators speechless

July 15, 2004

BY ROBERT NOVAK SUN-TIMES COLUMNIST
Chicago Sun Times

Like Sherlock Holmes' dog that did not bark, the most remarkable aspect of last week's Senate Intelligence Committee report is what its Democratic members did not say. They did not dissent from the committee's findings that Iraq apparently asked about buying yellowcake uranium from Niger. They neither agreed to a conclusion that former diplomat Joseph Wilson was suggested for a mission to Niger by his CIA employee wife nor defended his statements to the contrary.



Wilson's activities constituted the only aspects of the yearlong investigation for which the committee's Republican chairman, Sen. Pat Roberts, was unable to win unanimous agreement. According to committee sources, Roberts felt Wilson had been such a ''cause celebre'' for Democrats that they could not face the facts about him.

For a year, Democrats have been belaboring President Bush about 16 words in his 2003 State of the Union address in which he reported Saddam Hussein's attempt to buy uranium from Africa, based on British information. Wilson has been lionized in liberal circles for allegedly contradicting this information on a CIA mission and then being punished as a truth-teller. Now, for committee Democrats, it is as though the Niger question and Joe Wilson have vanished from the Earth.

Because a Justice Department special prosecutor is investigating whether any crime was committed when my column first identified Wilson's wife, Valerie Plame, as a CIA employee, on advice of counsel I have not written on the subject since October. However, I feel compelled to describe how the committee report treats the Niger-Wilson affair because it has received scant coverage except in a few media outlets. The unanimously approved report said, ''interviews and documents provided to the Committee indicate that his wife, a CPD (CIA counterproliferation division) employee, suggested his name for the trip.'' That's what I reported, and what Wilson flatly denied and still does.

Plame sent out an internal CIA memo saying ''my husband has good relations with both the PM [prime minister] and the former Minister of Mines (not to mention lots of French contacts), both of whom could possibly shed light on this sort of activity.'' A State Department analyst told the committee about an inter-agency meeting in 2002 that was ''apparently convened by [Wilson's] wife, who had the idea to dispatch [him] to use his contacts to sort out the Iraq-Niger uranium issue.''

The committee found that the CIA report, based on Wilson's mission, differed considerably from the former ambassador's description to the committee of his findings. That report ''did not refute the possibility that Iraq had approached Niger to purchase uranium.'' As far as his statement to the Washington Post about ''forged documents'' involved in the alleged Iraqi attempt to buy uranium, Wilson told the committee he may have ''misspoken.'' In fact, the intelligence community agreed that ''Iraq was attempting to procure uranium from Africa.''

''While there was no dispute with the underlying facts,'' Chairman Roberts wrote separately, ''my Democrat colleagues refused to allow'' two conclusions in the report. The first conclusion merely said that Wilson was sent to Niger at his wife's suggestion. The second conclusion is devastating: ''Rather than speaking publicly about his actual experiences during his inquiry of the Niger issue, the former ambassador seems to have included information he learned from press accounts and from his beliefs about how the Intelligence Community would have or should have handled the information he provided.''

The normally mild Roberts is harsh in his condemnation: ''Time and again, Joe Wilson told anyone who would listen that the president had lied to the American people, that the vice president had lied, and that he had 'debunked' the claim that Iraq was seeking uranium from Africa. . . . [N]ot only did he NOT 'debunk' the claim, he actually gave some intelligence analysts even more reason to believe that it may be true.'' Roberts called it ''important'' for the committee to declare much of what Wilson said ''had no basis in fact.'' In response, Democrats were silent.

[lendaddy]

I brought this up the other day Flint, got little farfare I agree that this is pretty big and Wilson is a disgrace.

[fintstone]

Thanks lendaddy! I must have missed it. So many democratic scandals these days that I cannot keep up. So many liberal trolls and multiple identities on here now that I can't get to all of them. Someone must have posted this BBS link on "move-on.org" or some other liberal fantasy site. Seems that liberal strategy is to post using several names to make us think that there are a lot of folks out there that think as they do. LOL.

[lendaddy]

Maybe I'm reading too much into this (hey it's possible) but does this not paint a picture of sabotage on the part of Wilson and his wife? What do they call that again?

[fintstone]

Sure looks pretty darn damaging to me. Tantamount to treason.

[lendaddy]

It's like I said in the other thread. I have "studied" the left and their mental state/theories for over a year now. I visit countless left leaning sites and message boards (I get similar stuff here, but usually more restrained). Anyway, the left is absolutely convinced of many conspiracy theories and in general believe that republicans in office will do whatever it takes to make money for their friends and themselves(they honestly believe that's our driving force) even if it means underhanded operations. This is, in my opinion, why you are seeing stuff like this from the left more often now, they have convinced themselves that the right has been doing it for years and they are only fighting fire with fire. This is my theory anyway.

[on-ramp]

at least you guys are saving money going back and forth here and not over the telephone.

anyway, this belongs in the Ultimate BUll$hit thread:

The Ultimate Bull$hit Thread

[techweenie]

I guess one reason this didn't excite anyone is that it was pretty thoroughly covered in another thread.

Wilson's wife's memo proposes that CIA folks might like to interview him because of his familiarity with Nigerian officials.

A week later, the CIA (apparetntly without Plame) decided somebody needed to actually go to Niger and Wilson was chosen. If 1 + 1 needs to = 3 for you guys to get excited, go for it.

Wilson's report included what he read about UN analysis of the forged documents. Somethow this has the committee excited because he didn't see them himself. But the errors in the documents were so egregious, I don't think he had to. And guess what? He was right.

If you look into it, this entire episode is pretty much made up out of scraps of unrelated information piled together to 'excuse' a treasonous action on the part of the white house. Yes, treasonous, since not only Plame, but here operatives' lives were put in danger.

[ubiquity0]

Originally posted by lendaddy
I have "studied" the left and their mental state/theories for over a year now.

Pray, tell us more, Doktor, of your groundbreaking Study results that precisely describe one half of the populaution!

[lendaddy]

Tech,

I Think you are glossing over several items here. The report says she "actively campaigned" for wilson to be given the job. Not interviewed, not consulted, given the assignment.

He said, and still says she had nothing to do with it. ???

Putting a newspaper articles info into an official field report (though not saying so) is beyond stupid, and at worst shows his true intentions. His report was to be on what he found, instead he turned it into an editorial on the administrations policies. Stupid and derelict of his duty.

As far as his wife being outted, we get it, again........ It was wrong, but it changes none of his actions.

[lendaddy]

"Pray, tell us more, Doktor, of your groundbreaking Study results that precisely describe one half of the populaution!"

lol, perhaps I missed an adjective in there. How about extreme left. Fair is fair.

[350HP930]

I think this thread would be better titled as 'Old WMD Bull$hit'.

[fintstone]

Once a agian, a dem calls the president a liar and we find out that the liar was, in-fact the dem. Of course, in his words, he may have "mispoken" so it is ok by the liberals.

As far as his statement to the Washington Post about ''forged documents'' involved in the alleged Iraqi attempt to buy uranium, Wilson told the committee he may have ''misspoken.'' In fact, the intelligence community agreed that ''Iraq was attempting to procure uranium from Africa.''

As always, they feel the end justifies the means.

I wonder now if they did not actually "out her identity" themselves to try to give the administration a black eye.

[techweenie]

Originally posted by lendaddy
Tech,

I Think you are glossing over several items here. The report says she "actively campaigned" for wilson to be given the job. Not interviewed, not consulted, given the assignment.

He said, and still says she had nothing to do with it. ???

I haven't seen the details of the report. What I read was exactly what I wrote: she suggested he consult, (somebody) about a week later decided he should become an "investigator."

This really doesn't add up to very much, if you don't know anything beyond what the right wing media is saying about all this. I'll follow up with a post that attempts to break it all down.

[techweenie]

I heard Rush all hysterical Friday about yellowcake and Iraq's attemps to buy it. Here are some details he didn't discuss.

1. Yellowcake isn't a weapon material. It's unprocessed material with 70-90% uranium oxide. It's so unthreatening that we left stockpiles of even more (550 tons, by some reports) of uranium ore behind in Iraq after Desert Storm.

2. Niger has fairly strict export controls on yellowcake. There is international oversight on its purchase and transport.

3. Niger responded negatively to a '99 trade delegation from Iraq, seeking to upen up more trade between the countries. (Wilson)

4. It's unclear whether there are 400 tons of yellowcake in Niger.

5. It's known that there is a large amount of uranium ore naturally occurring in Iraq that simply has to be mined (over and above the 550 metric tons already mined).

6. There are some allegations that Iran was seeking 400 tons of yellowcake (they have the means to weaponize it) and that they created the 'Iraq' cover story to throw off suspicion. Others have suggdested intelligence sources merely misred "Iraq" for Iran" in reports

7. Enriching uranium requires one of two methods: centrifugal or gas. there is no evidence that a resource for either process exists in -- or is available to -- Iraq.

8. Less than 100 lbs of enriched uranium is derived from each ton of ore.

9. Creating an atomic weapon once they actually obtained enriched uranium may or may not have been within the scientific abilities of Saddam's Iraq.

10. Wilson's report stated that there was no evidence of Saddam attempting to buy uranium from Niger. No one had produced evidence that this was not correct.

11. Wilson, not a CIA operative or trained investigator, apparently included in his report reference to documents that others (IAEA) had publicly pronounced as 'clearly forgeries.'

12. Wilson was suggested as 'somebody to talk to' in a memo from his wife. It is not clear that the CIA intended to send anyone to Niger at that time.

13. When Wilson came in to the CIA offices to talk about what he knew -- in response to the memo -- his wife was briefly in the meeting, but left (indicating to the dispassionate observer that she was not that involved in the whole thing). He said: “She definitely had not proposed that I make the trip.” In fact, it's not clear a 'trip' was even planned at that time.

14. About a week later, Wilson was asked to go to Niger.

15. When he came back to make his report, again, his wife was not present at the meeting.

This does not sound like a career politician and a career CIA operative out to sabotage George Bush to me.

I think the administration looks bad for tryiing to create fear over unsuccessful attempts to obtain materials that could not directly be used in weapons, and certainly not in WMDs.

YMMV. Feel free to challenge any of this... I'll be interested in any documents that disagree with the ones I used for this post.

[fintstone]

I think the first article does. What is your source and why is it any better than NovaK?

[techweenie]

Which of the 15 points is in question?

[fintstone]

Most of your "points" have no point. Just a bunch of unrelated facts. For example, whether or not there are 400 tons of yellowcake in Niger does not mean that Iraq did not attempt to purchase 400 tons or whatever amount was available. As far as specific numbered points refuted by the initial article, the following is a good example:

Originally posted by techweenie
13. When Wilson came in to the CIA offices to talk about what he knew -- in response to the memo -- his wife was briefly in the meeting, but left (indicating to the dispassionate observer that she was not that involved in the whole thing). He said: “She definitely had not proposed that I make the trip.” In fact, it's not clear a 'trip' was even planned at that time.

14. About a week later, Wilson was asked to go to Niger.

15. When he came back to make his report, again, his wife was not present at the meeting.

From the initial article:

The unanimously approved report said, ''interviews and documents provided to the Committee indicate that his wife, a CPD (CIA counterproliferation division) employee, suggested his name for the trip.'' That's what I reported, and what Wilson flatly denied and still does.

Plame sent out an internal CIA memo saying ''my husband has good relations with both the PM [prime minister] and the former Minister of Mines (not to mention lots of French contacts), both of whom could possibly shed light on this sort of activity.'' A State Department analyst told the committee about an inter-agency meeting in 2002 that was ''apparently convened by [Wilson's] wife, who had the idea to dispatch [him] to use his contacts to sort out the Iraq-Niger uranium issue.''

[Mulholland]

[techweenie]

Originally posted by fintstone
Most of your "points" have no point.

So you think yellowcake is a WMD?!

Wow.

I have a bridge to sell you.