Conservative Beliefs

Superman · 07-22-2004, 03:19 PM

Hey guys, you know me. I don't like to call names and belittle people and I think I am generally fairly respectful. It is with a full measure of respect (and substantial sense of humor) that I pass on the following remarks I received in an email. Hey, if we cannot laugh at ourselves, then who can we laugh at. Each other, I guess but that's not my point either. I'm not laughing at you, but rather I am laughing with you. All of you who are laughing, anyway:

Things you have to believe to be a Republican

MOST IMPORTANT BELIEF: Saddam was a good guy when Reagan armed him, a bad guy when Bush's daddy made war on him, a good guy when Cheney did business with him, and a bad guy when Bush needed a "we can't find Bin Laden" diversion.
Closely followed by:

Trade with Cuba is wrong because the country is communist, but trade with China and Vietnam is vital to a spirit of international harmony.

The United States should get out of the United Nations; but our highest national priority is enforcing U.N. resolutions against Iraq.

A woman can't be trusted with decisions about her own body, but multi-national corporations can make decisions affecting all mankind without regulation.

Jesus loves you and shares your hatred of homosexuals and Hillary Clinton.

The best way to improve military morale is to praise the troops in speeches while slashing veterans' benefits and combat pay.

If condoms are kept out of schools, adolescents won't have sex.

A good way to fight terrorism is to belittle our long-time allies ("that's old Europe") then expect their cooperation and money.

Providing health care to all Iraqis is sound policy. Providing health care to all Americans is socialism.

Global warming and tobacco's link to cancer are junk science, but creationism should be taught in schools.

A President lying about an extramarital affair is an impeachable offense. A President lying to enlist support for a war in which thousands die is solid defense policy.

Government should limit itself to the powers named in the Constitution, which include banning gay marriages and censoring the Internet.

The public has a right to know about Hillary's cattle trades, but George Bush's driving and military records are none of our business. Nor are Dick Cheney's task force discussions with energy industry our business either.

Being a drug addict is a moral failing and a crime unless you're a conservative radio host. Then it's an illness and you need our prayers for your recovery.

What Bill Clinton did in the 1960s is of vital national interest, but what Bush did in the 1980s is irrelevant.

Mulholland · 07-22-2004, 03:22 PM

It is manipulative and misleading at its very core...It is disinformation.

techweenie · techweenie's Garage

Supe: I don't think those opinions appliy to all Republicans, just the Neocon fringe.

But I do believe I've seen just about all of those points expressed in OT in just the past 6-7 weeks. Hmmmm... what else has changed here in the past 6-7 weeks...?

CamB · CamB's Garage

This one cracks me up:

A woman can't be trusted with decisions about her own body, but multi-national corporations can make decisions affecting all mankind without regulation.

I'm in favour of regulating both

Aurel · Aurel's Garage

Haha ! I wish I had come up with those. It is 100% true, despite what Mullholand can claim. When it is not a lie, it is manipulative disinformation. LOL...Mul cracks me up

Aurel

ronin · 07-23-2004, 12:53 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CamB
I'm in favour of regulating both

interesting twist. cool

turbo6bar · 07-23-2004, 06:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by techweenie
Supe: I don't think those opinions appliy to all Republicans, just the Neocon fringe.

Agreed. I do believe there are some Republicans who believe all points are true, but I disagree with most of those statements, even if they are supposed to be humorous.

304065 · 07-23-2004, 06:23 AM

Superman: the trouble with just blindly forwarding emails is that you end up passing on a lot of garbage that doesn't contribute to the debate.

What you have posted is a collection of non-sequiturs: things that are not logically juxtaposed, or even related to the same fundamental issue.

If you want to debate reproductive rights, then why don't you take a position, one way or the other, about the constitutionality of Roe v. Wade. We can go back and explore the preceding cases like Griswold v. Connecticut, talk about the "penumbra rights doctrine," go all the way back to early theories of "quickening" to try and identify the fundamental issue that divides our thinking.

If you want to debate increased regulation of MNC's, with regard to labor practices, environmental policies, the "Sullivan Principles" or outsourcing of manufacturing jobs, why don't you thoughtfully do so?

If you want to attack Christianity, or the Catholic Church's views with regard to birth control, you are free to do THAT, also.

Let me clue you in to something else: the real reason that Limbaugh became, and remains popular, and you aren't going to like this, is that he is FUNNY! He makes fun of the STRIDENCY, the self-righteousness, the omnipresent morality and foibles of the Left!

If you tune in, you will find that most of what he says is intended to AMUSE! (And don't tell me you guys don't tune in. You KNOW you tune in.)

But this list of non-sequiturs, well, it's just a reiteration of the same old "Bush Lied" stuff, not particularly thoughtful, and not FUNNY, whether I agree with the intent or not!

widebody911 · widebody911's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by john_cramer
He makes fun of the STRIDENCY, the self-righteousness, the omnipresent morality and foibles of the Left!

YOu had me suckered in; I thought you were serious until this point

The list is a nice summation of conservative values, plain and simple. No need to debate them in the context of the list - they've been debated ad nauseum everywhere else.

Republicans are vampires; they can't see themselves when you hold a mirror up to them.

Moneyguy1 · 07-23-2004, 08:27 AM

"Change nothing, unless, of course, the change results in higher profits"

dtw · 08:31 AM

Saddam was a good guy when Reagan armed him, a bad guy when Bush's daddy made war on him, a good guy when Cheney did business with him, and a bad guy when Bush needed a "we can't find Bin Laden" diversion.
Closely followed by:

Sorta like slick Willy would toss a few Tomahawks at bin Laden whenever he had a grand jury coming up?

Trade with Cuba is wrong because the country is communist, but trade with China and Vietnam is vital to a spirit of international harmony.

Clinton moves to tighten sanctions on Cuba, in his efforts to "build democracy" (sound familiar??)
http://www.cnn.com/US/9607/16/cuba/
Sanctions are first imposed on Cuba under the Kennedy (D) administration:
http://www.treas.gov/offices/eotffc/ofac/sanctions/t11cuba.pdf

The United States should get out of the United Nations; but our highest national priority is enforcing U.N. resolutions against Iraq.

Too generalized and inflammatory to bother with. I'm not sure that the majority of Republicans believe we need to exit the UN, but I personally think it needs a serious wake-up call.

A woman can't be trusted with decisions about her own body, but multi-national corporations can make decisions affecting all mankind without regulation.

Cramer beat me to it. I will go toe-to-toe with you on this any day, but please don't generalize or twist my beliefs on abortion without presenting a real argument.

Jesus loves you and shares your hatred of homosexuals and Hillary Clinton.

Best part is, even if you're an atheist (or worse, Hillary Clinton), Jesus loves you too. Now then, couldn't I just turn around and say "Ellsworth Toohey loves you, and shares your hatred of Christians and George Bush"? Come on. Try harder.

The best way to improve military morale is to praise the troops in speeches while slashing veterans' benefits and combat pay.

Analysis of civilian vs. military pay under the Clinton administration: http://www.rand.org/publications/RB/RB7502/RB7502.word.html

I will agree that the veteran pension issue is a good topic for debate. But I just had a conversation with a colleague who is a military wife, and she had nothing but praise for current trends in benefits and pay. Her husband is a NCO.

If condoms are kept out of schools, adolescents won't have sex.

Gross and offensive oversimplification. We want condoms out of schools because they have no place there. Parents aren't taking NEARLY enough responsibility for the sexual education of their children. You want "Under God" out of the Pledge of Allegiance? Fine. As soon as sex-ed and condoms are out, I'll consent to deleting your two little words.

A good way to fight terrorism is to belittle our long-time allies ("that's old Europe") then expect their cooperation and money.

Guess what: our entire country (including you) is belittled by a lot of liberal European nations. It's been that way since before Iraq. Incidentally, France started rolling around like pigs in ***** in rebuild contracts without any encouragement from us.

Providing health care to all Iraqis is sound policy. Providing health care to all Americans is socialism.

Iraq spent an estimated $20 million on health care in 2002 -- or about 68 cents a person, the Iraq Ministry of Health said. In comparison, the U.S. government spends more than $4,000 per person, federal statistics show. (source: cnn.com). Of the rebuilding funds allocated to Iraq, yes, ~$800M is dedicated to health care. Question: What's different from rebuilding Europe after WWII?? Regardless of administration, the US has a trend of coming to the aid of a populace after armed conflict. That you would twist this into a domestic healthcare jab is predictable but unfair.

Global warming and tobacco's link to cancer are junk science, but creationism should be taught in schools.

Poppycock. Erskine Bowles (R) is one of the leading members of a bipartisan effort in NC to effect a multi-billion dollar tobacco buyout. Here's a '98 speech which both gives a nod to the Clinton administration while underscoring the deadly effects of tobacco:
http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/1998/03/30/transcript/

I think you'll find most of us want creationism taught in our homes, and we want schools to stick to 'readin', 'ritin', and 'rithmetic'. Oh, and perhaps a good game of dodgeball (bean the weenie!!!)

A President lying about an extramarital affair is an impeachable offense. A President lying to enlist support for a war in which thousands die is solid defense policy.

What's the connection here? What's the pun? It's not even funny or clever. Yes, a President lying in sworn testimony is indeed impeachable. I'm surprised you didn't drag out the "war based on a lie" hack.

Government should limit itself to the powers named in the Constitution, which include banning gay marriages and censoring the Internet.

Gay marriage is already banned. We just don't want to overturn it. If you'd like to engage in discussion on gay marriage, start a thread. Internet censorship is a joke, and we ALL laugh at certain outdated extremists that continue to work to censor it.

The public has a right to know about Hillary's cattle trades, but George Bush's driving and military records are none of our business. Nor are Dick Cheney's task force discussions with energy industry our business either.

Completely POV. We could just as easily flip the roles back in the Clinton days. Yawn.

Being a drug addict is a moral failing and a crime unless you're a conservative radio host. Then it's an illness and you need our prayers for your recovery.

Cramer beat me to it.

What Bill Clinton did in the 1960s is of vital national interest, but what Bush did in the 1980s is irrelevant.

See above.

Funny: A colleague has a fishtank, and takes pride in naming all his fish. He has an algae problem in his fishtank of late, so last night he bought a couple of scumsucking fish to help control the filth. I of course asked what he named them. Response: "Bill and Hillary".

jm951 · 07-23-2004, 08:34 AM

Well, let's have a little equal time here for the other side-

TO BE A LIBERAL

To be a bona-fide card-carrying liberal, there are certain beliefs you must subscribe to:

You have to believe the AIDS virus is spread by a lack of funding.

You have to believe that the same overpaid public school idiot who can't teach 4th graders how to read is qualified to teach those same kids about sex.

You have to believe that guns in the hands of law-abiding Americans are more of a threat than nuclear weapons in the hands of the Red Chinese.

You have to believe there was no art before federal funding.

You have to believe that global temperatures are less affected by cyclical, documented changes in the brilliance of the sun, and more affected by yuppies driving SUVs.

You have to believe that gender roles are artificial but being gay is natural.

You have to believe that businesses create oppression and governments create prosperity.

You have to believe that hunters don't care about nature, but pasty, loony activists who've never been outside Seattle do.

You have to believe that self-esteem is more important than actually doing something to earn it.

You have to believe the military, not corrupt politicians, start wars.

You have to believe the free market that gives us 500+ channels can't deliver the quality that PBS does.

You have to believe the NRA is bad, because they stand up for certain parts of the Constitution, while the ACLU is good, because they stand up for certain parts of the Constitution.

You have to believe that taxes are too low, but ATM fees are too high.

You have to believe that Harriet Tubman, Cesar Chavez and Gloria Steinem are more important to American history than Thomas Jefferson, General Robert E. Lee or Thomas Edison.

You have to believe that standardized tests are racist, but racial quotas and set-asides aren't.

You have to believe conservatives are racists, but black people couldn't make it without your help.

You have to believe that the only reason socialism hasn't worked anywhere it's been tried, is because the right people haven't been in charge.

ronin · 07-23-2004, 08:42 AM

lol jm. now watch the liberals pots go into a tizzy calling the kettle black

dtw · 07-23-2004, 08:48 AM

Yeap, as long as we're meting out 'humorous' sweeping generalizations:

The division of the human family into its two distinct branches occurred some 10,000 years ago, a few hundred years after the flood, when human beings coexisted as members of small bands of nomadic hunter/gatherers.

In the pivotal event of societal evolution, beer was invented. This epochal innovation was both the foundation of modern civilization and the occasion of the great bifurcation of humanity into its two distinct subgroups: Liberals and Conservatives.

Once beer was discovered, it required a reliable source of grain, and that was the beginning of agriculture. Neither the glass bottle or aluminum can had yet been invented, so it was necessary to stick pretty close to the brewery. That's how villages were formed.

Some men spent their days killing animals to barbecue at night while they were drinking beer. This was the beginning of the Conservative movement.

Other men, who were weaker and less skilled at hunting, learned how to live off Conservatives by showing up for the BBQs every night and doing women's work like sewing, fetching and hair dressing. This was the beginning of the Liberal movement. Later, some of the Liberals actually became women.

Liberal achievements include the domestication of cats, invention of group therapy, and democratic voting to see how to divide up the beer and meat that the Conservatives provided. Women were not interested in democracy at that time because most of them were still women back then and the Conservatives fed them.

The largest, most powerful land animal on earth symbolizes Conservatives.

Liberals are symbolized by the jackass.

Modern Liberals like imported beer (they add lime), but most prefer white wine or foreign water in a bottle. They eat raw fish but like their beef well done. Sushi, tofu, and French food are on Liberal menus. Their women have more testosterone than the men. Liberals like deviant sex and want others to like it too. Their first successful city governments were Sodom and Gomorrah.

Most social workers, personal injury attorneys, college professors, journalists, and group therapists are Liberals. Liberals invented the designated hitter rule in baseball because it wasn't "fair" to make the pitcher also bat.

Conservatives drink domestic beer. They eat red meat, and still provide for their women. Conservatives are big-game hunters, rodeo cowboys, lumberjacks, construction workers, medical doctors, police officers, corporate executives, soldiers, athletes, and generally anyone who works productively outside government. Conservatives who own companies hire other Conservatives who want to work for a living.

Liberals do not produce anything. They prefer to "govern" the producers and decide what is to be done with the production. Liberals believe Europeans are more enlightened than Americans. That is why most of the Liberals just stayed in Europe when Conservatives were coming to America.

Conservatives have principles, believe in a Creator, and the rule of law. They practice charity and give to the poor, normally through their churches. When in doubt on an issue, they check both the Bible and the Constitution, which they use as a constant reference in a changing world. They believe in the concept of truth.

Liberals do not have principles, except for their dedication to stealing the production of Conservatives and undermining principled references such as the Bible and Constitution. They are never in doubt on an issue because they always do whatever is best for them at the time without regard to others. They have no standard of reference and are never consistent. Liberals do not give to charity. They cultivate the poor like a cat cultivates a field of mice. They use the poor as voters and give them a portion of stolen tax money, which they tax away from Conservatives.

Conservatives believe in self-defense, both at home and abroad. They own guns and use them to discourage Liberals and other common criminals. They provide guns to the armed forces to discourage foreign Liberals and other foreign criminals.

Liberals do not believe in Conservative self-defense. They disarm Conservatives, and then attack them with impunity using Liberal armies with guns. King George III, Stalin and Pol Pot were all Liberals who abandoned the rule of Law, had no principles except their own self-indulgence, and attempted to tax and govern Conservatives. Liberals believe in BIG government. They think the United Nations is the ultimate answer because it's the ultimate big government.

Conservatives believe in the rule of law and when sitting on juries, convict common criminals and acquit fellow Conservatives who have been charged by Liberals. When serving in the armed forces, they shoot Liberals from other countries who want to govern our country. Conservatives know the difference between a common-sense law and a bone-headed statute passed by some Liberal from Massachusetts. When sitting on juries, they do not enforce bone-headed statutes, and don't explain their reasons.

Liberals only believe in whatever laws appeal to them at the moment, such as the privilege of making a living by taxing Conservatives. When sitting on juries, Liberals convict producers and acquit Liberals and other common criminals. Liberal judges do not produce anything except chaos, and are paid by fellow Liberals with confiscated tax money. They consider it illegal to reference any source of law such as the Bible or Constitution. Like other Liberals, they just make it up as they go and do what is best for them. Judge Roy Bean is their model.

The American cowboy, of course, is your basic, full-bore Conservative. A hundred years ago, an Englishman visiting Texas was attempting to find the owner of a huge cattle ranch. He rode up to one of the ranch hands, and inquired, "Pardon me, but could you perhaps tell me where I might locate your master?" To which the cowboy replied, "That sum***** ain't been born yet."

So, what'll it be? Steak or tofu? Wine or Beer? Domestic or imported?

widebody911 · widebody911's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by dtw
Yeap, as long as we're meting out 'humorous' sweeping generalizations:

(snip)
Take 2 oxycontins and call me in the morning.

island911 · 07-23-2004, 08:54 AM

. What I read, as I read this. . .

Quote:

Originally posted by Superman
Hey guys, you know me. I don't like to call names and belittle people (so that's whats coming) and I think I am generally fairly respectful. (but enough of that) It is with a full measure of respect (and substantial sense of humor) that I pass on the following remarks I received in an email. Hey, if we cannot laugh at ourselves, then who can we laugh at. Each other, (get it out there with deniability) I guess but that's not my point either. I'm not laughing at you, but rather I am laughing with you. All of you who are laughing, anyway:(you're with me, or against me. . .but would make you an uptight jerk.)

Things you have to believe to be a Republican

MOST IMPORTANT BELIEF: Saddam was a good guy when Reagan armed him, a bad guy when Bush's daddy made war on him, a good guy when Cheney did business with him, and a bad guy when Bush needed a "we can't find Bin Laden" diversion. (limited to false choices, makes this funny ?)
Closely followed by:

Trade with Cuba is wrong because the country is communist, but trade with China and Vietnam is vital to a spirit of international harmony. (yeah, dem's don't trade with htese guys. . .they GIVE them rocket tech' .. )

The United States should get out of the United Nations; but our highest national priority is enforcing U.N. resolutions against Iraq.(funny, how?)

A woman can't be trusted with decisions about her own body, but multi-national corporations can make decisions affecting all mankind without regulation. (what company has no regulations? . . tho supe must like the dig on women not being trusted)

Jesus loves you and shares your hatred of homosexuals and Hillary Clinton. (what whack-job thinks that?)

The best way to improve military morale is to praise the troops in speeches while slashing veterans' benefits and combat pay. (isn't that a Kerry position --not funny, even then)

If condoms are kept out of schools, adolescents won't have sex.(no, they think that they'll have babies . . . ah, right, funny to think rep's are naïve)

A good way to fight terrorism is to belittle our long-time allies ("that's old Europe") then expect their cooperation and money. (talk about naïve)

Providing health care to all Iraqis is sound policy. Providing health care to all Americans is socialism. (who took away US healthcare?)

Global warming and tobacco's link to cancer are junk science, but creationism should be taught in schools. (what a lamb)

A President lying about an extramarital affair is an impeachable offense. A President lying to enlist support for a war in which thousands die is solid defense policy. (bla bla bla . . this is thread is lame)

Government should limit itself to the powers named in the Constitution, which include banning gay marriages and censoring the Internet.

The public has a right to know about Hillary's cattle trades, but George Bush's driving and military records are none of our business. Nor are Dick Cheney's task force discussions with energy industry our business either.

Being a drug addict is a moral failing and a crime unless you're a conservative radio host. Then it's an illness and you need our prayers for your recovery.

What Bill Clinton did in the 1960s is of vital national interest, but what Bush did in the 1980s is irrelevant.

ronin · 07-23-2004, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by widebody911
Originally posted by dtw
Yeap, as long as we're meting out 'humorous' sweeping generalizations:

(snip)
Take 2 oxycontins and call me in the morning.

I see you've already taken yours. hence your repeated inability to formulate a cogent reply

jm951 · 07-23-2004, 09:01 AM

I'll have a Bud and a med rare Tbone!

cowtown · 10:07 AM

The problem with all this stuff IMO is that it's casting way too wide a net.

Most people are conservative or liberal based on one or two very strong beliefs. Mine happens to be "small government that stays the hell off my back." So that makes me a conservative.

Most of that other stuff doesn't make it on the radar screen. So Superman, if your intention is to start an argument, looks like you got your wish.

If your intention was to make conservatives feel bad, it's not gonna work. I doubt you could find a single conservative on this board who goes along with everything in your list. Some of us are even pro choice, and yet we're still going to vote Republican. Sorry.

pwd72s · 07-23-2004, 10:00 AM

Dave? (dtw) Loved it! Thanks!