Dog Training, or how do I stop from killing them....

[Jared at Pelican Parts]

Ok, here's my situation. My roommate has two Labs that are completely untrained.. They dont listen to anything at all. They chew everything up, and they are just plain stupid.

My roommate got them when they were puppies. She basically just gave them treats and never thought to train them or correct them. It's a miracle they go outside to crap. They still piss ocassionally indoors. One of them keeps chewing things up. My roommate just keeps giving her chew toys.

I tried training them a bit. Teaching them to sit and did my best to give them the first correction they have ever had in their lives, but now because of my roommate's constant babying of them, the dogs just think im being mean and dont listen again..

They wake me up every morning at 2:30 AM with this damn whimpering that is driving me crazy. If I tell them to be quiet, they run out of the room, which leads me to think they were possibly abused by my roommate's ex-husband.

I had two Queensland Heelers when i was growing up and trained them fromt he time they were puppies and they were loyal and obidient. I am a dog lover, but this is just pitiful. What the hell am i doing wrong here? How do I teach old dogs new tricks? she wont train them, so it's up to me..

[campbellcj]

I feel for ya dOOd...have been exposed to many unruly, untrained pups and it's not pleasant for anybody involved (including the dogs) in most cases.

Many years ago we had a few private sessions with this guy: http://www.haggertydog.com/index.html and it was awesome but costly. The fact that he's a burly 7+ foot tall guy certainly seems to quell any dissent from the students...

The biggest advice I can offer is that "training" is 90% for the owner/handler and 10% for the animal. The owner needs to get a clue and control the situation, IMHO...

[cstreit]

Sounds like it's time for a meeting with your roomate. Failing that, new roomate. Not training Dogs is doing them a disservice IMHO.

[Jared at Pelican Parts]

I wish it were that simple.. Im the renter....

[DonDavis]

Jared, my man, it's a tough road for you. The OWNER has to be the one to make a real difference. You can find lots of things to do that may help, but, in the end their owner has to really make it happen.

"The Evans Guide for Housetraining Your Dog" and
"The Monks of New Skete, the Art of Raising a Puppy" are great places to start.

Good luck!

[stomachmonkey]

Often there are local training "clubs" that you can join for little or no money. Check with a vet or the local ASPCA.

Now, training a dog requires commitment, you can not give up, be patient, it does not happen over night, make small breakthroughs.

You need to think like a dog, ex: dog takes something it should not, you chase dog. Dog thinks "hey, whatever I've got must be great cause everyone wants it and boy is this a fun game"

Using their names with NO! as in "Fido, NO". Creates negative association with their name.

Right now the dogs think they are the alpha's in your pack. You need to change that.

Never let them through the door in front of you, they must always follow. Don't let them eat before or at the same time as you. Don't let them on beds.

Get them out and excercise the crap out of them. Kinda tough with labs as they are tireless but an hour swimming at the beach will calm em down some.

Good luck
Scott

[vash]

in my opinion, a lab is the toughest dog to train. very head strong, lots of goddamn energy...but on the other hand, they were bred to be very loyal and work closely with humans. my bro and i shared one. bishop. he destroyed the house, quiet time didnt work. he ate thru the drywall in minutes and showed up dusty and happy.

jared if you are gonna live there, and your roomate doesnt want to train them, you will have too. bishop destroyed a couch down to the wood frame. at that point my bro and i decided no more alone time for the damn dog. we put together a schedule, he was a cop and i was a student. bishop had one or the other the entire time. and he became the best dog we have ever owned. the single trick that seemed the help the most is to leash him when he did something bad. labs love to be with us. so when he acted up, we would leash him to something sturdy, he would yelp, cry, and try to get to us. pure ignoring him would make him crazy. he quickly learned that negative behavior earned him leash time. it worked fast. dont tell any SPCA types this trick, it is frowned upon. i got this book called "gun dogs" and it gave lots of tips to train headstong labs. just ignore the hunting sections.

cliff. lots of luck

[67nin11]

two word's.....shock collar. properly used it's the best $150.00 a dog owner can spend. and dont start that " its cruel" stuff, i tried it on myself and its not painfull just startling ...kind of like licking a 9v battery.

[Jared at Pelican Parts]

I've been trying to associate myself as the leader of the pack.. (both dogs are female by the way) It isnt easy. Just today, they rooted through the garbage and left a huge mess for me to clean up... I grabbed both of them and rubbed their noses in it.. I like my roommate, she actually the best roommate i've ever had. Gives me full use of her garage, and we get along quite well, but she doesnt get it when it comes to pets, you know?

Leashing is a good idea, but it doesnt work, as my roommate has babied them so much.. They just sit there and yelp and yelp and yelp, and they get even more anxious and chew up more stuff...

[86 911]

Jared,
My friend used clicker training, or positive reinforcement with her dogs. It really worked... except for one of her dogs that was nearly blind and deaf. Here is the link for clicker training: http://www.clickertraining.com/home/

By the way, my friend also told me that to get a dog to perform a trick (sit ,lay, etc.), use a treat to reward them with if they do the correct action. A couple of years ago, I taught my 2 year old Collie to do this. It did take about a half an hour, but now she knows how to sit, lay, and "shake your hand". I learned that to get a dog to lay down, you take one of their front feet out from under them, and push down on their neck, and that will make them lay. Then reward them with a treat. Do this repeatedly until the dog figures out what she has to do.

Matt

[john70t]

A lot of training is through basic association, good and bad. A bad deed such as jumping up/leash tugging should be immediately corrected firmly and consistently, and then followed by praise and reward for not doing it. You have to establish alpha dominance first. Dogs like high voices and close faces when praising and food is just representational, they most want to be an accepted part of the pack.
Bad behavior is through habits learned(i.e. one corner is o.k. to pee in), the sooner corrected the better. I think there are sprays to keep them out of areas and remove their previous territorial marks. Also, only smack with newspaper, never the hand, so the paper is doing the punishing not the owner.

Perhaps you could establish alpha by walking them individually with choke-chains. When they pull, give a quick jerk and harsh "heel", immediately followed by praise.

[vash]

jared. seriously leashing works. get earplugs and ignore them. once they settle down, even if it takes half and hours. pet and praise them and release the hounds. once they act up, leash them again and go thru it again. cayenne pepper, get the big arse container from costco and sprinkle liberaly throughout the garbage can. leashing taught our lab to develope an "inside" version of himself. it was amazing.. you let him out, and it was back to "turbo dog".

[cegerer]

Some really good advice here already. I'll second the idea of a 'shock collar'. BUT: it has to be used correctly along with lots of praise when they behave correctly. Otherwise, it could spark aggression in the dogs. I've used shock collars on 2 dogs. On each, it took a grand total of about 2 or 3 'shocks' and they were essentially trained for life on the basics of behavior. Compare that to other methods where weeks and months of training are required. It probably saved my dog's llife because he immediately stopped chasing cars and running in the road.

The intensity of the shock is adjustable. And - yes - I've tried it on myself! After a few drinks, on a dare ...... at settings under 5, it feels like a static shock. Above 5? I wasn't brave enough to try Anyway, when I use it on the dog these days, I only need set it at 2-3 and rarely have to hit the shock button. My voice is enough. .

This is the one I use:

http://www.innotek.net/store/product_info.php?products_id=21

[67nin11]

the collar i had would beep before the shock so after 2 or 3 shocks you only need to beep them and give a voice command, eventually using only voice commands.
during the three months my dog wore the collar she learned all the necessary commands (sit,stay,come, go lay down,no barking, and her boundaries) she was only shocked 4 or 5 times. the key is consistancy and lots of positive renenforcement.

[vash]

she shreaded a Christmas present for a kid. every thing was put away. she found them in a bag in the closet. sorta funny, it was a teddy bear. we left her for 30 minutes!

[asphaltgambler]

If the owner won't do anything, and the dogs are making your home life Hell, you'll have to invest some real effort, and a little time. Best advice. Cheap: buy a general obedience book and a book on that breed to learn what to do or more importantly what not to do. Pricey: Hire a good dog obedience person for a few hours with a couple of follow-up visits. It is 90% training the owner/handler, 10% dog.

I'm a dog guy, completely. My breed of choice and the only one I've had are Chow-Chows. Man, you want to talk attitude and stuborness?? Best description is cat brain; dog body. On a scale of 1-10 with 10 being the most difficult. Chows are somewhere around 23-25!! If I can train this breed (almost!) your deal should be a cakewalk.

Two basic things to remember. You are the Alpha male and the leader of their pack. You must demonstrate this in your stance and posture, not your voice. Two: Animals only understand ALWAYS and NEVER.