Seattle WA Info

[Craig 930 RS]

All really good advice. I've lived in the same 1-mile radius for 34 years - now in Kirkland. 4 miles from the 800lb. software gorilla Co ;-)

[island911]

Originally posted by Superman
. . .
My humble opinion. This is the first I have heard anyone defend the structural integrity of the viaduct structure itself. I don't doubt that the sea wall is falling down. Indeed, civil engineering is not about overcoming mother nature. It is about keeping her at bay for a limited time. It's not a question of whether a structure will fall. It's just a question of when.

Kind of like your mental acuity, then . .. It's not a question of whether it will fail. It's just a question of when.

SO, supe, you're going to argue that all the civil engineers say viaduct structural integrity is lacking?


. .. hmmm, they sure do let a whole lot of traffic cross each day.

I don't suppose those interested, coughcoruptpoliticianscough, in tearing-down the structure, would fire the first structural engineer who would dare say, 'the problem is in the foundation . . not the structure'

Besides, Gephyrophobia (Fear of bridges) sells well in the news, and gives a good excuse to TAKE more money.

btw, supe, how much waterfront does the Port of Seattle own down there? . . . something like 20 acres?

[Superman]

Here is a diagram of the problems thought to exist with the viaduct:



And here is a pic of the viaduct. It is a flattering pic. Other pics could be shown which would lead the viewer to believe that driving on it, or standing under it, is dangerous:



Here is a description, from the WSDOT website:

"Studies in the mid-1990s showed that the 1950s-era viaduct was nearing the end of its useful life. The viaduct’s age and vulnerability was apparent by crumbling concrete, exposed rebar, cracking concrete, weakening column connections, and deteriorating railings. In early 2001, a team of design and seismic experts began work to determine whether it was feasible and cost-effective to strengthen the viaduct by retrofitting it. In the midst of this investigation, the 6.8 magnitude Nisqually earthquake shook the Puget Sound region. The earthquake damaged the viaduct, forcing the Washington State Department of Transportation (WSDOT) to temporarily shut it down."

So, I wonder what is the best solution. At home, if I have to crawl onto the roof with a bucket of WetPatch in the rain each month, I consider just putting new shingles on. I wonder if the same physics, the same principles apply to publicly-owned structures. Most of us have learned that cheap is not necessarily less expensive in the long run. Is this only the case with stuff owned by families?

[Drago]

I vote this for biggest thread hijack of all time. Nice pic's though.

[Superman]

You're right about one thing, Island. My mental acuity is subject to erosion. No doubt. They say the memory is the second thing to go......

Yes, Port of Seattle owns property on the waterfront. Prime property for purposes like shipping. One of by most major concerns is the Port's apparent inclination to sell that property to developers, for the purpose of making it into highly expensive residential property with awesome views. The problem I have with that is that its value as shipping and commercial property is FAR FAR FAR greater than its value as housing high-rises, particularly when you consider the long term economic interest of the city and the state. And it just occurred to me that some folks might be surprized at my views on this. In this issue, commercial interests are king. Yes, Superman said that.

It looks like the sea wall is a major issue, and is almost doubtlessly the major contributor to the viaduct problem. But my other remarks remain. If the sea wall were a solid block of concrete sitting on bedrock, then we would have the option of patching the viaduct and using it a couple more decades. But I don't feel we have that option. And yes, it's probably largely because of the sea wall. But not entirely. The viaduct is cracking, exposed rebar, etc.

[Superman]

Oh, and I'm not passionate about public issues at all.

How about a peach with a wiener?