A Question For All You Woodworkers...

[rcecale]

Yeah, sure, collectively, this BBS knows more about Porsches than anywhere else in the world (Except for maybe Ferry himself...).

But, how much do "we" know about woodworking?

I know there are at least a few of you guys that either dabble in it as a hobby or maybe even are highly skilled and do it for a living. And of course, there are those who fall somewhere in the middle. I've spent my time around woodshops. Took the classes back in middle and high school, even. But my question for today is simply this...

What is the best way you have discovered/developed/learned to keep your sandpaper from loading up with gunk when you strip finished wood?

Without going into a lot of detail, my wife has talked me into removing all the trim from the doors and windows in our kitchen and breakfast room and refinishing them. Doesn't sound like too much of a task, I know, but geeze, wait till you hear the specifics.

3 wood panel doors - strip and restain one side each.
2 wood panel doors - strip and restain BOTH sides.
trim and casings around all 5 doors, strip and restain
9 windows 6' high x 3' wide, strip and restain all the trim and sills
60' of baseboard (including quarter round)
32' of chair railing.

Scares me just writing it all down!

The trim, chair-rail and baseboards are all easy enough. The trouble I'm having is on the doors. It looks like the PO of the house layered on a bunch of the Minwax Polycrylic stuff which has left drips and stuff all over the doors.

In trying to sand through it, it just seems to clog up my sandpaper. It gets these big clumps of what looks like melted glue in blotches all over it. Once these appear, the paper is pretty much shot.

I tried easing up as much as I could with the pressure I was applying to the sander, but it doesn't help much. I tried switching from my belt sander to my palm sander and that hasn't made any difference either.

I really don't want to go the way of using a stripper because it just seems so messy. sure, the sanding residue gets all over, but a quick pass with the shop-vac and it's all clean again. Nothing to discard but a bag of sawdust. With stripper, there's all that hazardous waste to consider.

So, anyhooo, anyone got any ideas?

Thanks for listening (reading) [/rant]

Randy

[rcecale]

Thanks for the advice, procon. Unfortunately, even though I really didn't want to go this route, it looks as though the stripper is the way I'll be going.

Randy

[Willem Fick]

Randy,

I agree with procon - go with stripper. Yes, it is a bit messy, but far quicker and more efficient than sanding.

The fumes are bad, so work either outside (weather permitting), or in a very well ventilated area. Stripper seems to work best when covered with plastic sheeting, as it prevents it from drying out - this is optional however! In a very short time, the paint will start bubbling away from the substrate, although you may find tat more than one application is required if you deal with many layers of paint.

Having scraped away all the paint, first neutralise the stripper residue with mineral spirits, allow to dry, and then sand.

You may find it very difficult to get every last bit of paint off with stripper only, and may have to resort to a nylon flapper wheel on a drill to get the stuff really clean.

Warmest regards!

Willem Fick

[928ram]

Randy,

When you start talking "layers", stripper is probably the best way to go. The mess may seem like alot but in the end I think that you'll save time.

As far as sanding, be sure to use coated abrasives if you aren't already, automotive app. abrasives seem to work a bit better in the anti-clog arena but you'll need to switch to the wood app. stuff as you get down to wood since the automotive stuff will leave stains.
As procon suggested, the eraser type sandpaper cleaner helps alot, another trick I use is to take 3-4 pieces of straight wire (I use old coat hangers), bundle them together at one end with masking tape, and use this to whip the bottom of the sanding pad when it gets loaded up. This method works suprisingly well on paper loaded up with bondo/auto paint.

Lastly I'll put in a plug for the Porter-Cable model 7336 sander, it's a 6" round pad variable speed random orbital sander; basically an electric version of the standard automotive DA sander. Awesome tool that should be purchased with both the sanding and the polishing kit and should be in the garage of every woodworker and car nut.

[RoninLB]

- I'd check out wood sealer before re-staining.
- I only use oil paint on moldings and doors.
- I like marine paints and sealers.
- I fine sand the last paint coat, then cut the final coat with about 25-50% marine Penetrol. Use a very good brush.
- I've found that Z-Spahr varnish has the deepest rich looking tint. vs crystal clears.

[VINMAN]

I agree with Ronin LB Z-Spar is definately the best varnish out there. only stuff i'd use on my boat.
One method I use to remove old layers of varnish is with a fine grade drywall sanding screen.
It wont load up like sandpaper will, when you get close to the wood switch over to sandpaper. If you go the stripper route, there are some citrus strippers that dont have as bad fumes.

Hey Ronin, where you the guy on here that has an old Ulrichsen Sea Skiff?

[RoninLB]

Originally posted by VINMAN

Hey Ronin, where you the guy on here that has an old Ulrichsen Sea Skiff?

yep. You gotta love boats to remember that one.. thx

[gaijindabe]

RC: The doors can come off easy enough.. How are you for pulling the rest of it off?

[Moses]

A good paint-grade raised panel interior door runs $150-200. MDF doors are less. I HATE using paint strippers. The door would have to be pretty special.

[Dantilla]

My advice? Sell the house.

I hate sanding. It would be quicker to replace the trim with new stuff. All new material would probably look more uniform when completed.

[WOODPIE]

Randy,

I'd start with a 40 grit belt, and use only the weight of the sander, or even hold up on it a bit, as pressure. When the belt clogs up, (and it will) change to another belt. The belt you have taken off will be hot, and if you allow it and the paint boogers to cool, they will crumble off easier. Take the cool loaded belt between your thumbs and fingers and roll it into a tighter radius than what it is presented with on the sander's rollers. The cold paint boogers should peel/flake off easily.

Move on to finer grits as you approach the wood's surface.

Having said all that, I think you still have a major PIA removing the finish that is on all the non-flat surfaces. Maybe your strategery should involve both mechanical and chemical elements.

And again, having said all that, I would personally replace, rather than refinish, all the items you mention, save for the windows. If I could ever justify and value my personal time highly enough, the windows would be outta there, too.

What do you have more of, time or money?

Ed

[rcecale]

Well, first of all, have to say thanks for all the replies. Looks like the consensus has me working the stuff off with stripper. I've got a gallon of some gel stripper that I'll start out with, but I'm sure I'll be needing more. And with all the work I have in front of me, it'll be a while before I get to fixing that no-starting issue on my p-car.


I've got some "before" pics I'll be posting pretty soon and will have to get some shots of the "in-process" and "finished" project. Hopefully the great advice I've come to expect from everyone here will continue to flow.

Randy

[Moneyguy1]

When you remove the trim, pull the nails through the back of the wood rather than push them back through the front.

For stripping, buy a good scraper and a heat gun. Strippers are available that are not hazardous to your lungs, but they react more slowly than the more aggressive ones.

It is far easier to replace the trim and door with new, given the value of your time.

I build furniture for a hobby and have done a considerable amount of refurbishing of houses over the years. Get help if you need it.

[SLO-BOB]

I've tried both the sanding and stripping method on doors. They both suck. I ended up sending the doors to have them dipped. I can't remember how much it cost, but believe me, it was well worth it. Basically you have to figure what your time is worth. To refinish a door from start to finish has got to take 6 hours. Factor in cost of materials and like Moses said-better off buying new doors. Or, do as I suggest and have them proffessionally stripped if the doors are high quality or hard to match with the rest of the doors in your house.

[rcecale]

Originally posted by Moneyguy1
When you remove the trim, pull the nails through the back of the wood rather than push them back through the front.

Bob, that's exactly what I've done. It just seemed a more natural way of removing them. Especially since the trim was installed using a nailer...of much of a head on them.

Already picked up a gallon of this stuff...



And...I definitely agree with you about it being easier to replace the trim and door than to actually do the work, but it's actually "the work" I'm looking forward to. I guess it's kinda like chopping wood, another favorite "passtime", there's just something that acts as a major stress releiver when I work with my hands like that. I may not be the most talented guy at it, but I sure do enjoy doing it.

Oh, as I promised, here are a few shots of some of the areas I'm working on. These were taken last year, around Christmas time.




Randy

[Moneyguy1]

I enjoy woodworking too, but have founf that working with new material can be just as rewarding and much less messy!! Although, an antique does come along every so often that begs to have a bit of TLC.

Just remember the old adage:

"Yup, this is my grandfather's hatchet. My dad replaced the head, and I just had a new handle made..."