Any of you guys own a hybrid?

[VaSteve]

I know you all own a bunch of non-P-cars. Anyone here own a hybrid? I just got one of the Honda Civics. Not a bad car, definitely not what I'm used to in terms of power - a little like being nuetered. After the Porsche, the clutch is so light... Plus I can leave it in gear to like 500 rpm without stalling, perfect for traffic.

I got the 5 speed and was able to hit 50.7 mpg over a 35 mile stretch of highway this morning. I guess I'm atoning for my 911's mileage.

I drove all the hybrids Prius, Insight, Escape (and the Golf TDI) before this purchase so if anyone wants information/impressions, I'd be glad to give them.

[Icemaster]

Wife is looking at the Escape....what were your impressions?

[VaSteve]

I drove the Escape on a really cold night. It was giving an erratic performance. It would drive OK, but shuddered like hell until about 10 min into the ride. There was either something wrong with this particular one or that's how they warm up. If so, scary.

It had a good size, I have a 99 Cherokee it would have replaced.

However, you couldn't get any feedback on what the system was doing (like with the Honda) unless you bought the optional Nav system for an additional $1500 or so. The leather had no seat warmers. I drove the AWD and it moved OK once the engine sorted itself out. CVT was smooth, but has the same problems as all CVTs - can't feel the gears shift to get that feeling of how fast you're going. (See my post on the Freestyle from a couple of month's back). Couldn't tow more than 1000 lbs.

The Escape operates like the Prius: electric only at stop and go speeds, which is different than the Honda so it gets better mileage in town than on the highway.

It was a "sort of" contender for us. I didn't want to buy another car, but the Jeep is paid for and has a proven track record. The erratic performance I experienced might have been that particular car (dealer's inventory was jammed up pretty good and he couldn't get one of the others out of the lot) but it really scared off my wife.

I bought the Honda to take advantage of the HOV lanes (in VA you can drive them until July 2006) and I save 30 min off a long commute. It's essentially an expensive experiment. If I don't like it, I'll rack up the miles on my Jeep again and sell the Hybrid. I was fearful of committing to the Escape b/c it was so much more expensive to compensate for what I was giving up.

[Icemaster]

Cool,

Thanks for the insight. I'm looking at replacing the wife's car, but I'm driving a '97 jeep that I really dont want to part with. She wants the SUV aspect, so far that's the only game in town for the hybrid. I've heard others are coming out, but the Ford is kinda in the lead at the moment as the sister in law is on the Ford payroll in Dearborn. That's even assuming that they'll make the Escape eligible for X plan.

Thanks for the comments.

[asphaltgambler]

Steve, are you looking for just an economy ride ??

[Rob Channell]

Make sure to check out the REAL mileage of these vehicles. The EPA numbers are inflated even more than on regular vehicles due to the way they are calculated. They basically measure emissions and use that to estimate gas mileage. A lower emission vehicle will get a higher EPA gas mileage rating.

They are interesting, though. I'd like to have the hybrid Panoz I saw race at Road Atlanta several years ago. It had electric motors at the corners that added extra torque coming out of the corners and went into generator mode to recharge the batteries on braking. It was a lot heavier than the regular Panoz and the batteries ran down before the end of the endurance race. The hot rotors at the end of the back straight was simply amazing.

[VaSteve]

Ice:

I might have been able to get the Escape on X plan as well (long story) but given our apprehension, we think the Honda worked better into our automotiev portfolio.

Asphalt:

A little of economy and I wanted to get in the HOV lanes to DC (where my current job is) and Alexandria (where my next job starting in two weeks is). I was taking the VRE, but had to leave 25 min before it left the station creating a 1:50 commute door to desk. I have trimmed at least 30 min each way. That's time I can spend with the baby, due April. I really wanted the Golf TDI, but you can't take it in the HOV lanes (I'm going to probably lose this priviledge next summer) and I found that Diesel was harder to find than I thought. You'da thunk in our area (Gainsville, Bristow) it would be easier to find Diesel for all those Pickup trucks, but you'd be wrong! Diesel was more expensive per gallon as well, which surprised me.

SoCal:

The Accord is very powerful. But, it's a V6, using the hybrid motor for performance enhancement. The Acccord is not allowed in the HOV Lanes in VA. I have two other powerful cars (BMW & Porsche) and it's a major step down. I think total HP is like 93. I bought the manual trans to save on mileage and I hate the CVTs. It's a good transmission, I can leave it in gear and get it to almost 500 RPM without a stall. I figure if I drove it like I drive the Porsche it would be better powered. With 300 miles on the clock, I'm still breaking it in as well as playing with getting the most mpg I can.

Rob:

My real mileage since last Wed when I bought it is 40 MPG overall and 45 for 1.5 round trip commutes. I only have 300 miles, so hopefully that will get a little better when it gets warmer and the Auto Stop feature starts kicking in. The dealer told me that winter blend gas will hurt the MPG as well. I was able to pull 50.7 mph on the way in yesterday mostly highway driving, but a little stop and go.

I like having the manual trans, I think that's what is making it worthwhile, even if I'm shifting at like 2200. The regenerative braking is pretty cool. You can also feel the generators come online when you lift off the gas. I was headed down a pretty steep hill with the car in gear and lifted....the car started slowing down (!) as I had the charge meter all the way in the green.

I think one of the nice things is that I won't be getting any speeding tickets in this car (not if I'm trying to get the best mileage ). My automatic BMW 325xi with an automatic trans is going to get me in trouble as it's so super smooth (and I alway end up doing 80) and it's real twitchy. In stop and go traffic, I know I'm going to rear end someone

[RickM]

I'm curious to see what it takes to DIY these early Hybrids 5-10 years from now.

Steve, What did you think of the TDI?

[VaSteve]

I really liked the TDI. I like VWs as a general rule, but have never owned one. I really beat on that car for the test drive. Which included spinning the tires off the lot (lot's of low end torque), curvy roads, runs up to 80 mph on a main street and a panicky stop. The salesman thanked me because he didn't get to go on testdrives like that often

Supposedly, the TDI engines will last 200K+ miles.

I liked that you could fold the seats down and it had a sunroof, plus other VW goodies. The Civic has better seats. Sorta sporty, for an econobox.

I don't know how difficult the Hybrid will be to wrench on. I think the gas engine is probably pretty simple. I intend to do the maintenance (oil, brakes) myself on this thing. I don't know if the regenerative brakes will require a different pad or anything. All the rest of it is supposed to be standard civic stuff.

[asphaltgambler]

For me, the ONLY reason to buy a hybrid is the HOV exemption. But I think that it expires in a year or two. Pretty d--m pricey too.

[Serge914]

My guess is that all cars will be hybrids in 5 to 10 years. I remember having the same discussion 20 years ago about fuel injection. It was more expensive, peoples were concerned about servicing them but they were getting better fuel economy.

I am looking for a used Prius for my wife, those with a lot of mileage are not that expensive.

[RickM]

Any TD hybrids on the horizon? Seems they would combine the best of both worlds.

[dd74]

At the LA Auto Show, Lexus displayed its hybrid SUV - the little SUV (I forget its name). But I was fairly amazed that the vehicle got 30+ in the city.

If I were buying, I'd take a look at the new diesels as well. Supposedly they're much more efficient and stronger. I hated those Mercedes Benz diesels - like the 300 D. Workhorses, no doubt, but polluters to the extreme. New diesels are much better; just take a look at how much smoke comes from the stack of a new Peterbilt, International or Volvo semi tractor.

As far as all cars being hybrid in 5 to 10 years? Doubt it. The manual transmission will disappear first IMHO.

[Serge914]

Well I dont think any of those hybrids can get a manual transmission yet.

[VaSteve]

Originally posted by Serge914
Well I dont think any of those hybrids can get a manual transmission yet.

Which hybrids, Serge?

dd74,

I drove that new E-class MB with the diesel. Wow! It had a ton of torque and was really fast and very quiet. The Golf sounded and smelled like a diesel by comparison.

[dean]

My father has a Honda Insight. I don't really like it. It is too small and reminds me of the CRX that I had and didn't like at all.

I just bought another Jetta TDI. I think they are great cars to drive. And it gets between 47 to 50 mpg. I run biodiesel in the warm weather. I have chipped the TDI's and they put out tons of torque.

The only problem with VW's is their reliabilty sucks.

[turbo6bar]

Originally posted by RickM
Any TD hybrids on the horizon? Seems they would combine the best of both worlds.

The Europeans are not pushing this due to high initial cost. High tech diesels and hybrid technology are singularly expensive. Coupled together, one may not recoup the extra cost via fuel economy. However, the possibilities are really exciting.

[VaSteve]

Originally posted by dean
My father has a Honda Insight. I don't really like it. It is too small and reminds me of the CRX that I had and didn't like at all.

I took out a used insight and reall beat on it. The power to weight ratio was probably better than the Civic, but it was still slow. The weird shape had terrible visibility. Combine the two in aggressive Northern VA driving and it didn't make sense. The price was really sweet, but it was compensating for a disaster of a car:

The inside smelled like it had been flooded and there was evidence of that by looking at the seats which had marks as if they soaked up a bunch of water. The mounting points were all rusty. The CARFAX checked OK....sold new in PA driving for a few years, then shipped to AZ and titled as a lease (?!?) and then sold a few months later and shipped back to MD. The dealer thought that maybe someone left the windows open and it got wet inside. I guess the trip to AZ was to dry out . Not a knock on the INsight, just a cautionary tale about how CARFAX doesn't show all defects.

[asphaltgambler]

If you were looking into this an older used Corolla or Accord with the smaller 4cyl is a very good choice. A) Great gas mileage B) Simple cars; easy to maintain C) Good value/$$ D) Proven reliabilty.

[singpilot]

I have a 2004 Toyota Prius. I love it.