Militants Display Pictures of Torn Qurans

[RickM]

I don't mean to be disrespectful but this is almost silly to me. If someone tore a bible up in a prison would it be an international news item and worth tens, hundreds or thousands of lives?

Perhaps I'm naive to the intesity of these peoples beliefs. Afterall they apparently carry copies of the quran around with them 24/7 as they all have them in prison......?

..and what are prisoners doing with camera cell phones in prison? Something stinks here.....Maybe the urine.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050608/ap_on_re_mi_ea/israel_quran

"JERUSALEM - The militant Islamic Jihad on Wednesday presented pictures of torn copies of the Islamic holy book, the Quran, claimed they were taken inside an Israeli prison and said soldiers were responsible for the desecration. Israel denied the charge and said the pictures were a fabrication.
...

The Islamic Jihad transmitted the pictures by e-mail to a reporter in the West Bank. They show two Qurans with torn pages. The militants said prisoners took the pictures with cellular telephones sent them electronically to militant leaders."

[skipdup]

Originally posted by RickM
Afterall they apparently carry copies of the quran around with them 24/7 as they all have them in prison......?

Nope. Remember how bad their captors are? They're the ones who provide the book.

[Sonic dB]

Just a piece of paper.

Same as the cloth of American flags that they burn over there.

[flyenby]

You cant disrespect the Quran, but they can dismember people, blow up things, I say F*CK the Quran. Treat them like they treat thier enemies.
Just because your a fanatic does not make it right..............

[Oh Haha]

What an'F'ed up religion. I still say blow the GD countries off the map and start over!




Oh, bring our troops home first.

[Aurel]

But...But I thought it was not a religion war...or is it?

Aurel

[Oh Haha]

Oil, religion, whatever.I am tired of us taking the crap for all of the world's problems. You want aid, help us with the effort in Iraq. No? Oh, I am sorry, we won't be sending an F'ing dime to your feed your dumba$$ anymore. Fight your own wars, on your own, with no help from the USA, MF'ers!!!

[Aurel]

Nobody asked the US to go to Irak, Really. These people never sent Bush a letter asking him to bring them democracy. They just hapened to have their sand on his oil. There are so many other places that would need democracy too...But now that this one is broken, YOU GOTTA FIX IT FOR CHRISSAKE !

Aurel

[Oh Haha]

Aurel--That's the problem. We can't just walk away now. We HAVE to finish the task. I f I were president, I would have told them to go fark themselves a long time ago.
I support our troops 100% but I wish the President would have waited for more concrete evidence besides the crimes that Saddam committed.

[Aurel]

It was not about Saddams crimes, terrorism or WMDs. Those are just pretexts, while the core of the problem is securing the oil supply which is vital for the wealth of the US economy. The reason why it is so vital is not only that it fuels the economy, but also because it guarantees the value of the dollar. See, the dollar has value only because the economy is running, and the economy can only run as long as it gets oil, and foriegn countries want to use dollars to buy oil. So, even without proofs, Bush would have invented other pretexts to invade Iraq.

The deal was simple: you give us your oil, we give you democracy, whether you like it or not. But that was without counting the fact that arabs are really crazy people...must be the heat.

Aurel

[red-beard]

Originally posted by Aurel
It was not about Saddams crimes, terrorism or WMDs. Those are just pretexts, while the core of the problem is securing the oil supply which is vital for the wealth of the US economy. The reason why it is so vital is not only that it fuels the economy, but also because it guarantees the value of the dollar. See, the dollar has value only because the economy is running, and the economy can only run as long as it gets oil, and foriegn countries want to use dollars to buy oil. So, even without proofs, Bush would have invented other pretexts to invade Iraq.

The deal was simple: you give us your oil, we give you democracy, whether you like it or not. But that was without counting the fact that arabs are really crazy people...must be the heat.

Aurel

If that were true, why didn't we just invade Venezuela? Closer. 1/2 our troops speak Spanish. They have more better oil. No Terrorists...

Nope. We invaded for the wrong reason, but created the right result. But we will never be appreciated. Never.

[Mule]

I had a muslim activist give me a koran once. I think I'm going to save some money on Charmin & just put it in the bath room. Will they hunt me down?

[Joeaksa]

Originally posted by flyenby
You cant disrespect the Quran, but they can dismember people, blow up things, I say F*CK the Quran. Treat them like they treat thier enemies. Just because your a fanatic does not make it right..............

But...But I thought it was not a religion war...or is it?

Aurel

If you take a really good look at Islam, its a very interesting religion. Mohammed went into the desert sometime in the 1400-1500's time frame and was never heard from afterwards. For a large part nothing has changed from that point forwards.

They profess to be a gentle religion and loving all people and other religions. Well kids, the truth be known, they then go on to say that Islam is part of all the other religions and thus none of the other religions are needed.

In Saudi Arabia, where the two holy cities of Mecca and Medina are located, no other religion is allowed to be worshiped, period. If you are found doing so your head is lopped off. We had Christian services there in the military compound but it was illegal as hell and we risked a lot to do so.

The Saudi's would not even allow us to have a bible in the country. Our bibles were smuggled in and covered with a camo cover and the outer boxes marked training manuals. Still have it in my nightstand and it reminds me what everyone had to go through in this country just to worship. And this was when we were fighting to save their A$$ from Saddam...

One last thing. Its often said that Islam wants to eliminate all other religions and anyone who practices any religion other than Islam. They you see various Islamic religious leaders deny this. Well... if you look in the Koran it says "death to infidel's" and then in another section goes on to state that "anyone who is not a Moslem is an infidel." Personally I could care less what religion someone is but feel that they should have the choice to worship as they please. The Saudi's and many of the Moslem's do not feel the same way...

I will leave it to everyone to decide their meaning of an infidel but after living and working in Saudi for 2 years I am not really excited about going back anytime soon. Anyone who does not think that this is a religious war needs to wake up and smell the cordite. With the bombings increasing around the world its only a matter of time if they continue to martyr themselves.

JoeA

[gaijindabe]

Originally posted by Aurel


The deal was simple: you give us your oil, we give you democracy, whether you like it or not....

Aurel

Yes, they "give" it to us at $50 something bucks a barrel...

[kach22i]

Originally posted by Joeaksa
Anyone who does not think that this is a religious war needs to wake up and smell the cordite. With the bombings increasing around the world its only a matter of time if they continue to martyr themselves.

JoeA

Wow JoeA, I have a new found respect for you. Thanks for sharing.

You seem to realize that the rest of the world sees the actions of the US government in a "religious context". Do you have any suggestions on how to change this?

What can we do?

Have we been drafted, baited and tricked into a 21st century crusade by Osama bin laden? Isn't that what he wanted all along?

[Mule]

Maybe, but there's an old saying of "be careful what you ask for, you just might get it."

[turbo6bar]

Wars over religion are nothing new. If it's not religion, it's political or racial. Wonder if Osama is even alive?

I'm with RickM. Why are prisoners carrying cell phones? Isn't isolation a characteristic of being in prison???

[cowtown]

Interesting post, JoeA. Thanks.

[Aurel]

Originally posted by gaijindabe
Yes, they "give" it to us at $50 something bucks a barrel...

This is exactly my point: dollars can be printed by the federal reserve. Not a problem. And if oil costs $50 a barrel, it costs that for everyone around the world, so this keeps the value of the dollar high.

When a country like China or Japan needs oil, they buy dollars by loaning money to the US governement. Remember that the US govt. has a 7.7 TRILLION DOLLARS debt, 44% of which is owned by foreign countries.

There was no need to invade Venezuela, because Venezuela is mostly selling its oil the the US, in dollars. But in the case of Iraq, Saddam had made moves to sell oil to Europe in Euros. If other countries in the middle east did the same, China and Japan would buy euros, not dollars. It is not about getting oil for free, it is about controlling oil supply, prices and currency for trade. There is a fine balance in the price of oil, where too high prices would choke the pace of the economy, but too low prices would choke the value of the dollar.

Sure it may seem like a war of religion, but this is the anecdotical part of the story, IMHO. Religion has always been used to get the crowds going...

Aurel

[creaturecat]

Originally posted by gaijindabe
Yes, they "give" it to us at $50 something bucks a barrel...

Actually the U.S. has taken control of the oil revenue (approx 16 billion USd per year). This arrangement was approved by the U.N.
This is considered one of the "spoils of war" from illegally invading Iraq.